The Curia

[navarro951]

Message from Princeps Blasio...

"Good friends in the senate, I hope we all extend our gratitude toward Dux Cotta and the men who fought with him in his campaign. It was finely executed.

Now, we must decide, take the Epirote capital? Declare a truce? Or wipe them out? I will deal with the rebels in Latium and return to Roma to debate this issue. All representatives of members not currently in the council speak freely of your senators opinions."

[/Bean\]

Balbatus stands.

We should keep one army in southern Illyria to keep the Epirites at bay and weakened, but we should consolidate our new holdings rather than invade Greece itself. We should hold off any plans of a treaty for now.

[Potocello]

Dux Longus' aid, Decimus Arrius Scurra stands and addresses the senate.

"I think that we should wipe out all of Epiros. We have come so far, fought so hard that letting these vile people live would make us Romans look like cowards and fools. I think that we should recruit another Legio and give it to one of our newly appointed Legatii. Perhaps Tiberius or Scipio? Both have proven themselves as worthy tribvnii in the Legio III, why not see what they can do on their own. While we train more Legios we could retrain the Legio I, II, and III and prepare to destroy the rest of the Epiros. What say you senators?"

[/Bean\]

A messenger enters the Curia and heads for Balbatus. Balbatus scans the letter, and thanks the messenger, who departs.

Fellow Senators, I have a here a letter from Dux Cotta. It reads:

Dearest friends and members of the Senate, the people and spirit of Roma, and the Consuls. I proclaim victory in Illyria for Roman forces. We took them by surprise, overwhelming force and spirit, and we have liberated those under the heel of an evil tyrant. The people of Illyria have thanked us in their own way, giving us many riches, slaves and land in return for their independence.

I ask the Senate one last favour as commander in Illyria. Many units of Legio III need evacuating back to Italia, and reinforcements have still not releaved the legions. The Legio I Apulia is far to the north. However, the Legio II is still active and ready to fight. We have Epirite incursions across our new borders. I ask the Senate permission to use Legio II as a border party, protecting our new holdings until the Legio III can be safetly taken back to Italia and sufficient forces arrive in Illyria. I will not be using Legio II to attack Epirite holdings in Makedonia or Epirus itself. It is purely a request to protect our new holdings. Will the Senate grant me this request?

Now, onto other matters....

[Mooks]

I second Longus's proposal.

[/Bean\]

Balbatus looks up, slightly annoyed.

Yes, thank you Senator Scipio. That proposal was made a while ago. What is your opinion of the matter raised in the letter which I read only moments ago?

[SwissBarbar]

Hopefully the same as mine, for I agree with Dux Cotta. Lvcvllvs said

[/Bean\]

Another messenger arrives in the Curia, rather dark skinned and adorning a light beard. He looked slightly lost, as if he had never entered the Curia before, though he wore the clothes of a Senate Envoy. He looked round in wonder as he strolled in, then at the staring senators, as if he was unsure of who to deliver the message to. Thinking this was yet another message from Dux Cotta, Balbatus rose to take it. However, accoring do the insignia it was from a Roman official in Massilia. Balbatus questioned the messenger, who instead of replying simply gave the scroll to Balbatus and turned to leave quickly, having not spoken a word. Frowning after the man, Blabatus read it, before speaking.

Gentlemen, it seems our delegation to the Carthaginians seems to have worked. They have turned away from the city of Massilia, and are marching back towards Iberia. We must be wary of Carthage. They are beginning to poke their toes over the line.

[navarro951]

Blasio makes his way into the Curia tired from the long march down Italia...

"Good men I will have a few days to spend some time here in Roma before I return to deal with our rebel problem.

I would like to speak more on the matter of this completed Dux campaign. Dux Cotta, I think we can all agree executed his plan skillfully and with as minimal casualties as possible. I believe that a few honors should be bestowed upon him.

First, when he and Legio II return I ask as Consul that they be allowed to perform a Triumphus in his honor.

Second, I ask that he be declared Dux Caivs 'Illyricus' Cotta.

Finally, in preparation for him becoming a Quaestor, that a Provincial Governorship be granted to him. I think the province of Illyria Hellenike is fair enough."

Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 

(OOC: I will leave this open for debate. If there is two sides of opposition a poll will be opened so we can keep the Republic in order. See TCV....)

[/Bean\]

Balbatus puts down the letter upon Blasio's arrival.

I wholeheartedly agree with all the proposed. Dux Cotta fully deserves these honours. The Triumphus will let all in Roma see the glory and riches gained by the campaign. The name Illyricus will let us all remember the honours Dux Cotta received for all time. And the provincial dictatorship will help sturdy our new borders and further honour Roma's greatness.

A wise choice, Consul. I hope the rest of the Senate agree. However, I do believe the other commanders should receive honours also. Not quite as grand, of course. Although their new ranks as Duxii are indeed splendid, they should be noted for their successes in the campaign. After all, one man cannot do it all by himself.

[Potocello]

Deciumus, aid to Dux Longus stands

"Wait a minute gentlemen, let us not be too hastey with these awards yet, Ilyria is still a work in progress. What are we to do about the rest of Epiros? I think it would be better if we used these newly acquired riches to create more Legios rather than flaunting them about in the streets of Roma. Also, what of our countryside? Have you people not noticed the bands of rebels which are roaming about our lands, threatening our farmers? I think a triumphus would be unwise and reckless at this point in time, we need to retrain and put down these rebellions. I do think Dux Cotta should receive these rewards, but i do not think he should get them now."

[Tiberius Claudius Marcellus]

A deep voice rumbled his agreement with Deciumus, "Indeed, let us not be hasty in bestowing honors, especially such high honors and to those to whom they do not belong."

Senators in the back of the Curia strained their necks to see who spoke such words. Down on the speaking floor a rather large man struggled to stand up from his seat. This garnered quieted chuckles from the elder statesmen who were in better shape, causing the younger legislators to lean and whisper, asking who was this portly fellow. Caius the Fat finally came to his feet and hobbled out to the middle of the floor with the aid of a crutch, his ragged breathing echoing through the chambers. He blinked his eyes several times to bat away the diziness that came upon him from this rare exertion and bellowed,

"A Triumphus should be held only for those conquerors who have defeated a powerful enemy. Dux Cotta has done no such thing. In his own words, he sought to erradicate nests of pirates on the shores of Illyria. While his campaign was successful in its goals, all praise be to the gods, it was fought mostly against those same pirates and uncivilized barbarian tribes!."

Caius stopped speaking to catch his breath. An aide came forth and mopped his brow of the sweat that was beginning to bead. When he had regained his composure he continued,

"Our intelligence reported that Dalminion was just that, a client kingdom of Pyrrhus, while Epidamnos was their home soil. The Legio III Campania also readily defeated two forces and took a city from the Epirote Greeks - a true blow dealt to the enemy, not the acquisition of outlying, loosely "allied" tribes and provinces! The Epirotes are not even broken! They are instead reeling from a good blow; but are still in the fight. At most, Dux Cotta deserves a Corona Ovalis, for his campaign has earned him nothing more than an Ovation, in this senator's eyes."

Caius took a few sips from a cup of water brought to him by an aid and continued,

"And you, Blasio, what is this of offering the territory taken from the enemy - by a force not his own - to Cotta? Illyria Hellinike was not paid for with Roman blood to be gifted away to the latest passing fancy, as a schoolboy would give a flower to his love! Should, then, this legislative body bestow an honorific agnomina to a man who shooed away goat herders and peasants from their hillside hovels? I should dare say not. No, honored sons of Roma, not during my lifetime. I will not see it done, that a warrior be granted such excesses when he has but begun what could be a lifetime of glory and honor. In time, perhaps; yet now is not that time.

Caius hobbled back to his seat and turned around to address the Curia before he sat,

"Nay to a Triumphus!
Nay to a provincial dictatorship in an unearned land!
And nay to a titular honor, unearned!

What would we bestow upon a general who had performed greater deeds under greater adversity if we grant our finest and greatest honors for such trivial accomplishments as these?"

Caius heavily plops down into his stone chair and lets out a sound more akin to the bellows of a forge. As an aide brings him more water and daubs a damp cloth to his neck and forehead he nurses and rubs the stump of his right leg - the last physical reminder of a once renowned Roman commander.

[desert]

Hey senators, it's Mars again. Been a long time, hasn't it? I remember some of you were kind of, well, scared ****less by my appearance, and you sent some Augurs to sacrifice a bull to me (yeah, I could tell that what you wanted was for me to leave).

So I was just here to say that the Marcellus kid, what was it...Tiberius, was using Jedi Mind Tricks on the fat guy to make him act as his messenger. That's all for now.

OOC: In other words, back in the early days we decided that you can only portray yourself, or a runner carrying a message of yours in the Curia.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Desert
For roleplay purposes, I am not yet a Senator - if I ever even become one. So just pretend that was the voice of a god.

In the game you are your character and your character only. You can't be your character + Mars.

I will make my IC entrance tomorrow, I think. It is my opinion though that the typical army should have enough and the right units to allow for the tactic that... err... "Mars" told us to use. It seems much more correct to have it that way. I also have a slight problem with the whole "dictator" thing. Why not consul and co-consul? I do not know what those dudes did historically (Rome is really not my favourite area), but in Camillan times I think "dictator" would be worse no matter what the consuls actually did. -.-

(I am aware that they could become dictator, but this was if I have understood things correctly only for a limited time, and not something they wanted to be permanent. Perhaps adding a rank of dictator that can be held by X person Y time and giving Z benefits, or just have it as it is but with changed names. That's my opinion, at least.)

[SwissBarbar]

OOC: WTF

[/Bean\]

Balbatus looks astonished at the Fat's outbursts.

Excuse me? So commanders are no longer rewarded for their accomplishments nowadays? We are to break hundreds, nay, thousands of years of tradition for your jealousy of this Roman Commander? No, I won't have it. You cannot deny the praise, rewards and justifications always go to the commander, and from hence to the lower orders. It has always been that way, and will forever remain that way.

Everyone knows the price of failure, yet many seem to not know the rewards of victory. Should this campaign have gone wrong, Dux Cotta's career would have been over. Like him as a man or not, that is a big risk to take. He asks only for what he deserves, as commander of the expidition that he planned, commanded and won! I saw no input from you, Caivs. As I see it, you don't look fit enough to comment on such matters.

Cotta asks for a triumphus to show his victory in Illyria, not against the kingdom of Epirus. The idea was never to directly attack Epirus, but to rid them of strong, supporting allies to the north, strangling their manpower and their wealth. The fact that their manpower was depleated and they did not leave a substantial defence force, alongside their failures at governing these new tribes, is no fault of Dux Cotta's. You are suggesting he be denied prizes for the enemie's failures. There is no sense in that.

Even now, Cotta toils in the mountains in the north of Epirus and Makedonia, protecting the Legio III, who did do a fine job indeed in taking the lightest garrisoned target, although the relief force was unprecidented and dealt with well, I must say. I do praise the commanders of the other Legions, and wholeheartidly agree with their respective promotions. But would you have the lower commanders granted these rewards, these honours and new powers, and that Dux Cotta receive nothing? Don't even bother to answer; it's propostrous.

In a letter sent to me, Dux Cotta assured me he wanted the Province of Illyria Hellenike simply due to the fact it would need a strong leader and protection in this time of need, when it is at it's weakest. The Illyrian kingdoms to the north do not require such attention as of yet; they can be governed by Roman puppet kings for now, guarded by a mixture of Italian and Illyrian loyalists.

This attack is nothing more than jealousy and regret that you could not be there yourself, Caivs, and for whoever else you may speak for. I beg you, Senators, do not get sucked into this way of thinking.
Thank you.

[The Celtic Viking]

Dux Regvlvs re-enters the Curia.

"Senators, I have heard news that a triumphus has been proposed for Cotta. May I ask why King Blasio seeks to make such a prestigious reward bleak and honourless? If we're giving out a triumphus for killing some rag-tag pirates, where is my triumphus for taking out the rebels in Massalia? When will Blasio's triumph be held for taking out those rebels he's aiming to put down? If he had hiked from town to town all alone by himself, then the proposal would at least make sense, but when using three whole legions, it's an affront to the gods to even utter the word.

I wholeheartedly agree with Tiberius, in other words. He should neither get a triumph, nor should we give him the land. He has not deserved it, and I will not accept that my men died in their great feats of valour only for him to take all the credit. All he did more than me or Dux Longus was to plan the operation - a plan that was too tightly scheduled and which caused a lot of tired legs and unnecessary casualties in The First, I may add. My three year old son could have done that."

[SwissBarbar]

Lvcvllvs rises and adresses Regvlvs highly indignant

It's for planning and leading an operation with 3 legions, don't forget, Regvlvs, you were under his command and fought for him, not for yourself.

First you say it's only a bunch of pirates and easy to defeat, and in the same breath you speak of the high losses you suffered? So what is it. Are you just a bad commander who let a few crappy pirates slaughter his brave soldiers or were the Illyrians, who fought in the armies of Philipp and Alexander, stronger adversaries than you admit and you are just jealous of Cotta?

I say yes, you are. You all are jealous cretins, not worthy of the Roman Republic. Shame on you! Shame on you all! You don't need to be jealous, for you'll never reach the glory of Cotta anyway!

Lvcvllvs voice got louder as he spoke the last sentence. This had to be said!

[/Bean\]

Balbatus speaks again.

Thank you, Lvcvllvs, but remember we all fight for the glory of the Republic. Cotta does not want to take any kind of power away from other men. He simply wants what he deserves; some recognition.

[SwissBarbar]

Yes yes, I know. They fought under Cottas command but for the republic. It's just pathetic how obviously jealous they are.

[/Bean\]

May I propose a compromise? Dux Cotta does recognise the other commanders' skill and sacrifice in this campaign. I am sure he would agree for them to join him on his Triumphal procession through Roma. A shared Triumph, gentlemen. How about it?

[The Celtic Viking]

"On the way here I squashed an ant with my boot. I demand some recognition for it, and I think I deserve no less than a triumphus. Will you support me now, or can we safely call you jealous?

Yes, you laugh. I would too, if someone came here and made this claim in full sincerity. It is a preposterous suggestion to throw a triumphus for such a thing as squashing an ant, and you'd oppose it because of that, not because you're jealous. It is an obvious false dilemma we can all find humour in. Yet, that is exactly what Lvcvllvs and Balbatvs are doing here."

Pvblivs sighs and turns to Lvcvllvs.

"I have a very well understanding of how a Dux campaign works, Lvcvllvs, so spare me the lessons. The only thing he did that I or Longvs didn't do was to plan the campaign, and he planned it poorly, causing unnecessary deaths of strong, Roman soldiers. If you think that warrants a triumphus, then I don't want to know how low you regard triumphs. They must be worthless in your mind, only a sign given to vane people for not falling on his sword.

As for your insults, you can spare me them as well. Many of my men died because they were tired from the forced marching I had to put them under to keep up with the insane and impossible schedule Cotta had given me, hungry from the lack of a proper supply line that I was not given time to set up and even pirates can do much damage when you are forced to assault prepared positions. That is why I say unnecessary casualties happened, and if you do not get the meaning of that, then perhaps you should get an aid who can explain it to you separately. Everyone else know what that means anyway."

[SwissBarbar]

Congratualtions for killing an ant. At least something.....finally


Bad supply is a foul excuse for your incompetence. Unnecessary losses indeed, because if your three year old son had commanded the army, the result would've been much better. We should consider that for the next time.

[The Celtic Viking]

Pvblivs laughs, sincerely and loudly.

"Is that the best you've got? More insults based on absolutely nothing, and not even a single argument?" He chuckles. "Then you concede that there really is no support for your position, and that the support for mine is sound. All you've managed to do here is to make a fool out of yourself, my dear Lvcvllvs."

[Mooks]

I agree with Cotta, He should be named Illyrica and stay in Illyria with a provincial dictatorship for a minamun of 5 years.

[SwissBarbar]

If you didn't understand my arguments before, I cannot help you, jealous friend.

[everyone]

Cicero (M.C.) calmly enters the Curia

"what is this I hear of a Triumphus and Dux 'Illyricus' Cotta?"

"surely it is foolish to celebrate over something which is not completed yet? even this moment Epirus is preparing themselves to retake the lands they once held, and we are already thinking of spending those resources we took from them, instead of using it to secure our position there? What is there to celebrate when the cities there are taken from us and the legions stationed in them destroyed?"

"And why the need for a Provincial governor now? The region isn't even established or secured yet, the governor would have nothing to govern, or nothing to govern properly. Also, the legion meant to protect the province would only puncture our recently-revived economy; it would be better if a new legion was set up to protect our ill-defended northern border, whom Legio IV is currently squishing some rebels which could be squished in a manner more effecient; for example dispatching them using a few replenished regiments from legions which have been shipped back for retraining."

[/Bean\]

Cicero, Legio II will protect the province, as it is doing now. There is no need to darft a new one until we secure enough funds to so do. In hope of a conclusion to the matter and to let Dux COtta know of our proceedings, should I draft a letter to him that the decision be postponed upon a later date? Would it please, or at the very least help certain senators if Dux Cotta would not receive these honours until Epirus has been defeated unarguably in battle, and a peace treaty resumed?

[Tiberius Claudius Marcellus]

Caius the Fat harrumphs loudly, drawing the attention of the Senators. He remains seated for what he has to say, the previous exertion having taken its toll on his large frame,

"Lucullus, Balbatus, no one here is jealous of Cotta's and Blasio's mutual suckling at each other's teat, attempting to win favor and presitge from the other. The campaign met its goals; but is simply not worthy of the great honor of a Triumphus. I would not take all glory from the commander - and indeed stated I would support an Ovation for his efforts. If that, Balbatus, is not recognition enough, then your friend is too greedy.

Focusing a sudden darker, sinsiter glare upon Lucullus, the entire being of Caius the Fat seemed to change, taking on the bearing of the man he used to be,

"And Lucullus, my size may not reflect the strong, young man I once was; but I will not be told that I shall never meet the 'greatness' and 'glory' of Cotta when I had my right leg hacked off fighting Samnites before both of your fathers were suckling at their mother's breast! Do not dare to speak to me of what warrants recognition on the field of battle. Though I am well-advanced in years, I hail from a time when hard work was its own reward. I brought numerous armies to heel and many people and lands under the purview of the SPQR. Do not, presume, to speak to me of jealousy towards this mewling infant of a commander; he has but a handful of victories under his belt.

Visibly cooled, Caius' demeanor returned to that of the cantankerous, blustery old fat man that he was. He sipped on a cup of water and continued,

"The land of Illyria Hellinike certainly requires a stronger Roman presence than the northern provinces, being as it lies in the heart of Epirote territory, yet why should Dux Cotta be the man for that job? Because Blasio wishes to appease him so? Let the Senate vote upon it, for there are men equal and greater in various regards who are apt for the job as well. We do not need Blasio to spoonfeed us that which he believes is good for us. I say let they who conquered the land protect it. Let the Legio III Campania under Dux Longus guard us from the Epirotes as a garrison force, not a governorship!. They, afterall, championed the original decision to venture in to Greece years ago."

Caius raises a heavy arm towards Dux Regulus, but lets it drop before reaching the full height.

"Dux Regulus and now Cicero here speak words of wisdom, words beyond their young years. We as representatives of the people would do well to hear their defense of the Res Publica, and listen. Let us take a vote on this matter, that is, afterall why we are here. The grandiose plans of some are ill-advised and do not bode well for the Res Publica."

[/Bean\]

Let us leave this until the congressional session. Then we should decide what happens to Illyria.

[Potocello]

"I agree with Cotta, the Congressional Council is so close, it would be wise to save this bickering for the council."