Princess in EBII

[Krusader]

While marriage alliances were far from non-existant, they were not nearly as common as in medieval times, or so at least it appears to me.

A quick look at the Diadochoi kingdoms will tell you otherwise. The early Ptolemies & Seleukids married their daughters here and there. Antiochos III had a Pontic princess as wife, Hierax had a Bithynian (or maybe Pontic as well), Attalos I's mother might have been Seleukid too. Ptolemaiois I was married at first with a daughter of Antipater (who seemed to marry his daughters off to most power players). Pontic Kings had wives from the Seleukid royal house as well.

The Roman nobility though did not marry outside the Roman families or at least it was almost taboo to do so, case in point being Caesar & Mark Anthony's relationship to Cleopatra. Ptolemaiois V or VI wanted to marry a prominent Roman noblewoman, but the sources say she refused to marry a foreigner which apparently won her much renown in Rome itself. So at least marriages between Romans & other factions should not be ingame.
As for the remaining factions, from what I gather marriages between them would not be looked down upon, as Hannibal & Hasdrubal both had Iberian princesses at least. Celts & Germans I have no idea on, but considering Celts intermarried with peoples they conquered and/or settled with I would take an educated guess and say they would not find it problematic.

[ziegenpeter]

Unfortunatly, you can't divorce in MTWII, which was AFAIK also very common in ancient times.

[oudysseos]

Is stealing enemy generals really so bad? First of all I don't think it's all that common- I hardly ever succeeded with it when I tried out DLV and PDER. And even if you do have to odd general switching sides- that occasionally did happen. Ptolemy Keraunos, for a perfect example. Coriolanus, maybe. Polybius, even. The 'marriage' part could be considered abstractly, the same way that a 'Man of the Hour' turns up in the family tree as someone's son or husband. I think the team should consider leaving it in- bribing generals hardly ever works unless you have a huge bank balance.

[Tyrfingr]

Princesses roaming free in the wild? Yeah right...ditch the unhistorical princesses, please!

[Subotan]

Presumably they have guards as well. But no snake charmers.

[Cute Wolf]

Stealing high-rank generals with high charm princess is an art on itself, at least you can expect that your daughter can betray you and follow that man instead. The only thing I would say about princess in EB II is:
- All diadochian (and hence nearly all greeks except Koinon Helennon), must have princesses
- Kardhastim, Phalavans, and easterners can have princess.
- The barbarians can have princess too (but what's the point to give such unwashed girl a hand?)


At least with princess, you didn't have to use assasin's blade against high-rank uber generals that still bachelors...

[Celtic_Punk]

Princesses roaming free in the wild? Yeah right...ditch the unhistorical princesses, please!

sounds like the princess of wales in Braveheart *pukes*

where the hell is the bridge in the battle of Stirling BRIDGE

[antisocialmunky]

They ran out of money for the bridge...

It is too bad you can't represent their wives as ancillaries and tie them to traits. IE. If you move a wife from one guy to another, the guy who gets her turns into an adulterer, the guy who he got it from gets ++ fertility. Quite possible you could have one guy boning everyone's wife. Or something. If only you could kill ancillaries.

[Yyrkoon]

ancillaries disappear with the general...just load all your crappy ancillaries onto a guy you don't like and send him on a kamakazi mission.

[Ibn-Khaldun]

If only you could kill ancillaries.

In M2TW you can remove ancillaries actually. In RTW you couldn't.

[General Appo]

where the hell is the bridge in the battle of Stirling BRIDGE

To qoute Mel Gibson: "The bridge got in the way."
To qoute local Scott: "That´s what the English found too."

[strategos roma]

Is stealing enemy generals really so bad? First of all I don't think it's all that common- I hardly ever succeeded with it when I tried out DLV and PDER. And even if you do have to odd general switching sides- that occasionally did happen. Ptolemy Keraunos, for a perfect example. Coriolanus, maybe. Polybius, even. The 'marriage' part could be considered abstractly, the same way that a 'Man of the Hour' turns up in the family tree as someone's son or husband. I think the team should consider leaving it in- bribing generals hardly ever works unless you have a huge bank balance.

Actually, eleutheroi generals are quite easy to bribe. I once bought 2 generals, all arabians, early on in my 1st AS campaign.

[a completely inoffensive name]

Kudos to strategos roma for attempting to save the second babe thread from being locked due to off topic posts.

[Cute Wolf]

well, rather than posts the whole ahistorical princess in bikini, who have a historical image about hellenistic princess (put aside XXX version of cleopatra)

[Elmetiacos]

Celts & Germans I have no idea on, but considering Celts intermarried with peoples they conquered and/or settled with I would take an educated guess and say they would not find it problematic.

Queen Cartimandua of the Brigantes seems to have married Venutius purely to bring his tribe into the Brigantian federation, judging by her later actions, but that was a ruling queen rather than a princess. Bearing in mind how easy divorce seems to have been for Celtic women, it would perhaps have been of limited political value.

[Cyclops]

Quality post by K.

A quick look at the Diadochoi kingdoms will tell you otherwise. The early Ptolemies & Seleukids married their daughters here and there. Antiochos III had a Pontic princess as wife, Hierax had a Bithynian (or maybe Pontic as well), Attalos I's mother might have been Seleukid too. Ptolemaiois I was married at first with a daughter of Antipater (who seemed to marry his daughters off to most power players). Pontic Kings had wives from the Seleukid royal house as well...

..so its very useful to have dynastic/alliance marriages in game at least among the Diadochi/Persian fragments.

...The Roman nobility though did not marry outside the Roman families or at least it was almost taboo to do so, case in point being Caesar & Mark Anthony's relationship to Cleopatra. Ptolemaiois V or VI wanted to marry a prominent Roman noblewoman, but the sources say she refused to marry a foreigner which apparently won her much renown in Rome itself. So at least marriages between Romans & other factions should not be ingame...

I believe Roman women did marry provincials including ones with Greek culture, but this may be from Tacitus rather despairing view of the somewhat decadent Principate rather than the EB period middleto late Republic.

Was Mark Antony seduced into the Ptomaic faction? Augustus' propaganda might insist he was no longer a real Roman, but he still led legions. I can't think of a single general changing sides for sex (but see Syphax below).

If we buy Octavian's guff this might be modelled by MA marrying (being seduced by) Kleopatra: except she was a bit old to be a princess still, and he ws already married etc etc.

...As for the remaining factions, from what I gather marriages between them would not be looked down upon, as Hannibal & Hasdrubal both had Iberian princesses at least. Celts & Germans I have no idea on, but considering Celts intermarried with peoples they conquered and/or settled with I would take an educated guess and say they would not find it problematic.

The one I always think of is Sophonisba marrying Syphax to bring the Numidians back into the Karthi fold (this is a FL and his faction changing sides for sex, not a general/FM). Karthis did marry out, unlike the socially xenophobic, politically inclusive Romani.

There seems to be solid defensible arguments for including princesses as alliance/loyalty tools (esp in the east ) "seducers" (a few dubious examples) and freebie diplomats: to my mind the last one is the least likely but can you switch it off and keep the seducer or marriage proposal aspect on?