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Thread: Redux: Install Emergency!

  1. #1

    Exclamation Redux: Install Emergency!

    Ok, I have set up this thread for the sake of keeping ALL install issues and discussions gathered in one single place (here), because they have a tendency to disrupt the regular proceedings of everything else. It’s not that I or the other “doctors” don’t want to help potential redux players out, it’s just that everything else should not be brought to a halt just because “someone” have install problems. It has been that way before and it is not fair to everybody else. With a specific thread for such problems we can avoid all that.

    I also want to make it perfectly clear to everybody who might have install problems, that it certainly does not have to be me that helps “you” out, there are a few friendly and able helpers/”doctors” around here at the redux-area and all these guys have my full confidence and so should anybody who are receiving their help have as well! These guys have been thru it all before so they do know the drill and if for some reason they don’t, they will tell “you” so up front. Also, remember to be polite to them, they have all earned that right and it is the least you can do to show your appreciation for the help you’re receiving! Also BEFORE you seek help for your install of redux be sure to read ALL the instructions available below and in other places (download area for instance). Make sure you that you have the VI-upgrade module as well if you plan to run redux upon VI/v.2.01…

    Finally, it might also be interesting for “you” to know that we so far prefered to work on an ASAP-basis here, so this will usually happen as fast as “you” allow it to be, don’t forget that.


    When requesting help for installs:
    • Always state what version you are trying to run. Is it v.1.1 or VI/v.2.01?
    • Always state how many MTW’s you might have already installed, if so how many?
    • Always state the EXACT INTENDED install path you have in mind. Usually it tends to be “C:\Program\Total War\Medieval - Total War” (default) but this could vary depending on which version you got. Gold- and Era-editions might have other default install paths. What is critical is that you state your INTENDED install path!
    • Always state were the redux files have ACTUALLY ended up if you know that. That info helps a lot you know!
    • Always try to be explicit, precise and clear in all requested information from the “doctors”. If you fail to be that it will only take longer time to get things up and running!
    • Always include the exact error messages if you get any. That will make things a lot easier for us to solve your case!
    • Always assume that you are expected to report the good news of WHEN (there is no other option) you have successfully installed redux and it is up and running! That way we all know that the case is closed! When that happens, this very thread is the place to do in. (Otherwise we would never had some really good news on this thread and that would simply be unbearable).


    Fast-check for successful installs:

    Inside the “Redux/Medieval – Total War”-folder (whatever you named it) there is an other folder called “Quickstart” if the install is successful there will be some files that contains redux in them, like: “xx_Redux_xxxxxxxxx.cgf” or something similar. If they are there the install is successful, if they are not, then your install have failed yet again.


    Here are some excerpts of interesting remarks and guides written on the subject so far:

    Quote Originally Posted by Axalon
    The Achilles special guide:
    ---------------------------------------------
    1. Decompress the redux material. (Again… That way it is certain you got all the files)
    2. Within that folder you get from doing that decompression you should have two folders:

    “Redux – Total War”
    “Redux Bonus Material”

    3. Copy the “Redux – Total War” to you desktop. And once you done that. Copy the name of this folder. Yes, “Redux – Total War”.
    4. Go to Program Files… Open it. Don’t know what you got on your PC, but somewhere in there, among the various folders you should be able to find a folder named “Total War”. (This is utterly based on your posted information).
    5. Locate that folder…
    6. Open this folder named: “Total War”.

    Now if everything is correct you should only find one single folder in there. This folder is called “Medieval - Total War” or “Medieval Total War” again this is based upon the info you posted in. The dash is really important actually.

    Regardless, right click on this single folder, and check “change name”, yes as in change the name of that folder. Once the letters of that folder are marked/activated/darkened, press “Ctrl+V” on the keyboard or “paste” with the mouse. Whatever works best for you. Regardless, the result of doing this should end up in “Redux – Total War”. This is exactly the same name that the copied folder on the desk top has. And it must be!

    7. Now copy the “Redux – Total War”-folder on the desktop and let it replace and overwrite the other “Redux – Total War”-folder, the one found in “Total War” (the one you changed name on). Let it overwrite and do all its stuff. Wait until it’s done.
    8 Open up the newly replaced “Redux – Total War”, which is placed in the “Total War”-folder as in:

    “C:/Program Files/Total War/Redux – Total War”

    Go to “Quickstart” check for redux files… If any are there, the installation is successful. If you can't find any files that contains redux in them, the your installation have failed yet again. But this is the way you do it. So do it again step 1-7, exactly according to the above instructions.
    Quote Originally Posted by Baron von Manteuffel
    Right click on the redux file that you renamed Medieval - Total War, copy it, then paste it in your Local Disk C/Program Files/Total War. Let it overwrite and it should work.
    Quote Originally Posted by William the Silent
    If dropping the whole "Redux Total War" enchilada doesn't do the job, I would unzip the mod file (somewhere).
    1. "Select all" the files from inside the "redux Total War" file (see top "Redux - Total War" window in picture).
    2. Then do "copy"
    3. Then go to your MTW installation.
    4. Go inside "Medieval Total War" file (see bottom "Medieval - Total War" window in picture).
    5. Do "paste" and:
    6. Boom!
    7. There you go (hopefully).
    Quote Originally Posted by Joh
    I will just focus on the red model (the one I used). I am talking by heart, but I think I will get it right. On a side note, adding unmatched memory to your existing RAM can make unrar process unstable/unreliable. So, if you have recently partially upgraded your RAM, go back to your original configuration.

    Anyway, here is the list.
    • Install MTW
    • Patch to 1.1 I believe
    • Instal VI (optional, but you will get improved stability)
    • Patch to 2.01 (of course, only if VI has been installed)
    • Select your Medieval - Total War folder, copy and paste it without leaving directory/folder. There should appear a "Copy of Medieval - Total War" now. This way, you have a fresh copy and do not need to reinstall everytime you mess up. Additionally, you can have multiple mods (Remember to copy your copy before modifying it though).
    • Now, rename your original Medieval - Total War, to Redux - Total War. So now you can see a Redux - Total War and a Copy of Medieval - Total War.
    • Unpack Redux where ever you want. You will get a Redux - Total War folder.
    • Select the unpacked Redux - Total War folder and copy it. Two options: Ctrl+C, or mouse right click and Copy.
    • Go to your folder where you can see both Redux - Total War and Copy of Medieval - Total War. Paste the folder you copied in the previous step (unpacked Redux - Total War). Again, two options: Ctrl+V or mouse right click and then paste. It should tell you that there is already a folder called Redux - Total War and that pasting could damage it. Say yes, or overwrite or what ever the message is. If it does not tell you anything, you are doing something wrong.
    • ***EDIT*** Do the above for both Redux 1.0 and Redux VI upgrade (OK, my memory failed me. What's up?, I am just an old man)
    • You are done. Now let's start the game. Go to your Redux - Total War folder and double click on the .exe file you have there. Do NOT tell me you do not have an .exe file, it is there.
    • Does Redux start fine? Yes: HURRA!!!!; No: you are SCREWED.
    • Now, I am assuming it did start but you do not want to have to look for the .exe file all the time. Well, go to your desktop, mouse right click, select new and then shortcut. Browse until you get to the .exe file in your Redux - Total War folder. Name it Redux, or whatever you want. Now you can start the Redux from the desktop, or you should be able to.
    • Last step for real pickies (aka nerds like myself). I do not like having the same launch icon for normal/vanilla Medieval - Total War and Redux - Total War. No problem. Download this EXCELLENT and FREE image managing program (Irfanview, from http://www.irfanview.com/), install it, and start it. Now go to the first post of the thread, right click of the first image and select copy. Go to Irfanview, Edit and then paste. The picture should be on the canvas now. Left click and hold making a box around the beautiful Medieval - Total War - Redux letters there. Select Edit and then Crop selection. Almost there. Select File - Save as. Now, as "Save in" you browse to reach your Redux - Total War folder (make sure Redux - Total War is part of the path in the "Save in" line, that is, you are saving this image inside the folder). For the "File name" field, I do not care, but something like ReduxIcon. IMPORTANT now, for "Save as type" select ICO - Windows Icon. Make sure this new file is inside Redux - Total War folder.
    • Finally, go to your desktop and mouse right click on your Redux shortcut, Properties, Change Icon..., Browse... until you find your new ReduxIcon. DONE, now you have a beautiful icon for your nicely working Redux - Total War.
    Quote Originally Posted by Axalon
    Red-model only possible error-scenario:
    ------------------------------------------------------
    You have not reduxed your game enough. As in you have only installed the files from MTW-Redux 1.0b and NOT the VI-upgrade 1.0 afterwards. This is a must in order for the game files to work properly. Remember, v.2.01 and v.1.1 are structurally very different and thus will not work with each other. Hence the game will not start, because if you put the folder in a wrong place you would have got a start up with plain VI.

    You should have gotten this error message then:
    ------------------------------------------------------
    “COLUMN_building_faction_association

    Unknown faction specified: column 20, row 8

    NOVGOROD”

    ------------------------------------------------------
    If you had one of these you are doing things right, but you just are not doing it enough. So what you need to do here from that point on is to also install the VI-upgrade in very same manner as well… After you installed the files from MTW-redux 1.0b (because the VI-upgrade files must overwrite all the v.1.1 files from MTW-redux 1.0b). Then it will work.


    Blue-model only possible error-scenario:
    ------------------------------------------------------
    You have not pasted the redux files in the right place and thus they have not been allowed to overwrite and replace existing original VI-files. They must be allowed to do so in order to function at all. If you paste the files in a wrong place you can only get plain VI. Hence you have pasted it somewhere else (and, if you pasted correctly but only pasted files from ”MTW-Redux 1.0b” you should have gotten the very same error message mentioned above. Once you get that message you are on the right track! Believe it or not! Once you have that message then also paste in the files from the VI-upgrade in the exactly same manner and then it will work.

    Hopefully the combined info of these posts will enable “you” to solve all problems on your own. If it for some reasons it still doesn’t work out for you by all means call the emergency and post in your case here and a certified redux “install-doctor” will be on his way! Just hang in there! We’ll get it sorted, we always do…


    - A

  2. #2
    Camel Lord Senior Member Capture The Flag Champion Martok's Avatar
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    Default Re: Redux: Install Emergency!

    Okay, I seriously don't know what I'm doing wrong here:


    I installed MTW with the 1.1 patch no problems. I downloaded and extracted the Redux TW files. I renamed the Redux folder to Medieval - Total War (and yes, I copied it *exactly*). I then copied the folder and pasted it into the original Medieval - Total War folder [right-click on folder icon --> Paste]. I started up the game using the .exe icon in the folder.

    Yet when I fire up the game, I'm getting just plain MTW v1.1. There's no sign of Redux anywhere.
    "MTW is not a game, it's a way of life." -- drone

  3. #3

    Default Re: Redux: Install Emergency!

    Quote Originally Posted by Martok View Post
    Okay, I seriously don't know what I'm doing wrong here:


    I installed MTW with the 1.1 patch no problems. I downloaded and extracted the Redux TW files. I renamed the Redux folder to Medieval - Total War (and yes, I copied it *exactly*). I then copied the folder and pasted it into the original Medieval - Total War folder [right-click on folder icon --> Paste]. I started up the game using the .exe icon in the folder.

    Yet when I fire up the game, I'm getting just plain MTW v1.1. There's no sign of Redux anywhere.
    Maybe this is what went wrong:
    You should not copy the (renamed Redux folder) MTW IN the original MTW folder, but ON TOP of it.
    Last edited by William the Silent; 11-24-2008 at 11:17.

  4. #4

    Default Re: Redux: Install Emergency!

    Hi guys,

    Dr. William: It seems you beat me to it, are you starting your shift early today?

    I wrote my "diagnose" unaware that my esteemed fellow install-doctor already had forward his. At any rate, I offer more of the same (just to be on the safe side) and for the sake of synergy.

    Now correct me if I’m wrong Martok….

    • You installed MTW 1.1 at this place: “C:/Program Files/Total War/Medieval – Total War” - as in default install, right?
    • You have tried to use the red install-model right?
    • According to you, you have put the renamed “Redux - Total War” (now named “Medieval – Total War”) into the regular “Medieval – Total War”-folder, right? As in this:

      “C:\Program Files\Total War\Medieval – Total War” Right?

      Now try to paste in another renamed folder here instead (using the red install-model):

      “C:\Program Files\Total War\Medieval – Total War”

    • Now you get the question if you want to replace the already existing one or something like that. Just select the “Yes to all” option and let the stuff do its thing. Once it’s all done, start up the game using the .EXE again, yes the one inside the “Medieval – Total War”-folder you just “replaced”. Now the game should be different, right? He he…

      As for the lost folder from the first attempt; look inside the “Medieval – Total War”-folder, look at the existing folders there. One of them is named: “Medieval – Total War”, right? That’s the one that “disappeared”…


    Start up the game and have a first look at the reduxed MTW, and don’t forget to close this case by posting a confirmation that the case actually is closed, right here.

    Now, do I dare say; happy gaming?


    - Cheers
    Last edited by Axalon; 11-24-2008 at 12:15.

  5. #5
    Camel Lord Senior Member Capture The Flag Champion Martok's Avatar
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    Default Re: Redux: Install Emergency!

    Boo-yah! I got it up and running.


    Quote Originally Posted by Axalon View Post
    “C:\Program Files\Total War\Medieval – Total War” Right?

    Now try to paste in another renamed folder here instead (using the red install-model):

    “C:\Program Files\Total War\Medieval – Total War”
    Yep, that was the key all right. I was pasting Redux into the former folder instead of the latter.


    Now I just paste the Superfix and the Spanish fix to the same place, right?
    "MTW is not a game, it's a way of life." -- drone

  6. #6

    Default Re: Redux: Install Emergency!

    Hell yeah! Excellent news!

    Yes that’s right Martok, first Superfix and then Spanish Fix. The vital key to all reduxes upgrades are to install them in the right order and thus allowing them to, if necessary, overwrite the previous install. Now, as we are talking about running redux upon MTW v.1.1 here the importance of Superfix is dependent on which version of redux you got at home. Is it the older 1.0 or the 1.0b? The superfix will only do you any good if you got an older 1.0 copy, since it actually upgrade things to 1.0b (If you are uncertain, just install it anyway but it MUST be before you install the Spanish fix). At any rate, the install order must look like this:

    1. Medieval Total War 1.1 (fresh copy)
    2. MTW-Redux 1.0b (or equivalent)
    3. Spanish Fix (A)


    For anyone who plans to use the VI-upgrade, the install order must then look like this:

    1. Medieval Total War 2.01 (fresh copy)
    2. MTW-Redux 1.0b (or equivalent)
    3. VI-upgrade 1.0
    4. Spanish Fix (B)


    Ok, case closed…

    Lastly and to my personal delight; I can finally welcome you to the little world of redux.
    May you have many fun adventures and great battles there. Happy fighting!

    - Cheers

  7. #7
    Camel Lord Senior Member Capture The Flag Champion Martok's Avatar
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    Default Re: Redux: Install Emergency!

    Thanks Axalon! Yeah, I have the 1.0b version, so I went straight to the Spanish fix and installed it.

    I do have one (very) minor issue: It locks up whenever I exit Redux, to the point that I have to restart my computer. The only way I can safely end the game is to use Ctrl+Alt+Delete. It's not a big deal (I have the same problem with Shogun), but I was curious if anyone else has experienced this as well.


    Otherwise, though, it's working like a charm.
    "MTW is not a game, it's a way of life." -- drone

  8. #8

    Default Re: Redux: Install Emergency!

    I'm having mysterious difficulties installing Redux.

    I (re)installed basic MTW, then Viking Invasion, then the patch. So far so good. At this point the game works fine (2.01). I make a copy of the MTW folder and try to install Redux.

    No dice. I get the "Unknown faction specified: column 20, row 8" error message.

    I've already tried Redux on a different computer. It worked. I'm using the same Redux files on this computer and installing it the same way. I am confident that I have copied the files correctly, in the right order.

    1. Medieval Total War 2.01 (fresh copy)
    2. MTW-Redux 1.0b (or equivalent)
    3. VI-upgrade 1.0
    4. Spanish Fix (B)

    The folder is D:\Medieval - Total War.

    Any advice? Could the installation folder matter?

  9. #9

    Default Re: Redux: Install Emergency!

    Hello there Cold steel, (I’ll do the pleasantries in the other thread, here we do biz )

    That message seems strangely familiar to me. I have almost certainly seen it somewhere before. I have no ultra-certain answer for you at this point – but I actually think that you probably have missed out on some of the part in the installation somewhere. Possibly it is the 2.01 patch and that you only have 2.00, then this might be the message you get. So, to be really certain here this is what I think you should do:

    1. Medieval Total War 2.01 (Fresh copy)
    I suggest that you make a backup copy of that to save time if something goes wrong later on (anywhere you want it). That way you don’t have to install it all over again. However, it is absolutely critical that you make sure it really is a fully patched 2.01 version and it must be fresh (just to be safe here). Check your top left corner in front-end, it shows the version number there.

    2. Prep your redux folder
    As in copy the MTW-Redux 1.0b, patch that up with VI-upgrade 1.0 and after that you also patch it up with Spanish Fix (B). Make sure that it is properly applied here, so all redux stuff is applied and placed in this single folder and make sure of the order and that you don’t forget any of them. All three components then in one single folder. And be sure to have the exact name for the folder so you really replace the stuff that needs to be replaced when you do step 3. It’s same old, same old, but you must do these things right I’m afraid, otherwise redux won’t happen.

    3. Now do the install routine
    So, Blue or red-model, whatever you prefer - wherever you might have placed your Medieval Total War 2.01 install that is supposed to be reduxed. It should not matter where it is or which drive it is located. I use D:\ myself actually.

    4. Start up the game
    It should work now. Be sure to use the right .EXE as indicated in the “fools guide” when you start. That should do the trick here....


    ------------------------------------------
    As always, please verify here that things have worked out for you so we can put the matter to a close.

    - Cheers and good luck!

  10. #10

    Default Re: Redux: Install Emergency!

    1. It's definitely 2.01. Top left corner confirms it.

    2. Done.

    3. Done.

    4. Done. Doesn't work.

    "COLUMN_building_faction_association

    Unknown faction specified: column 20, row 8

    FN_NOVGOROD"


    (Note the "FN_NOVGOROD". If I just install 1.0b I get an almost identical message, but it reads "NOVGOROD" instead. Once I copy in the VI update it changes to FN_NOVGOROD. Minor difference, but could be a clue perhaps?)

    I downloaded the Redux files again, just in case they'd somehow gotten corrupted. Didn't help.

    I've done some random checking comparing files in the (original) Redux folders with those in the should-have-been reduxed MTW folder, and every file I looked at had been correctly copied.


    (I'm afraid I'm going to give up at this point unless you have any promising ideas.)

  11. #11

    Default Re: Redux: Install Emergency!

    Hi again Cold Steel,

    We are not quite there I think, as in it is warranted that you give up. You wanna play so we will make it happen. Your error-message is hardly unique. There is references on how and what to do are found in the first post in this thread. See if you don’t get any wiser on this from that.

    Others have had the exact same message while trying to install VI-version of redux, when in fact they have only installed 1.0b – then they have gotten exactly that error message. Thgee are no XL around either? It has an history to foul things up for you while trying to run other versions. Nothing that kind is involved here. Because I cannot belive that your copy of redux is unique or flawed twice out of some 300 users that downloaded exact same files. It is just unrealistic to even consider such extreme exceptions. No Steel, some thing is fishy here and what seems even stranger is that you claim that you got it to work on one PC and now you can't get it to happen on an other – that does support MTW – at that.

    Something is very wrong with this picture and I am sad to say it - but in lack of better information available to me here - I simply must assume that it is a human error. Which strikes me as ridiculous since you claim that you actually get it to work on another PC, but I have little alternatives to go here because of the error-message you have reported in here. I would also recommend you to decompress the redux files once again so you can absolutely certain ALL files actually are there which are a must. It is imperative that they are allowed to overwrite the regular gamefiles.

    Now, if disaster strikes and stuff still does not work you have 3 other possibities before it is time to even considering to give up here.

    1. Transfer the functional game over to the PC where you want it. Either by DVDs or routing the game thru a network or some other way.

    2. Just install MTW 1.1 (fresh copy) and simply and only apply the basic redux package. I that works you then can download the Spanish fix for that version later. It is almost the same game you know – however it is less stable so you have to "master-save" more often.

    3. Play the game on the other PC - if it I close and nearby that is.


    If nethier of these workes, then you could start concidering giving up. However, I have consistent the feeling that there are some component missing or misplaced otherwise you should not get this (by other users) identified error-message. It is charted and it will only come up under certain circumstances and those are highly limited. So I think you should keep at it. Possibly even sleep on it, and then have go at it again with a fresh head so to speak….

    Out of several hundred users you would be the first one that we could not solve and I would hate to have that happen. Besides, I firmly believe that this is fixable, we/you have not just figured it out yet. I’m confident that If I was there with you, we could have had all this up and running in less than 5 min. The files work, they just must be applied correctly and that is probably our problem. I sorry for repeating myself here but your reported error-message sure do limit our possible scenarios.

    Hopefully something out of my pointers here are useful for you. If you at some point actually do decide to give up please notify me here so I can close the case. Same goes if you are succesful - which course is what we are aiming for here, Ok? I sure hope for the good news here....


    - Keep at it and good luck
    Last edited by Axalon; 01-14-2009 at 23:57.

  12. #12

    Default Re: Redux: Install Emergency!

    Playing Redux on the other PC is not really an option. It's in my parent's house in a different part of the country. At least I'll have something extra to look forward to the next time I visit.

    I'm not going to try Redux with basic MTW 1.1. It would take more work, it still may not start properly, and I hate unstable games.

    As for what could be wrong:
    Please trust me when I tell you I copied everything correctly, in the right order. That is not the problem.

    The error message changed subtly when I copied over the VI update/spanish fix. NOVGOROD became FN_NOVGOROD. So it wasn't the exact same message.

    I've tried to come up with something that's different with this computer compared to the other one, but I can't think of anything that could realistically be important.

    Still:
    XP Professional v2002, SP3
    Notebook w/ 16:10 monitor
    Basic MTW was upgraded to VI 2.01 without first patching to 1.1. (I don't think I did it differently on the other computer, and even if I did I don't see how it could matter.)



    I'm officially giving up. Thank you for your effort Axalon. It's a good mod (the parts of it I got to try anyway... ) and I'm sorry my computer hates it. Maybe the next version will work for me.

  13. #13

    Default Re: Redux: Install Emergency!

    I d say that the message shows that there is a unit somewhere that still has in the unit_prod.txt the Novgorod faction specified. And since its removed and replaced by the Russians the debugger tells you that in order to give you clues as to where the problem is.

    If Axalon knows that the installer does not have any problems and that the game loads for him, then its up to the player in making sure that he installs things in the right order.

    Even if however the error cannot be found in this way, there is another;

    If its what i think it is, its easy to fix and quite common in making mods. Just search all units using the GnomeEditor in the column that specifies which faction is eligible to train the unit (IIRC that column is indeed column 18). Somewhere, there must be a remnant of FN_NOVGOROD that the exe picks up and cannot load.

    It should take no more than 10 minutes to fix.

    !it burnsus!
    Last edited by gollum; 01-15-2009 at 17:00. Reason: clarity
    The Caravel Mod: a (very much) improvedvanilla MTW/VI v2.1 early campaign

    Please make sure you have the latest version (v3.3)
    Since v3.3 the Caravel Mod includes customised campaigns for huge and default unit settings

    Download v3.3
    Info & Discussion Thread

  14. #14

    Default Re: Redux: Install Emergency!

    Hello there Gollum,

    First off, I must say that I do appreciate you trying to help out here. After all, this is exactly what this thread is all about. Helping out others that got install-problems or are stuck in the install-phase somehow.

    I can’t say that loud and clear enough; it – must - not – necessarily - be - me - that provides that help here! Anybody can do it! Everybody is welcome to lend an aiding hand to other players that want their redux game going. Jr. member/member/Sr. member it does not matter, help is help... Feel free to quote me on that!

    Ok, where was I? The Cold Steel case then; well the thing is that you are shooting at the wrong target this time. It is not the “CRUSADERS_UNIT_PROD11.TXT”-file that generates these messages, it is the other one; the “CRUSADER_BUILD_PROD13.TXT”-file. It’s an easy mix-up, and anybody could have done it – this time it just happened to be your turn.

    Now, the problem is not the “CRUSADER_BUILD_PROD13.TXT”-file in it self – it should not be at least. What causing these messages is the fact that the file don’t add up with version of the .EXE (or game-program) because it is formatted for another version, I’ll give bunch of examples of that in my next post. It is not the data or values in the file that is causing the message - it is the structural differences in how the different versions are built up (which goes for some data as well: “Novgorod” raw-MTW or “FN_Novgorod” raw-VI for instance).

    The problem is that it belongs to a different version of raw MTW then the .EXE you got while trying to run that file. They must be the same version. If you have a MTW V1.1.-.EXE and tries to use a VI/V.2.01 “CRUSADER_BUILD_PROD13.TXT”-file with that you get the “FN_Novgorod”-version of the message. If it is the other way around you get the plain “Novgorod”-version of it. And it would not help if you simply just deleted Novgorod-parts in the file since the whole formatting in the entire file is wrong - and it is that problem that creates the message we are talking about here.

    Essentially, we are probably talking about a human error thus. In the Cold Steel case it probably would be that the wrong files or not enough files have been applied – possibly even in combination. I don’t know which and since I don’t know that I can’t solve it - because that information is imperative to straighten this whole thing out. It should be like that at least. Sadly enough I probably won’t get that chance since Cold Steel decided to give up the fight prematurely (unless he returns here and have another go of course).

    So that’s our problem most likely, human error of some kind. Wrong files or not enough files are my guess, because even if they are applied in the correct manner it won’t help – it will still generate this kind of message. Redux must have ALL files and the CORRECT files. If this is indeed what went wrong in that case, I can only speculate at this point. But this is the most likely and plausible explanation for it – because I believe that Cold Steel really did know how to apply the stuff – he managed to do it on another PC – so why should he not be able to pull it off again? If he used the wrong or not enough files the “FN_ Novgorod”/”Novgorod” is precisely the kind of message he would get however and it would not be the first time that this happened either, it has happened all before.

    So there you have it. Feel free to stick around here by the way.


    - Cheers
    -----------
    If Lassie the dog is kind, may Cold Steel also have read this….

  15. #15

    Default Re: Redux: Install Emergency!

    Hi again,

    Well, first I would like to say that I am truly sorry for the fact that Cold Steel gave up here, he could have fought on a bit more I think. I feel that the towel was thrown in too soon. None the less, there first time for everything and now my first defeat in this regard is finally here – an install-case which I could not solve.


    The Cold Steel case: final notes

    In order to find out what might have gone wrong in this case I actually downloaded the files myself (and put up a fresh install of VI) just to triple check the files one last time – and as expected - the files worked perfectly. Thus we can once and for all completely rule out any possibility that whatever went wrong in this case - it had to be external of the redux files, assuming that the correct files were indeed used. The files work so the problem is not located there. That leaves us with only two other possible scenarios that created this sad outcome.

    1. Human error of some kind.
    2. Other external software that fouled things up.

    I’d guess we never find out which of the two (potentially both) it actually was, since Cold Steel decided to give up here. But the error-messages do limit the possibilities drastically. In all other cases when the relevant error message was displayed - redux lacked or had a wrong component applied of some kind:


    The Novgorod Message:

    -------------------------------------------------------
    COLUMN_building_faction_association

    unknown faction specified: column 20 , row 8

    Novgorod
    -------------------------------------------------------

    If we have this error-message some of these alternatives have been done:

    1. “MTW-VI+Redux 1.0b+VI-upgrade 1.0+Spanish fix (A)”
    2. “MTW-VI+Redux 1.0b+Spanish fix (A)”
    3. “MTW-VI+Redux 1.0b”
    4. “MTW-VI+Spanish Fix (A)”

    NOTE: these are WRONG installations that create above error-message!

    Essentially we have a MTW1.1 “CRUSADER_BUILD_PROD13.TXT” that is expected to used and run by a VI-.EXE. It won’t happen of course, and this is the first file that turns up on the “protest-list” for you trying it - so to speak. Thus you got to have a VI/2.01-EXE to be able to generate this kind of message – that is how I understand it at least.

    And if we happen to do the following combinations....

    1. “MTW-VI+VI-upgrade 1.0” Game the game starts but will soon crash or freeze.
    2. “MTW-VI+VI-upgrade 1.0+Spanish Fix (B)”. Game starts but will soon crash or freeze.
    3. “MTW-VI+Spanish Fix (B)”. Game the game starts but will soon crash or freeze.
    4. “MTW-VI+Redux 1.0b+Spanish fix (B)”. Game starts but is missing files…


    The FN_Novgorod message:

    -------------------------------------------------------
    COLUMN_building_faction_association

    unknown faction specified: column 20 , row 8

    FN_Novgorod
    -------------------------------------------------------

    You get that message from the following combinations:

    1. “MTW1.1+VI-upgrade 1.0”
    2. ”MTW1.1+ VI-upgrade 1.0+Spanish fix (B)”
    3. ”MTW1.1+ Redux 1.0b+VI-upgrade 1.0+Spanish fix (B)”

    NOTE: these are WRONG installations that create above error-message!

    Essentially we have a VI/2.01 “CRUSADER_BUILD_PROD13.TXT” that is expected to used and run by a MTW1.1-.EXE. It won’t happen of course, and this is the first file that turns up on the “protest-list” for you trying it - so to speak. Thus you got to have a MTW1.1-.EXE. to be able to generate this kind of message – that is how I understand it at least.

    If you for some reason decide to install: “MTW1.1 +VI-upgrade 1.0+Spanish fix A” the game won’t start at all and just jump back to front-end after showing two error-messages. I can’t remember exactly what they are but one is about an “Artist Studio.bif”-file or something like that. The other got plenty of zeros in it. It’s wrong and won’t work regardless. You are constantly directed to front-end again….

    Finally, there are also other different versions of these error-messages if we were to install on unpatched raw copies of MTW. As in MTW 1.0 and VI/V2.00 they too generate messages of this kind. However, I think there should be some sort of god-given limits in how much people can foul up in not following the instructions and not read the provided information, so I won’t go into that….

    So, after this little display on how to foul things up. Here is the only reasonable theory I can come up with as for what went wrong in the Cold Steel case: I suspect that he by mistake downloaded the Spanish fix (A) when he should have downloaded the Spanish fix (B)-version. He did not think much of it and thought he had the right file. If this is the case - then he should get the following message:

    -------------------------------------------------------
    COLUMN_building_faction_association

    unknown faction specified: column 20 , row 8

    Novgorod
    -------------------------------------------------------

    This is also what he first reported in, post:8 (and he did report it later as well). So far so good, this I can recreate with a VI/V.2.01-.EXE.

    Then he claims that he got the “FN_” -version of the error-message. That I can’t reproduce – not with a VI/2.01-version of MTW. So by this point, reason is out the window because this is not possible to get that message without another kind of .EXE altogether which only leaves us with MTW 1.1 or possibly a MTW 2.0. So something is extremly wrong with this picture. Still, I find it highly unlikely that Cold Steel would do such a blatant and obvious mistake. After all, he did report in (after double-checking it) that he did have a V.2.01-version. The only problem is that it can’t generate such an error-message. So, if that is true, my initial theory goes out the window and reason tags along for the ride.

    Thus I suspect that he must have at some point used another kind of ”.EXE” in order to be able to produce a “FN_” kind…. So either MTW 1.1 or a VI/2.00 then. That is the only reasonable explanation I can come up with. Because I firmly believe that he was able to apply the files in the correct manner. Otherwise he would have never been able to successfully start redux on another PC. So, that is not the problem – it must be wrong .EXE or wrong files or possibly not enough files applied, and even if they was correctly applied he would still get message of this kind. So, he changed install at some point, he even said so himself, but he must have forgot to check that he had the right version going this time – as in VI/V.2.01? And I suspect that this is how he managed to conjure up a “FN_”-message. This the only reasonable and plausible explanation for it, based upon the information I got available. Some information is missing here and as long as it is like that – I can not go any further with this and do no more in this case.


    - Case closed….

  16. #16

    Default Re: Redux: Install Emergency!

    Sorry for getting that wrong Axalon - ColdSteel was around when i posted this and hope it didnt misdirect him.

    Experience says that its either the unitprod or the buildprod file - and for some reason when i read ColdSteels post, i read something about column 18 (instead of 20!) and somehow totally missed the building_faction_association part that clearly indicates trouble in the buildprod file. Better put me glasses on next time

    Congrats on your commitment to help your players. It speaks volumes of your dedication. Dont be too hard on yourself.



    EDIT
    I am certain that ColdSteel will read this eventually as i am certain that Lassie is kind. Thank you for the invitation.



    !it burnsus!
    Last edited by gollum; 01-18-2009 at 23:05.
    The Caravel Mod: a (very much) improvedvanilla MTW/VI v2.1 early campaign

    Please make sure you have the latest version (v3.3)
    Since v3.3 the Caravel Mod includes customised campaigns for huge and default unit settings

    Download v3.3
    Info & Discussion Thread

  17. #17

    Default Re: Redux: Install Emergency!

    Quote Originally Posted by gollum View Post
    Sorry for getting that wrong Axalon - ColdSteel was around when i posted this and hope it didnt misdirect him.
    No problem, think nothing of it. As I said, it is an easy mix-up. I would however like to respectfully ask you to leave this thread alone for now, since it is supposed to be about install-emergencies, problems and issues. You are welcome to post other stuff and further messages if you like over at the regular redux-thread. Oh and thanks for the kind remark and recognition (are you sure you don’t work for Lassie?). Yeah, the commitment “to help players to successfully install”–part, it’s a silly sense of duty-thing I still have. I try to live with it the best I can...

    - Cheers

    -----------------------------------------------------------------------
    Ok, next case please....





  18. #18

    Default Re: Redux: debug area...

    english MTW with euro patch + a german VI with euro patch

    using VI/v.2.01 .zip
    1.0b

    got a running shogun warlords mod 2.01 and a vanilla VI 2.01 - both working




    after copying the zip-files to the folder and executing the Medieval_TW.exe (wich seems to be not changed by the zip-files) it gives an error - will not load

    "Unknown faction specified: column 20, row 8

    NOVGOROD"




    thats my troubleshooting

  19. #19

    Default Re: Redux: debug area...

    got it

  20. #20

    Default Re: Redux: Install Emergency!

    Sorry to resurrect this issue, but I have had exactly the same problem with the Novgorod and FN_Novgorod errors that Cold Steel was reporting in post 10 of this thread.

    I have just purchased the SEGA Gold edition of MTW, which comes as version 2.0. I upgrade to 2.01 by downloading the new MTW .exe file and dropping it into the install folder. MTW then reports v2.01 at the top left of the main menu screen.

    If I install the Redux 1.0b files by pasting them into the install folder in the BLUE manner, MTW will not run and gives the Novgorod error (which is to be expected).

    Then I install the VI update v1.0 and I get the FN_Novgorod error.

    Installing the Spanish Fix B has no effect and I still get the FN_Novgorod error.

    I have used the RAR versions of the 1.0b and VI 1.0 files, and the ZIP version of the Spanish Fix B.

    Have you chaps had any brainwaves regarding this issue in the intervening months?

    Jonathan

  21. #21

    Default Re: Redux: Install Emergency!

    Just to let you know that I have managed to install REDUX on a different computer, using the exactly the same method as above.

    I can now enjoy lots of new MTW goodness :-)

    Thanks for the mod it is great.

    Jonathan

  22. #22

    Default Re: Redux: Install Emergency!

    Ok, roger that. Excellent that it worked out for you…. Do enjoy da game….

  23. #23

    Default Re: Redux: Install Emergency!

    I wrote this stuff over at the TWC, however it is useful and explanatory info so I made a (shorter) copy here too…


    Quote Originally Posted by Axalon
    The more patches there are, the more people tend to screw things up somehow. Obviously, I want to avoid that as much as possible and so I have come to reluctantly rely on big, complete modules instead, just to minimize the possible of ways that people can screw things up in. Sad but true.... :D So, distribution-wise, the RXB1003 will thus use the usual complete package/module format. And as always, the specific v.2.01 files will be released in a separate module necessary for ALL VI-/Gold-/Eras-/v.2.01-users due to the overall different file structures in MTW. It will look like this....

    • RXB1003...............The standard release (module A). All basic files + v.1.1 specific files only. About 190-250 MB in size depending on compression (Rar/Zip).
    • RXB1003-VI..........The VI-upgrade release (module B). No basic files + v.2.01 specific files only. About 8-12 MB in size depending of compression (Rar/Zip).


    These modules will also be able to work as regular patches do - all we need to do is to apply/copy and paste them (as in everything) - and let it/them replace previous RXB1002 install and everything will continue to work just fine. Module A first and when relevant Module B second. Then the existing install of Redux will be upgraded to RXB1003. Obviously these modules can also be applied directly to new fresh installs of MTW as well, either v.1.1 or v.2.01 versions - as usual. Regardless, RXB1003 will be fully save-game compatible to RXB1002 (however any version below that will not work). I always try to have things save-game compatible (when possible), these releases will be no exception to that practice. Also, with the release of RXB1003, the RXB1002-version will be retired from public distribution.
    - A
    Last edited by Axalon; 04-15-2012 at 15:29. Reason: grammar...

  24. #24

    Default Re: Redux: Install Emergency!

    Another (modified) post on install-stuff I originally made over at the CA-boards that might be useful here…


    Quote Originally Posted by Axalon
    …you need to take things slowly and do things precisely and with zero deviations. First and in rigid order....

    1. Install/make a fresh copy of MTW somewhere - either v.1.1 or v.2.01 it does not matter but it MUST be either one. Whatever version of these two you have, and/or prefer... No matter (v.2.01, is the one you have, if memory serves). By default the install-path is usually "C:/program files/Total War/Medieval - Total War" (or some such, depending on various versions. Possibly a "Goldedition" or the like as well in the last part on some editions).

    2. Find your (intended) fresh install of MTW, and locate the relevant folder containing the "Medieval_TW.EXE" in it. Usually named "Medieval - Total War" (or some such). Keep that folder open.

    3. Download MTW-Redux Beta1003 (module A), AND then MTW-Redux VI-Beta1003 (module B). Decompress both (somewhere)... If you already have them somewhere, find them again.... Decompress both, if not already done so...

    4. Open the decompressed MTW-Redux Beta1003 (module A), and find the "Redux - Total War"-folder.... Open that very folder.... Select everything in there (press ctrl+A), then copy everything (press ctrl+C)....

    5. Go back to that fresh-install of MTW (from step 2 on this list) and reopen that folder again - yes the one with the "Medieval_TW.EXE" in it. Now, make sure it is open and then paste over everything in it (press ctrl+V). Allow the Redux-files overwrite everything by clicking "yes to all" or some such... (All v.1.1 users, proceed to step 8)

    6. Open the decompressed MTW-Redux VI-Beta1003 (module B), and find "Redux - Total War"-folder.... Open that very folder.... Select everything (press ctrl+A), then copy everything (press ctrl+C).... (This step is only necessary if we use or have v.2.01 somehow)

    7. Go back to that fresh-install of MTW (from step 2 on this list) and that folder again - yes the one with the "Medieval_TW.EXE" in it. Now, make sure it is open and then paste over everything in it (press ctrl+V) - yet again.... Now allow the Redux VI-files to overwrite everything by clicking "yes to all" or some such... (This step is only necessary if we use or have v.2.01 somehow)

    8. Now you start up the "Reduxed" game by using that very "Medieval_TW.EXE" in the relevant target-folder/install that Redux was installed/pasted in. Redux will now be successfully installed - if all these steps have been properly and rigidly followed. All this by using the blue install-model as essentially outlined in "the fools install guide".


    This is the most basic form of install that one can make of Redux - however that will also render "Quickstart" dysfunctional and mix-up all portraits in game. For details on how to counter that, consult included "Redux_ReadMe100x" - see "Before install"-section.... Personally, I don't like having things screwed up so I always change relevant folders to "_Portraits" and "_Quickstart" before any install and that will then make everything work just fine all over (it also works just fine on a re-installs of Redux over previous installs). If somehow it still does not install succesfully, post up your exact intended install-path and i'll show you where to paste/install Redux.

    Alright, that should cover it. Also, be not offended somehow if I have been overly obvious on some details here - it is better to be that, then the other way around and this has zero to do with you personally.
    - A
    Last edited by Axalon; 04-26-2012 at 00:43. Reason: clean up...

  25. #25
    Member Member Phalanx1970's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2012
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    California, USA
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    6

    Default Re: Redux: Install Emergency!

    I have Viking Invasion 2.01, I installed Redux beta1003 and then VI-beta1003. When I click on the EXE I get an error message
    "Unknown faction label used to indicate building advantage: column 13, row 19 PAPIST" I click OK then it crashes
    I haven't played MTW in a few years and I really want to play this mod it sounds great! I have Windows Vista home service pack 2.

  26. #26
    Member Member Phalanx1970's Avatar
    Join Date
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    6

    Default Re: Redux: Install Emergency!

    Ok well I uninstalled everything then reinstalled MTW with the patch but without viking invasion this time. Now I can get all the way to where I can pic a faction but when the loading bar appears the game crashes. This sucks! I really wanted to play this mod. I can play VH XL with the Tyberius mod, no problem.

  27. #27

    Default Re: Redux: Install Emergency!

    Hi Phalanx, this should be easy to solve....

    The ONLY way you can ever get that particular error message is when you have installed basic Redux upon a VI/V.2.01 engine AND did not apply the VI-upgrade (at least properly or successfully). Basic Redux/Module A alone can not run on a V.2.01 engine and the Papist-message is the exact message for all such attempts. You must have the Redux VI-upgrade/module B installed as well - on top (and this installed last of all).

    There is no other way to get that message. Thus that is exactly problem here. Once you apply the VI-upgrade as well (successfully) - Redux will then work just fine. If you indeed can run XL or whatever - you WILL be able to run Redux on that machine - that is practically guaranteed. Redux does work better on most newer hardware then XL does. I doubt your hardware is somehow unique on this note.

    1. Install a fresh copy of MTW (wherever you want it) and patch it to V.2.01 (if need be).
    2. Install basic Redux (module A) on top of that fresh MTW-install.
    3. THEN you install the Redux VI-upgrade (module B) on top of that basic Redux install (successfully).
    4. Start game...

    Basically, see the provided instructions in post:24 (this thread) and follow them EXACTLY (do not deviate somehow) and then there should not be any further problems on this. You will be playing Redux in no time. The details about files and modules are outlined in post:23 (also this thread). If still in doubt somehow, read those posts all over again...

    - A

  28. #28
    Member Member Phalanx1970's Avatar
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    Default Re: Redux: Install Emergency!

    Hey! thanks Axalon for your reply. You were right something must have went wrong or I did something wrong the first time. I closely followed your instructions and it works! Thank you so much. This is great! I am enjoying MTW all over again. MTW2 is cool, but MTW1 has that addictive just one more turn feeling that MTW2 did not give me. I even like the old graphics better haha! Now I am having fun again!

  29. #29

    Default Re: Redux: Install Emergency!

    VI/v.2.01
    only that one installation of VI
    C:\Program Files (x86)\The Creative Assembly\Medieval - Total War - Gold Edition
    C:\Program Files (x86)\The Creative Assembly\Medieval - Total War - Gold Edition

    i did check if the game is working. fresh install, quick battle, working. version checked.

    extracted rar-files base and upgrade
    marked, copied, pasted base in "Medieval - Total War - Gold Edition", overwrite all
    marked, copied, pasted upgrade in "Medieval - Total War - Gold Edition", overwrite all
    clicking the Medieval-TW.EXE (nocd) it brings up
    that the MSVCR100.dll is missing on the system
    no start

    whats the ill?

    regards

  30. #30

    Default Re: Redux: Install Emergency!

    got that fixed
    Last edited by resistance; 09-30-2013 at 15:01.

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