OOC Thread and Chatroom

[/Bean\]

So, according to our game rules(?), no commander can actually refuse to lead a legion? Sorry, I missed that rule.

[mini]

You miss the point entirely Bean.

If you are unable to play, fine. Then your 2nd in command takes over. but YOU remain the OFFICIAL commander as far as IC is concerned, you're just sick/uinjured whatever

but NOW, you OFFICIALLY (IC) relinquished your position as commander.
And then, it is not up to you to decide who is the new commander.

if you are unable to play, Aulus is still 2nd in command.

In the current situation, Aulus is the first in command officially (IC) which is illegal

[/Bean\]

Ok its illegal...oh dear. What a shame. Look how upset Swiss is.

[SwissBarbar]

He did not IC lay down his command. It was wrongly written in the curia-thread, but says that he spoke him outside the curia.


however.... I'm relly getting pissed off now. Avlvs is the second in command, leading legio II instead of its sick commander.

I mean...don't you see this? I mean.... can you not see how unlogial your arguments are? My eyes are almost falling out of my head by reading this. MAAAAAAAN!!!!

End of the story!!!

[mini]

however.... I'm relly getting pissed off now. Avlvs fu**ing is the second in command, leading legio II instead of its sick commander.

End of the story!!!

Yeah well, that's not how it was said in the curia, so that's why I commented.


If he edits his post to confirm the above, it's all fine by me as long as you dont do anythign else anymore


PS: I OFFICIALLY said IC in MY FIRST POST: that I will not prosecute anyone for the capture of Ambrakia, only that if Aulus would do anythign AFTER that, he would fiind a law suit.


so CALM DOWN.. jezus, why always taking things so personally..

[SwissBarbar]

it's not personal, I just can't calm down because you don't listen, and I can't stand that.


Well, again:

Aurelius told Avlvs that he stepped down, IN the curia-thread, but OUTSIDE of the curia, where noone could hear him. (it was a mistake)

in OOC we decided that bean's PC was stolen, Aurelius is sick whatever.

Thereby we decided that Avlvs is taking command as SECOND IN COMMAND, and Aurelius still is the official Commander, but represented by Avlvs. Exactly like in Legio III, which also acted legal.

And therefore the actions are perfectly legal.

In fact, nothing more legal ever happened in the entire history of the universe, than the latest actions of Avlvs Aemilivs in this game.


Do you feel me?


*Calming down*

[mini]

Well

I can EASILY roleplay some sneaky informant overhearing you. There's nothing to stop me :)
That's why I say: whatever is said in the curia = official :)

I do not want to sabotage you or anythign swissbarbar, anything but. If the vote comes, I'll even vote for you as the next commander.

But upon reading the Curia as it is, facts are that you were first commander. Which is wrong.
Now i also said IC, that I don't MIND the taking of Ambrakia. But any other action you might now take, IS illegal

which is what I said :)

And with the Curia being as it is now, your taking of Ambrakia is also illegal. Which is why i said you should be thanked, BUT also subtly receive a slight tap on the fingers, and a strong message that should you do anything else, you WILL receive more than a tap :)

[navarro951]

okay gents, im off to join the military hehe. wont be back till 2morrow, at which point all rule changes and an updated library will be made. At the moment, I ask that alll new suggestions or inquires be kept to yourself, i dont want to come back and have even more thrown on my plate. Let me finish what I have now, not to mention, I am sure I am already thinking of the same things you guys are so gimme a quick break here.

edit: TY mini, just right now we gotta get down to business, Legio's need commanders, a front needs to be closed in illyria, and war must continue with Carthage, its just the way things seem set up to be now.

[everyone]

right now I don't see anything in the new reforms or FAQ that says that legion commanders need to be voted or chosen by the commander. so that argument shouldn't have happened, we should stop imposing our own 'house rules' onto the game. if it's not in the FAQ, we shouldn't assume/insist it is.

AS GM I CHANGED THE RULES TO HOW LEGION COMMANDERS ARE CHOSEN, I OKAYED THE WHOLE AMBRAKIA ARGUMENT, AND I AM HEREBY DECLARING THAT DUE TO A MANY RULE CHANGES; THE OLD WAY OF DOING THINGS IS THAT AT ANYTIME A LEGION COMMANDERS TRIBUNE OR TOURING LEGATE MAY TAKE COMMAND OF THEIR LEGION IN A THE COMMANDERS ABSENCE OR TEMPORARY RELIEF. OUR OLDER PLAYERS UNDERSTOOD AND PLAYED BY THAT RULE. THINGS ARE GOING TO CHANGE SOON YES, BUT FOR NOW NOTHING HERE IS ILLEGAL, THIS ARGUMENT IS FINISHED, LET OTHER IMPORTANT ISSUES CONTINUE. THANK YOU, NAVARRO.

@ the bolded part:
what?! you mean in the future the tribunes or legates would not be allowed to take temporary command when their commander is absent? this is madness!

[SwissBarbar]

Of course they are, that's why the are called "second" and "third" in command. Anything else would be ridiculous. And as it was before, the voted commander of a legions still chooses his second and third and so on in command himself. That's how I get the rules

[mini]

that's not what it says Everyone.

You know that in the future only Provincial governors and the consul get control over a legion (or a legate under orders from a governor). This governor can choose his his legates/tribunes.
i'll give a few examples:

person A = governor of Gaul.
Gaul has 3 Legions designated by the senate to keep the peace.
Person A takes legion I
He then asks good friends B & C, currently not elected for any office, to lead those legions. (if they meet the requirements)

Person A also knows lesser friend D, whom he takes as Legate in his own Legion I

Then person A also knows a few young promising men. He asks them if they want to be tribunes in either one of his legions.


Now, person A becomes sick. ohnoes! (pc broken)
But no worries!
Person D can take control of the governors legion.
Person B & C have received certain orders from person A, and are able to act alone.

See, no problem, no voting, no fuzz.

But if Person A loses his governorship by something IC (political intrigue) or officially steps down as governor, person B to D and all tribunes, lose their position.
A new governor will be voted in the senate, and he get's to choose his own entourage.
(perhaps the tribunes can stay in place, but under the new rules, they can't command anyway)



Yet there's a difference with the previous discussion, as the situation was differeint (in my eyes and a few others, while nto in the eyes of Bean/others). This was also with the older ranks
Situation was:

Person A leads Legion x

person A then announces in the curia that he resigns command officially to person B.

Now I was under the impression that commands of a legion were to be decided by edicts.
Bean officially transferred his commandship to Swiss.
A few people felt that that was illegal, as Swiss his command was not voted by edict (but bestowed by Bean instead).


It was only afterwards that bean made some comment about his pc being stolen, that it was explained that he was still officially in command, but unofficially unable to play.
If Bean had just said from the start that he was unable to play, without makign that post in the curia about transferring command, nothing would have happened.

Just the 'official transfer' of command was what a few people found not-done :) As if Bean can decide that without an edict.
PERSONALLY, I didn't gave a fig, and IC Bean is my stephdad. So I did not want to make a big deal out of it.
But it had to be said, and then some ppl reacted very heavily, which of course I could not let pass :)




Anyway, don't worry. Being unable to play does not pose any issues. It's just a matter of how you put it and how you RP it ;)

[everyone]

this confuses me:

Gaul has 3 Legions designated by the senate to keep the peace.

how exactly are we going to implement that ingame? unless you're referring to a provincial legion/personal legion. then I've no problem with that; and shall propose some CA's next session to make that part easier to implement.
something like defining which regions belong to which provinces, etc. like what I've done in my Hayasdan campaign; defined a group of regions as a "province" and a few provinces as a "superprovince" (couldn't think of a better name) and have regional armies patrolling/guarding it.

and about those offices, when the person A is given a region to govern after his term as consul; how long does the governorship last? a session, 9 years, for life, etc?

[mini]

and about those offices, when the person A is given a region to govern after his term as consul; how long does the governorship last? a session, 9 years, for life, etc?

1 session.

this confuses me:

how exactly are we going to implement that ingame? unless you're referring to a provincial legion/personal legion. then I've no problem with that; and shall propose some CA's next session to make that part easier to implement.
something like defining which regions belong to which provinces, etc. like what I've done in my Hayasdan campaign; defined a group of regions as a "province" and a few provinces as a "superprovince" (couldn't think of a better name) and have regional armies patrolling/guarding it.

What I said so many pages ago :p
Provinces are NOT cities.

Provinces is a certain area, to be decided by the Senate, and can contain several cities.

Of course this excludes pomerium cities.

I can give you an example:
I want to suggest in next session that the cities of Bononia+Patavium+mediolanum+genoa (ingame name escapes me) will be formed into 1 province called Gallia Italica.
Since that province is not under direct threat from anywhere, it should only receive one Legion for defence: Legio Gallia Italica I

(of course, the senate can decide that for other provinces liek big ones or one with a war front, should receive more legions!)


If some ex-consul chooses to govern this province of Gallia Italica, he can set his 'capital' to Bononia and govern that city, while he asks good friend person B to take control of the legion.
He can ask friends B C & D to be quaestor in his other cities.

By distributing he gives his friends good experience(CHARACTER POINTS), who will return him the favour if he ever runs for consul again :)

He can also ask one quaestor more, and control his legion himself.
He then persuades the senate that the Helvetians are stirring unrest and have fought our allies the Aedui. So he asks for a vote for war, wins the vote, ans takes his legion through the alps, capturing a city and earning a triumph!

[everyone]

Provinces are NOT cities.

I know. anyway, I'm coming up with a coloured map of EB with lines drawn on it to define provincial boundaries for groups of regions that we may be conquering in the future. (which means everything up to Baktria, I'm leaving out the steppes because I doubt anyone would support a campaign to destroy the Sauromatae, even in the future; unless we find out that they have expanded south into Armenia)

and what I'm referring to when I'm saying "provinces", "regions" and such are:
city: the capital of the region
region: the area as defined by ingame boundaries
province: a group of regions.

[mini]

Well

I was more intent on making the provinces changeable.

That way, we create a province only when we conquer enough new territory.

Let's say that we conquer the south of greece.
We create (by vote) a province of Lower Graeca.

Then when we conquer athens, we add it to that province temporarily.
Then we conquer Thebe, we add that too

And when we capute Thessaloniki, we can call the vote to create a new province: Graeca Upper.


And if we even grow more, we can change again... and so on.
Naming other regions provinces before we capture them, would be silly.

We can take 1 blank screen of the map, and post this screen in the libary after drawing the current situation.
Should any provinces change, we can take the blank screen and update it and edit the library.


The advantage of making provinces voteable and changeable, is that it creates a dynamic political interaction between factions in the game

For example: House x wants greece as a big province, because this will get them much legions if they can get control over it.
(as a big province will receive more than 1 legion)

House Y wants to prevent this, and try to split op greece in smaller provinces, each with only 1 legion, and then tries to gain control of one of them. Therefore diminishing the power of house X in the region ASWEL as creating a small power foothold in greece for itself :)
of course it can backfire if House x gets enough support to get control of all the small provinces! :D That's a risk to be taken by house Y :D

It will be nice to see the power struggles! :D