C'mon Ireland, you know you want to...

[Sarmatian]

My weekend? Ireland has ruined my century.

Weekends for the Irish. They'll have to do it until yes wins. So, 6 months from now again they'll have to go out to vote if they say no etc...

Also, would I be completely wrong in assuming that you are still a trifle dismayed over my qualification of the Orthodox Balkan world as 'Mars, from where we're sitting'?

Yep, completely wrong. It probably would have had a major effect some 5 years ago when I wanted western Europeans to accept us from the "Orthodox Balkans" as you put it, and was actually always making an effort to leave a good impression, either in person or on the internet. You know how people are fond of stereotypes, so my logic was if I'm the first Serb they met or talked to and I leave a good impression, they'll generally extend that favourable impression to all Serbs. But, now, I couldn't give an intercourse what western Europeans think about Serbs or Serbia and I'm against Serbia becoming an EU member, for many reasons... So if Serbia ever gets close to becoming a member, I would be the guy on the streets demanding a referendum about that (if politicians suddenly decide that only a parliament decision is enough) and spend much of my time convincing people to vote No. Free trade, free flow of ideas, capital, all that stuff can be achieved without becoming a member...

Maybe my deliberately inflammatory qualification buried the thought-provoking point there. Namely, that unless one is a proponent of a global government, there must be geographical and political limit to the EU. Even we internationalists have one, that is, you and I both. My EU ends at the Mediterranean, the Bosporus and the Russian border. Politically, it ends at a confederation. Your EU ends somewhere too. I shall assume you do not want a full federation with Pakistan and Sudan.
The point is, that we can discuss the desired extent of the political and geographical limits. But we can not discuss their existence itself, or claim any moral highground against those with smaller geographical or political limits to the EU.

There are certain thing in motion and things are gonna have to change. European nations are falling behind, and it's going to continue. The only remotely sustainable solution is greater federalization of Europe. It might not be my or your thing, but it has to happen and most probably it's gonna happen. Considering limits, I have a bit of a "De Gaullic" view of Europe - from Atlantic to the Urals. Any kind of unification of Europe not involving Russia and to a much lesser extent Turkey is flawed. That doesn't mean that Russia has to be a member per se, but some kind of close cooperation will have to exist. Seeing EU as something to limit or entirely remove Russia's influence is flawed and unsustainable and will bring more problems than it solves.