General Tactics

[CBR]

i think ill leave it late in a custom battle or two, simply so i can see dead horses clobbering my men (to use the CA persons example).
That said, does anybody know what a good range is to shoot on level ground? For that matter, what were the accurate ranges of the guns at the time (yes, i know thats on the site somewhere, but i cant be bothered to trawl the forum)?

In real life waiting until the enemy was within 50 meters or less you had a good chance at stopping or even routing the enemy with just one salvo. Generally the closer the better and depending on quality of unit.

But of course guns had much longer range and units could try to do a slow advance with individual platoons firing and the rest marching a bit forward, then another platoon fires etc and they would start at perhaps 200+ meters with that.

Tests of muskets showed they were not as inaccurate as some people thinks. At 50 meters range one could expect to hit a target (a badly made musket would be worse of course) and units firing at large targets could achieve hit rates of several % at 300 meters. But that was peacetime tests and there was a big difference between that and the realities of the battlefield.


CBR

[Polemists]

I think as another player stated it is a good system.

On the one hand, some of us don't want to have to keep clicking to fire, and on the other hand, there are advantages to holding your fire.

I assume this will be similiar to MTW with fire at will button (if you want automatic fire) a halt button (to hold fire) and probably a third button for fire.

You could do this in MTW2 you just had hit fire at will when the enemy was where you wanted them, though it wasn't as advantegous.

I'm more curious about urban assualt regarding the garrisoned buildings.

In one screenshot/video I saw a cannon shot took out a house a bunch of men were garrisoned in. While true enough, it makes me think that people will just blow up every building in sight with the cannon before entering lol.

So i'm hoping there is some damaged building mecanic or something.

Like you can garrison your men in the barrack or something, that way if enemy wants it they have to take it the hard way

[pdoyle007]

If you turn a house to rubble is the rubble then something to be used and hidden behind?
The 'hold fire' option would be interesting if you were garrisoning a house, wait till the enemy are walking past then 'BOOM' with a full company's worth

[Polemists]

Well this goes back to my urban combat idea.

I mean are we really going back to flags?

I mean it makes locating your units easy, but I hope the other side can't see the flags because how lame is that?

"Where are they hiding general?"

"Well do you see that large flag above building 4, fire your cannon at that one."


I mean i'd like to be able to do some city ambushes.

[Fisherking]

The game uses physical models for the gun fire. Evidently it also seems structures such as ships, buildings and walls are modeled. Whether rubble is a physical object in the game though is only a guess.

It would be great if everything is a physical object on the battlefield. That sure takes care of any line of sight, line of fire difficulties…so long as shrubs and grass don’t block fire.

It is going to be interesting to see how different ammunition effects structures and people. I am sure the Physics of the game will need to be complex to handle all the surfaces and objects there.

Ammunition is something that we have had very little discussion on. I want to see buck and ball loads for close range work! And don’t forget canister for your cannon, to stop that charge!

I surely agree that the General’s unit should not stick out like a neon sign, with a flashing SHOOT ME pointing at him. I hope everything has a hide ability to some degree. And yes even elephants, provided they have cover or concealment of some kind. It would make those scouting units useful like they were in earlier games. It is very hard to ambush an enemy if he sees where every unit is.

I am looking forward to see how it all fits together, especially with the delayed release, I would like to see some more concrete information.

[Sir Beane]

I think we can assume that rubble will be a physical model in game. One of the previews I read definitely stated that trees and bushes and things will be modelled.

I think we can also guarantee different kinds of ammo for your cannons, unlocked through research. I have seen it mentioned many times throughout the various previews and interviews. I would assume canister, grape shot and possibly even things like heated shot will be included in game.

I also think that ambushed and things might feature more heavily this time, given that lines of sight and fire and also cover are playing a much bigger part in the game.

I hope we can hide units in buildings only to have them pop up and catch the enemy in a deadly crossfire during a seige.

[Fisherking]

I know most of the CANNON ammunition will be there!

I want to see the INFANTRY ammunitions!

More from wiki:
Buck & Ball Ammunition:
round lead ball combined with three buckshot pellets
Construction
Buck and ball was issued in paper cartridges that combined the projectiles with the black powder propellant charge to facilitate rapid loading of the weapon. The buckshot would set in front of the ball, so that the ball would act as a gas seal for the buckshot. Like any other paper cartridge, the rear of the cartridge would be torn open to expose the powder, which would be loaded, and the remaining paper, balls, and buckshot would be rammed down on top.

Purpose
The intent of the buck and ball load was to combine the devastating impact of the full-size ball with the spreading pattern of a shotgun, and served to greatly improve the hit probability of the smoothbore musket used in combat, especially at closer ranges, where the buckshot would retain significant energy.
Claud E. Fuller, in his book The Rifled Musket (New York: Bonanza Books, 1958) shows tests of a rifled musket firing Minie balls, and a smoothbore musket firing round ball and buck and ball rounds at various ranges. At ranges of 200 yards (180 m) and under, the buck and ball from the smoothbore musket, while less accurate than the rifled musket, actually produces a greater number of hits due to the greater number of projectiles; 37 of 50 Minie balls, vs. 18 of 50 balls and 31 of 150 buckshot, for a total of 49 hits in 50 shots. Beyond this range, the buckshot will have lost sufficient energy to become ineffective due to its lower ballistic coefficient.

Use
Perhaps the most famous proponent of the buck and ball loading was George Washington, who encouraged his troops to load their muskets with buck and ball loads during the American Revolution. The buck and ball load was standard issue throughout the Seminole Wars of 1815 - 1845. With the advent of general issue rifled muskets in the American Civil War, the buck and ball loading began to fade from use, though it did see action in the remaining inventory of smoothbore muskets. The buck and ball load has been replaced in current military inventories by standard buckshot loadings in the combat shotgun.
As you can see the stuff was effective!

[Sir Beane]

Infantry ammo types huh? I'm not so sure on this one. It sounds like something which would be good to have in game though. Since CA seem to be making a big thing of unit upgrading and researching new tech then maybe it will be included.