Some joyous tidings from Israel

[Hax]

If Israel wanted arabs dead they would be dead.

Hey, wasn't this what they tried to do in Lebanon back in the day? During Hezbollah's defense of Lebanon? In 2006, more Lebanese civilians were killed than Israeli.

So? They still want to kill jews, jews don't want to be killed, tada.

Actually, Hamas itself describes their conflict with Israel as being political, and not religious or anti-semitic.

[Fragony]

Actually, Hamas itself describes their conflict with Israel as being political, and not religious or anti-semitic.

Oh, do they. Must be that then they describe it as such after all. I say deal with it good they have had their chance but lack the self-restraint for peace, the desire to kill is too strong.

and stay down

[Hax]

So, you're basically saying we shouldn't trust Hamas on what they say? I think that make this untruthful as well:

Hamas police spokesman Ehad Ghussein said about 140 Hamas security forces were killed.

[tibilicus]

It will all end badly anyway, only the Gaza civilians will suffer.

Look what happened in Lebanon. The Israeli military which has been pay rolled and funded in billions by the US couldn't defeat Hezboulla on the ground who were armed with a couple of AK's.

To be honest I might care a bit more for Israel if they actually tried to get along with there Muslim neighbours but the thing is they don't. The Arab league of country's called for an agreement where by Israel would keep the land planned out In the original partition plan for Israel. Israel of course refuse and instead of meeting it's neighbours with meetings just prefer to drop bombs on them.

Also people seem to think that they some how have superior claim to the land. What you have to remember the idea of Israel and Zionism was active long before the holocaust and Jewish settlers were arriving long before then to. How I see Israel is imagine if immigrants were coming to your country then all of a sudden decided that your land was now there's because they have religious claim to it. The whole situations is just getting ridiculous.

The fact is Israel can push there weight around in the region as long as the US continues to support them, and don't get it wrong that the US are glad to do this as long as they keep their puppet in the middle east.

[Idaho]

Has Israel declared war? Has it recognised Gaza and it's government as sovereign?

No to both - therefore any 'act of war' is in fact collective punishment and not only illegal but immoral.

[Hooahguy]

It will all end badly anyway, only the Gaza civilians will suffer.

Look what happened in Lebanon. The Israeli military which has been pay rolled and funded in billions by the US couldn't defeat Hezboulla on the ground who were armed with a couple of AK's.

a few AK's? how about that, RPGs, rockets, and more arms sent by iran? hm? not only that, israel did a huge mistake and listened to world opinion, which condemned it for the invasion into lebanon. and if olmert wasnt such a wimp and didnt restrict the IDF, then things would have turned out differently.

To be honest I might care a bit more for Israel if they actually tried to get along with there Muslim neighbours but the thing is they don't. The Arab league of country's called for an agreement where by Israel would keep the land planned out In the original partition plan for Israel. Israel of course refuse and instead of meeting it's neighbours with meetings just prefer to drop bombs on them.

have you looked at the original UN partition plan? it splits israel in two- half palestinian, half jewish. but the jewish part is pretty split up, and each of the 3 main jewish areas are thinly connected. bad position for us. and trans jordan was given to the palestinians as well, remember. so of course israel refused. we were originally in the original partition plan, but then the arab states attacked us hours after the country called israel was established. most of the wars israel was in with its neighbors were started by the arab states. the war for independence, the six day war (israel did a pre-emtive strike- dont tell me israel started it, because you know its false- egypt and syria were stockpiling arms and tanks, ready for an attack) and the yom kippur war. only in the past 2 decades or so israel had been the aggressor, like lebanon and such. btw we are peaceful right now, and probably for a while, with egypt and jordan, and to a certain extent, syria. at least thats what i gather.

Also people seem to think that they some how have superior claim to the land. What you have to remember the idea of Israel and Zionism was active long before the holocaust and Jewish settlers were arriving long before then to. How I see Israel is imagine if immigrants were coming to your country then all of a sudden decided that your land was now there's because they have religious claim to it. The whole situations is just getting ridiculous.

reminds me of the US, doesnt it? technically israel has more right to be in israel than the US does in north america. and what does the zionism movement have to do with anything? btw there have been jews there since the bible. never has there been no jews in the land. we have always been a minority, but still there, since the 2nd temple destruction. we believe that we have a right to the land, just like the indians have a right to N. America.

by your same logic, we should give back all the indians lands back which the settlers bought/took/conquered. right?
same concept.

[tibilicus]

a few AK's? how about that, RPGs, rockets, and more arms sent by iran? hm? not only that, israel did a huge mistake and listened to world opinion, which condemned it for the invasion into lebanon. and if olmert wasnt such a wimp and didnt restrict the IDF, then things would have turned out differently.

I know I was exaggerating. What I was trying to get at still is isn't it surprising that a group of militants armed by a fledgling country (Iran) could defeat a country who's military is supplied by the worlds super power?

have you looked at the original UN partition plan? it splits israel in two- half palestinian, half jewish. but the jewish part is pretty split up, and each of the 3 main jewish areas are thinly connected. bad position for us. and trans jordan was given to the palestinians as well, remember. so of course israel refused. we were originally in the original partition plan, but then the arab states attacked us hours after the country called israel was established. most of the wars israel was in with its neighbors were started by the arab states. the war for independence, the six day war (israel did a pre-emtive strike- dont tell me israel started it, because you know its false- egypt and syria were stockpiling arms and tanks, ready for an attack) and the yom kippur war. only in the past 2 decades or so israel had been the aggressor, like lebanon and such. btw we are peaceful right now, and probably for a while, with egypt and jordan, and to a certain extent, syria. at least thats what i gather.

Even if it did that doesn't matter. Oh and yes I have seen it. As I said earlier I wouldn't have a problem with the Israeli people defending themselves if attacked within the original partition plans but the fact is there not within the partition plans. The decision to previously allow Israeli settlements on the west bank and Gaza just show Israel's greed and it's desire to accumulate the whole territory.

reminds me of the US, doesnt it? technically israel has more right to be in israel than the US does in north america. and what does the zionism movement have to do with anything? btw there have been jews there since the bible. never has there been no jews in the land. we have always been a minority, but still there, since the 2nd temple destruction. we believe that we have a right to the land, just like the indians have a right to N. America.

by your same logic, we should give back all the indians lands back which the settlers bought/took/conquered. right?
same concept.

Ah the bible, with no offence to your religion there is no solid evidence to justify anything in that book so laying claim to a country and land rights purely on a book is ludicrous. Obviously I know there were Jews there before the Arabs but that's like saying the Celtic people were in England before the Anglo Saxons and Normans arrived. Kind of like inviting every Scottish and welsh person to take all of the English peoples land because they had historical claim to it.

And if I could go back in time and had the power of God to give more land to the native Americans yes I would, maybe actually let them have the great plains or something. The fact is though we can't and surely we should learn from history's mistakes? Also native Americans were in fairly small numbers whilst the Europeans were arriving in large numbers. It's the other way round as people are arriving in Israel in small numbers to take the majority's land.

[Hooahguy]

I know I was exaggerating. What I was trying to get at still is isn't it surprising that a group of militants armed by a fledgling country (Iran) could defeat a country who's military is supplied by the worlds super power?

you can ask the same thing about the US in vietnam, and many other conflicts.

Even if it did that doesn't matter. Oh and yes I have seen it. As I said earlier I wouldn't have a problem with the Israeli people defending themselves if attacked within the original partition plans but the fact is there not within the partition plans. The decision to previously allow Israeli settlements on the west bank and Gaza just show Israel's greed and it's desire to accumulate the whole territory.

they were attacked within the partition plan borders, and as the arab forces retreated, the israelis followed, getting more land, because as the arab armies retreated, the Palestinians, hearing about how the jews were gonig to kill them and such, ran with them. with all the empty land, we took it. to the victors goes the spoils. it was wrong, but we did it, and theres no going back. we certainly cant go back now.

Also native Americans were in fairly small numbers whilst the Europeans were arriving in large numbers. It's the other way round as people are arriving in Israel in small numbers to take the majority's land.

really? tell that to the 15,000 native americans who were forced onto the Trail of Tears. there were a lot of indians. they were certainly the majority when the first settlers got there. it was the exact same situation. small amount of settlers would enter the land, then eventually increase. the reason why the israelis increased so rapidly was because after the holocaust, there was no where to go but israel. the US, and most allied countries had strict immigration laws, and most Holocaust survivors were pinned up in DP camps for a long time.