The Curia

[The Celtic Viking]

"Hear, hear!"

[SwissBarbar]

After the Senatores had voted on all matters, Avlvs smiled, for he was very content with the result!

"Senatores! Today you have proven that this senate is worthy of Roma, that justice, sanity and reason still are ruling this Republic, and not jealousy and political conflicts between individual senatores! He frowned at Appivs Clavdivs, turned around and then continued. You have proven that we treat our enemies like our enemies should be treated and not to spare them only because it would be a commander that certain senatores do not like personally, who would execute the sacred will of the senate! Honourable fathers of the Republic, by right you can be proud of you!

Furthermore I congratulate my dear Cousin, Qvintvs Avrelivs Q. f. Cotta Aemilianvs on the passing of his reforms!

Since the voting is settled, I shall prepare for my journey to Epeiros where I'll rejoin Legio II. This evening I will hold a great festival in honour of Merkur, to request him to bless me, and the ones who travel with me, with a save journey. You all are invited to my family's villa."

With that Avlvs left the Curia, well knowing that his friend Lvcvllvs will continue to avow for right, justice and the maintenance of the Republic.

[/Bean\]

Stalking out of the Curia following the results of the votes, Caivs Avrelivs stood for a moment on the steps of the Senate House, looking out over the city. Presently, he was joined by Avlvs Aemilivs, and together they simply stood in silence for a while.

Then Caivs Avrelivs spoke.

"My friend, we seem to have won the vote. Illyria it is for you then."

When his companion looked quizical, Caivs Avrelivs smiled.

"I am passing the command of Legio II to you, as my second and my confident. I know they will be in good hands with you. The Senate has already shown it's readiness to accept you as the next commander, and although the majority voted against my forced resignation, you and I both know this was always the outcome. I will meet you when I come to take over as governer."

Avlvs Aemilivs nodded slowly.

"Leave Ambrakia in a good state for when I arrive, my friend," Caivs Avrelivs clapped him on the shoulder, and walked briskly down the street.

[The Celtic Viking]

OOC: Since you left the Curia before saying it, I can't very well tell you this IC, but you can't do that. If you step down from commanding Legio II, everyone who wish to command it must have the chance to apply for it, since it's the senate who chooses the commander, not the previous one.

[navarro951]

Due to legionary reforms, Consular Legio IV Roma will now be Consular Legio I Roma. It, as our charter will see fit, will be under the command of whomever is the Consul of the Legions at the time. Also, by the time the next congressional council comes around, all legions, including Consular Legio's, must be reformatted to proper standing in accordance with our new reforms.

Another thing, Legio V will be the first example of how all new Legios should look. It well be proclaimed as Legio V Italia.


From the Office of Military Advisors:

Legio I Apulia: Orders are to establish a defensive position in Tolosa, retrain, and commision a new commander.

Legio II Latium: Orders are to capture the city of Ambrakia, wait to establish a garrison there, and return home (OOC: Any Italia province.) for an order of leave. After which, a change of command will be proclaimed.

Legio III Campania: Orders are to retrain, and await Consul Manivs Cicero's orders to invade Sicilia.

Consular Legio I Roma: Orders are to change command to Consul Manivs Cicero, retrain, and lead the fight into Sicilia.

Legio V Italia: Orders are to be trained, commissioned, be given a commander, and await further orders from the senate.

Notice from the office of the Consul of Finance:

Consul Cornelius Blasio is officially, by edict, proclaimed provincial governor of Taras and its surrounding province.

Consul Manivs Cicero is officially, by edict, for a period of 2 years to be proclaimed provincial governor of Tolosa and its surrounding province. He is now the rank of Quaestor as well.(OOC: apart from the Consul rank that is.)

[SwissBarbar]

A messenger arrived in the Curia and respectfully greeted the Senatores. After he was granted to speak, he unrolled a letter from Avlvs Aemilivs and said.

Senatores, I came all the way from Epeiros to bring you the lates news from there.

He started to read.

Honourable fathers of the Republic

The sacred will of the Senate has been carried out. In a single great battle, Legio II managed to defeat and completely destroy the enemy forces. The leading general of the hostile army, no less a figure than the heir to the Epeirote throne himself, fell to the blades of our brave soldiers and as I write this letter, our cavalry secures the streets of Ambrakia. The capital city of Epeiros now is ours!

Since Legio II is ordered to return to Italia, I request the Consul of the Legions to station units from Epidamnos in Ambrakia to keep the public order at a harmless level.

Legatvs Avlvs Aemilivs Lucii filivs Mamercvs

[Cultured Drizzt fan]

this is great news, once and for all the Epeiros have fallen to us. I applaud Avlvs Aemilivs for his assault.
Sextvs laughs
perhaps one day he will grow to the proportions of Caivs Avrelivs.

[Iskander 3.1]

Aye Avlvs Aemilivs, you are a model for any inspiring Legatvs. My congratulations to you and your troops.
Sextvs Cornelivs Scapvlla then gave his papers and orders to Exomnivs, and made way for Tolosa. There was much work to be done in Gaul.

[The Celtic Viking]

"A model for any...?" Pvblivs laughed. "Isn't that going just a bit too far? He defeated an already defeated enemy, and that's all. Lets not deify him for it."

[Cultured Drizzt fan]

exactly that is the model for all aspiring Legatvs to follow. Sextvs laughs once again

[The Celtic Viking]

"You must be joking, because you cannot seriously believe what you're saying here. He had a big and experienced legion full with soldiers against farmers, old men and kids armed with pitchforks and no real leader. They were already defeated before he even entered the province! All Avlvs Aemilivs had to do was to not command the legion to surrender and victory was assured - and you're telling me that makes him the perfect model for other Legates?

You must have an extremely low opinion of the other Legates for that to be the case, and an equally low standard for what to expect from one."

[Iskander 3.1]

He was given command of any army and he led it into battle with spectacular results. Sure, he may have had some advantages like well-trained and experienced soldiers, going against a weakened and out-numbered enemy. But he didn't get over-confident, nor did he let the pressures of command get to him, and the men carried out his commands as ordered. Not too shabby for his first command.

[Cultured Drizzt fan]

I can assure you it was a joke. Aemilvs won a victory let him have that. there is no reason to get into a heated arguement over it. I am also a Legatvs and am glad that Aemilvs first battle as a Legion commander went so well. It was a light jest, that I hopped would stop this from leading to a fight. I meant no offense to anyone.

[Potocello]

Servivs laughs in the corner...

"Ah Pvblivs Atilivs how right you are. As i see the issue of command is up for debate for these legions, might i remind you all of our Legatii Decimvs and Tiberivs? They have seen plenty of combat with the Legio III from Italia across to Ilyria, it only seems fitting that after all this time they receive command of a legion. They also commanded the Legio III in my absence and defeated a gang of rebels romping about Italia. It seems they deserve command more than, at least than these, erm, green youths who are clamoring for the command. What say you?'"

[The Celtic Viking]

"Thank the gods, I thought you had gone mad. I apologize for that. I do not deny him his victory, but lets stay honest about it: there was nothing 'spectacular' about it, and anything but a complete victory would make a fool out of him.

If Sextvs Cornelivs thinks that simply not getting overconfident or bucking to the pressure is enough to make him a model Legatus", Pvblivs frowns as he spurts out those last words, "then I would, if I was a Legate, take great offence in that. It is seeing someone of that rank squashing a bug under his feet, and then tell the rest of the Legates that they should then try their best to be as good as him, so that one day they too may be able to complete such a mighty feat."

Pvblivs snorts.

"To have such low expectations of Roman commanders is despicable."

[Iskander 3.1]

What, then, would your expectations be for a commander? That the hills tremble when he shouts, and that he can command the earth to quake and the enemy to be swallowed up? It is ridiculous that I must elaborate when I offer congratulations. I guess I shall have to tell Exomnivs to include disclaimers every time he speaks. As for now, I am through arguing for the sake of arguing. I head for Tolosa.
Sextvs turns his back and leaves

[Tiberius Claudius Marcellus]

"Servius Sempronius, many thanks for your passionate words. Indeed both Decimus Cornelius and myself would make excellent commanders of the new legio - and we have you to thank for that training. I pray to the gods daily that one of us shall be allowed to command by the Senate; but I fear that our enemies conspire against us yet again. Though Caius Aurelius Cotta's guilty conscience has forced him to accept the fate of the war monger he is, despite a majority of senatores failing to vote to punish him, he and his rabid supporters have formally combined their might into a house of lies and a den of thieves and cowards to stand against the Res Publica and those who would defend her.

"Lo! Even Cnaeus Cornelius Blasio has gravitated towards the power emanating from this alliance most evil and appears to be using his Provincial Governorship to aid his longtime friends. It would seem that his 'stepping down' from power was but a ploy to gain the trust and confidence of those senatores - myself included - and convince them that he was a reformed man. He is nought but a wolf in sheep's clothing; a venomous, lying snake. Dark times lie ahead and those of us on the side of good and righteousness appear ready to be caught out in the rain."

[navarro951]

Blasio jumps up..

"And what good have you done but stand here in the senate tossing lies and deceit in every which way! Your tongue is good for nothing but turning you childish jealousy against others. Our new family contains the most noble of Roman men in this senate. I can only say that I wish you had not twisted Pvblivs Regvlvs into such opposition toward me, for he is a noble man as well. You, however, and your clan of low life followers are a pitiful bunch. Every time I enter this place of business, you are there pointing your finger at good men who have done nothing but serve the senates order, whether by vote or majority rules. I await the day you actually serve our great Republic so that, maybe, you can actually earn a deserved applause as men like Praetor Caivs Cotta and Consul Manivs Cicero have done. In fact, the list of better men here goes far beyond those two, and at the moment it would pain me to place your name on said list. I pity you and your outrageous remarks, I hope you come to learn politics that is not made up of lies and games. Do not cast me out to be anything but a man of my word."

[SwissBarbar]

Lvcvllvs laughed

"It's incredible. He only sent a letter to say "Ambrakia is taken, enemy army defeated". Point. No claim for a triumphus, no claim for any recognition, no claim for nothing. Avlvs was well aware that, with the battle-tested troops and due to the fact, that he had fought with them for over 8 years and therefore they knew each other and could act as a great team, nothing else than a victory could be expected. But still you REALLY argue over this? I mean... what is the matter with you all?.

Again, he did not ask for recognition, the purpose of the message simply is: "Will of the senate done, please send troops to secure the city, for Legio II is ordered to go back to Italy." Which has been done, thanks to the Consul of the Legions."

[mini]

Norbanus rose gracefully, holding a scroll in his hands. After straightening his toga, he started speaking.

"Lucullus, don't get Tiberius Claudius wrong. He does not mean that Aulus Aemilius is not to congratulate for his victory.
Though a defeat would have brought great shame and a victory was very much expected, nevertheless it is always good to see that we, the nobility of Rome, still produce able commanders.

Yet the issue they are discussing here, is the rather illegal action of Aulus Aemilius.
Now I don't want to imply that Aulus Aemilius has willingly and knowingly broken the law.

He was under the impression that command was his, by word of Caius Aurelius.
I am also sure that this latter, very venerable man, did not knowingly transgressed the boundaries of law in doing so.

Yet when Caius Aurelius Cotta term as commander of the Legio II ended, so did the term of all his appointed chain of command. Therefore Aulus Aemilius was by word of law, no longer Legate of the Legio II and should - as dictated by law and tradition - have waited until the senate appointed a new senior commander to the legion.

This new commander is of course free to choose his own chain of command.


Nevertheless this obvious transgression of the law, I wish to express my opinion that neither senator willingly or knowingly broke the law in this case.
I have discussed this with my fellow Tribunus Plebis, Quintus Aemilius Regillus, one of the most renown advocates in the Forum this day and age and reached the following conclusion.
Considering this issue ended in the capture of Ambrakia, our suggestion is that the senate should appoint a new commander to Legio II as soon as possible, and that the transgression of both men should be seen in the light of ignorance and a will to execute the will of the senate for the best of Roma.
No reprisals should be taken, and the legion should be led home to be discharged right away.

If the Senate deems it wise to send a new legion, a new commander should be appointed.

Aulus Aemilius should be granted an official thanksgiving from the Senate on the capture of the Epeirotean capital, but should be given the subtle notion that the Senate was most merciful in indulging this transgression of the law."

[SwissBarbar]

"I agree that the Senate should appoint a new candidate for Legio II. Avlvs Aemilivs of course will the the prime candidate to this honour, since he not only is one of the longest-serving Legati of the Roman Republic but also has fought with the men for 9 years and has earned their respect and trust."

[The Celtic Viking]

"Lvcvllvs, I think you will notice that I have said nothing against Avlvs Aemilivs himself, and though I, as you should know, disagree with the strategic sense in the mission, I too would like to congratulate him for the success of it. What I was reacting against was the ridiculous claim that this victory showed him as 'a model for other Legates to follow'. This, of course, was solely against those who spewed such notions and not Avlvs Aemilivs, who had not done such a thing himself."

[SwissBarbar]

"I noticed that, I just could not believe, that some argue again just with no reason" , Lvcvllvs laughed. "Nothing against you personally. Thank you for your congratulations."

[mini]

Norbanus rose

"Dear Senators, I have received a message from Quintus Aemilius Regillus. He would like to request that the Senate should order the immediate preparation for the recruitment of Italian Alae troops in the city of Bonoia, Patavium and Genoa. Since legion composition has now been regulated by law, preparations should be made so we can adhere to the law."

Norbanus finished and sat down. Since he disliked being used as a messenger, he did not spoke for the preposition, yet his loyalty to a fellow Tribunus Plebis obliged him not to speak against either.



OOC: I forgot the ingame name for Genoa, sorry :D

[SwissBarbar]

Norbanus rose gracefully, holding a scroll in his hands. After straightening his toga, he started speaking.

"Lucullus, don't get Tiberius Claudius wrong. He does not mean that Aulus Aemilius is not to congratulate for his victory.
Though a defeat would have brought great shame and a victory was very much expected, nevertheless it is always good to see that we, the nobility of Rome, still produce able commanders.

Yet the issue they are discussing here, is the rather illegal action of Aulus Aemilius.
Now I don't want to imply that Aulus Aemilius has willingly and knowingly broken the law.

He was under the impression that command was his, by word of Caius Aurelius.
I am also sure that this latter, very venerable man, did not knowingly transgressed the boundaries of law in doing so.

Yet when Caius Aurelius Cotta term as commander of the Legio II ended, so did the term of all his appointed chain of command. Therefore Aulus Aemilius was by word of law, no longer Legate of the Legio II and should - as dictated by law and tradition - have waited until the senate appointed a new senior commander to the legion.

This new commander is of course free to choose his own chain of command.


Nevertheless this obvious transgression of the law, I wish to express my opinion that neither senator willingly or knowingly broke the law in this case.
I have discussed this with my fellow Tribunus Plebis, Quintus Aemilius Regillus, one of the most renown advocates in the Forum this day and age and reached the following conclusion.
Considering this issue ended in the capture of Ambrakia, our suggestion is that the senate should appoint a new commander to Legio II as soon as possible, and that the transgression of both men should be seen in the light of ignorance and a will to execute the will of the senate for the best of Roma.
No reprisals should be taken, and the legion should be led home to be discharged right away.

If the Senate deems it wise to send a new legion, a new commander should be appointed.

Aulus Aemilius should be granted an official thanksgiving from the Senate on the capture of the Epeirotean capital, but should be given the subtle notion that the Senate was most merciful in indulging this transgression of the law."

Lvcvllvs turned to Norbanus and simply said

"Firstly: They were NOT discussing whether his action was illegal or not, but whether this victory shall be awarded or not - more as a joke, since not even Avlvs Aemilivs asked for it.

The legality of his actions is proved by this order from the Office of Military Advisors. It has been done the same way in Legio III, also legally:"

from the Office of Military Advisors.

Legio I Apulia: Orders are to establish a defensive position in Tolosa, retrain, and commision a new commander.

Legio II Latium: Orders are to capture the city of Ambrakia, wait to establish a garrison there, and return home (OOC: Any Italia province.) for an order of leave. After which, a change of command will be proclaimed.

Legio III Campania: Orders are to retrain, and await Consul Manivs Cicero's orders to invade Sicilia.

Consular Legio I Roma: Orders are to change command to Consul Manivs Cicero, retrain, and lead the fight into Sicilia.

Legio V Italia: Orders are to be trained, commissioned, be given a commander, and await further orders from the senat

"Which is quite the opposite of what you deem legal, namely to turn back to italy, choose a commander and then go and take Ambrakia. Naturally , since the commander of Legio II is not available, the second in command has to fullfill the will of the senate, as ordered in voted edicts.

Secondly: You should not be too eager in defaming other people, even combined with nice additions like "he did not know" etc., since it's getting all too obvious where your and the "other" Tribvnvs Plebis' loyality lies.

Thirdly: The usus to defame your political enemies is about to tire me (OOC: ...of this game, it really is). Avlvs may react quick-tempered from time to time if confronted by (in his opinion) unfair defamation, but always respects the achievements of other Senatores, and is not too proud even to honestly congratulate his political "enemies". At the end we all serve the same purpose, the Roman Republic.

Fourthly: To wait would not only have been against the edict, it also would have been against every wise strategical movement.

And fifthly: At the risk of boring you by repeating myself, I again have to say, that it is all too obvious, that you try to defame Avlvs Aemilivs in order to make him unbearable as commander of Legio II, for which post of course he will run. I trust, that the other members of the senate, including Tiberivs Clavdivs, to whom you refer, will be fair enough to consider that Avlvs not only is one of the two most-experienced and longest-serving Legati, but also that he has fought 9 years in Legio II and therefore none would be more able to command this Legion, as none would be more able than Tiberivs Clavdivs or Decimvs Cornelivs to command Legio III.

[mini]

Norbanus rose indignantly

"First of all, I would like not to be told where my 'loyalty' lies. I am only loyal to myself. Second of all, if you cannot see that I am trying to EXCUSE the actions of Aulus Aemilius, rather than condemning them, you are a blind fool.

As to the LEGALITY issue: A legion is voted a commander. This commander choses his chain of command. SO for as long as Caius Aurelius Cotta was commander, Aulus Aemilius was his senior legate.

Considering the fact that Caius Aurelius Cotta then was removed from command, this means that LEGALLY, Aulus Aemilius is no longer senior legate.

The proper and legal course to take for Aulus Aemilius, was to await the appointment of a new senior commander for the legion, and then be relieved unless he himself was appointed as senior commander.

I have not seen any proposition nor debate around this issue. Unlike what you may think, the simple handing over by Caius Aurelius to you on no autority but Cotta's himself, is illegal.

I have proper respect for my senior senators, but if thoise senior senators have no respect for the law I shall not hold my tongue.

Legio II should be designated a new senior commander by order of the senate, or the legion should be discharged. Until what is to be done is decided, Aulus Aemilius is to hold himself to the law and wait for either relieve of command, orders to march for discharge or the official appointment of his command.
Furthermore he may only react to immediate threat.

BUT THAT IS IT.

Should he take any more illegal actions, I shall file a law suit. You can tell that to your master."

[SwissBarbar]

"That's the point. His action don't need any excuse, for it was the will of the Senate." Lvcvllvs laughed. "And he's my friend, not my master."

[mini]

"As far as I can see, the will of the senate was that Legio II was to take Ambrakia
The will of the senate as far as whom is the commander of this legion however, was not decided. Therefore Aulus Aemilius transgressed his authority.

I already said I will let this slip past the net, since he did capture an enemy city. But any other action he might take from now on, will leave him open for prosecution.

End of story"

[SwissBarbar]

"No, you don't get the point, do you. It was ordered to take Ambrakia. And it was told, that it would gain a new commander AAAAFTTTEEEER (meaning not before) it has taken Ambrakia."

After taking Ambrakia.


After taking Ambrakia.



After taking Ambrakia.


After taking Ambrakia.


I say that now, until you have internalize the meaning of these words.

Lvcvllvs continues whispering this in Norbanus' ear and hired a man, who shouted "After taking Ambrakia." the whole next night in front of Norbanus' villa.


OOC:

[mini]

OOC: then you acted on Cotta's orders, as a 2nd in command. Which was not how it was being said here :)

Bean his IC post where he GIVES you the command of the legion, comes BEFORE the battle.
Therefore, you were actual 1st in command, which is totally illegal and which is my point.