phalanx

[anangryelitist]

Is it just me or are phalanx units ahistoricaly resilient against arrows? i mean i had 3 units of caucasian archers shooting at some pantodapoi phalangitai and they'd only take 1 casualty every 5 volleys or so :s. Those tiny shields cant block that many arrows can they?

[Tellos Athenaios]

Phalanx units as in 4.5-7.5 metres of spear obstracles, more shields than you can count, and decent armour?

Yes: they will probably be somewhat more resilient in RTW than they were in real life; then again many missile units don't seem to suffer quite as much from realistic real life conditions either. If you try to soften a phalanx up from the front, you must use at least javelins or *many* archers/slingers: don't expect miracles though. After all you are playing according to the rules the phalanx unit likes best, attacking it head on.

[Maion Maroneios]

It's more the fact that they where tightly grouped together with their pikes warding off missiles, but indeed I think it's a bit unrealistic fyself. What I do know, is that this is hardcoded and cannot be changed withou major consequences.

Maion

[Ca Putt]

when my cities are attacked by large phalanx contingents I usually order my archers to fire at evrything apart from the phalanx to prevent them from wasting arrows and if they don't have any armored troops(who could get dangerous on the walls) I task my slingers to fire at them, they don't do much more damage but It seemd to me that they are a bit more efficient than archers. in all other cases I try to get behind a phalanx before i fire

[anangryelitist]

Yeh its pretty weird how silver cheveron elite units die more often to missile fire than levy phalanx units do D:

[Strategos Alexandros]

Slingers will do best against them, especially if you can get some behind them.

[Maion Maroneios]

Yeah, but we're talking about the front and how unrealistically strong they (phalangites) are against frontal missile fire. Anangryelitist didn't ask for tips against phalangites with missile units...

Maion

[Ludens]

It's more the fact that they where tightly grouped together with their pikes warding off missiles, but indeed I think it's a bit unrealistic fyself. What I do know, is that this is hardcoded and cannot be changed withou major consequences.

I've heard this before, but is there really any evidence that phalanx formation provides additional defence from arrows? In EB, phalanx units have increased shield values and reduced defence to indicate their reliance on formation. Because shield values count double against arrows, this has the additional effect of making them more missile proof. However, this does make sense historically, since the phalanx did very well in the missile-fond east.

[machinor]

I never really got, how that warding off missles with pikes is supposed to work. I mean a pike has a rather small surface/silhouette and it's not like there were only 10 cm between them. It would actually be harder to hit the pike than the man it's supposed to be protecting.

[Aemilius Paulus]

I never really got, how that warding off missles with pikes is supposed to work. I mean a pike has a rather small surface/silhouette and it's not like there were only 10 cm between them. It would actually be harder to hit the pike than the man it's supposed to be protecting.

Oh, but we're talking about a forest of pikes. The only problem is that the front rows do not really get any protection from pikes. Only the middle and back rows do. The pike phalanx has one of the rows holding the pikes at a 45-degree angle and then many more holding pikes at 90-degrees. These pikes can block the majority of missiles, but as I've said before, not everyone benefits from the protection. In RTW as Ludens aid, the only reason the phalanx is so resilient against missiles is because the phalanxes have 5 or 6 shield in comparison to the normal 3 or 4.

[Pontius Pilate]

yes the phalanxes in EB are way to resilent against missile fire. but I think to change it would mess up alot of the other stats. but it's not like the phalanxes are invulnerable to missiles completely, so I can live with it. For an example of how effective missiles are against phalanxes, just watch the movie "Alexander" and watch what happens when the Persians release a volley of arrows on the makedonians in begining of Guagemala.