Troubles legacy..

[Tribesman]

Here, again you're not trying to add anything to the discussion, but take away from it.

Actually Vlad it adds a hell of a lot to the discussion as it gets to the core of it .

I hope you're not saying that paid informants and agents were "working for" MI-5 et. al. and therefore the UK government bears some responsibility for the terrorism. Because you are so intentionally vague one can only infer your true meaning.

Vague ?
If someone is paying someone to do a job and in the course of that job the employee has to kill someone then the employer is responsible as well as the employee , if the employee also does his job by killing someone when the guns or explosives have been shipped from Czechoslovaki via libya to Ireland by the employer then the employer and employee are both responsible .
So Vlad would you like to try and argue that the employer was not responsible ?

So back to the core of the issue , the compensation , do you want public enquiries and lots of muck raking to determine case by case all the details of all the killings and who played what role in each of them ?

Or to put it in terms for the fiscally conservative , given the vast amount that a few inquiries have so far cost the taxpayer isn't it prudent to brush it under the carpet and go for the cheap option which is a snip at only £300 million .

[Furunculus]

why hold an inquiry? if we can brush an inquiry under the carpet by agreeing to pay every victim and their murderer a compensation payment then HMG can brush aside the question of whether an ira terrorist tangentially involved in a terror atrocity was in fact a SB/MI5 agent.

I can accept that agents of HMG had to do dirty things to infiltrate the loyalist and republican gangs, and i am perfectly happy with HMG unoffically sanctioning assassinations of republican terrorists, what i cannot accept is republican terrorists or their families receiving compensation because the idiot died as a terrorist.

compensation is recognition of the failure of a Gov't to protect its citizens from terrorist attacks, not recognition that it did its job competantly by knocking off terrorists.

[Furunculus]

agreed. the compensation money is an admission of partial responsibility by the gov't for not protecting its citizens, people who die in the act of commiting terror acts (i.e their living relatives)are not due compensation from anybody.

I can accept that agents of HMG had to do dirty things to infiltrate the loyalist and republican gangs, and i am perfectly happy with HMG unoffically sanctioning assassinations of republican terrorists, what i cannot accept is republican terrorists or their families receiving compensation because the idiot died as a terrorist.

already clarified.

[Vladimir]

and etc

You're also then saying that every intelligence and law enforcement agency around the world is a criminal organization.

[Furunculus]

he is saying that every british intelligence agency involved in NI got up to stuff that was technically illegal, i am saying; so what?

[Incongruous]

You're also then saying that every intelligence and law enforcement agency around the world is a criminal organization.

Not hard to imagine is it?

Lets say that, while they were performing these acts it was not criminal, but after the far reaching consequences have been felt, it is criminal. This is standard in the world of idiotic and short sighted government.

[Tribesman]

You're also then saying that every intelligence and law enforcement agency around the world is a criminal organization.

Errrr...No , not if they operate within the law .

he is saying that every british intelligence agency involved in NI got up to stuff that was technically illegal

There are no real legal technicalities when it comes to outright plain and simple murder .

if we can brush an inquiry under the carpet by agreeing to pay every victim and their murderer a compensation payment then HMG can brush aside the question of whether an ira terrorist tangentially involved in a terror atrocity was in fact a SB/MI5 agent.

The proposal makes no provision for payment to people for being murderers .
Didn't you read it before you went off on one about it ?

[Furunculus]

There are no real legal technicalities when it comes to outright plain and simple murder .

i can cope with what HMG did, i respect the necessity of what was necessary in a dirty war.

[Tribesman]

i can cope with what HMG did

Then you can cope with the after affects ...like paying for it , after all if you can cope with killing people why worry about a little bit of money .

[Furunculus]

wrong. i don't accept that giving the families of terrorists compensation money for being the family of terrorists is just.

the compensation is recognition of partial responsibility by HMG for not protecting her citizens from things such as terrorist attacks.