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Thread: Dear South Texas: WE DON'T CARE ABOUT YOU

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    Old Town Road Senior Member Strike For The South's Avatar
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    Default Dear South Texas: WE DON'T CARE ABOUT YOU

    http://www.cnn.com/2009/WORLD/americ...f=mpstoryemail

    200 American citzens have been killed in the past 5 years by Mexican drug carteles.

    It use to be that you didn't need to worry about getting killed unless you got in deep with the cartels. You keep your nose clean and you'll be ok. Now they kill anyone who seems to be a threat. Cops, reporters, anyone who dares speak out is a target.

    My national government cares more about a dying rust belt and corn belt than my state.

    Of course My state government is run by people from Dallas and Houston and therefore nothing is done about this.

    Mexico is run by the rich whites in the D.F. Most of whom are probably getting paid off.

    But of course we all know the 300 miles between the Rio Grande is filled with Mexicans and crackers dumb enough to set up shop there.

    They have no money or poltical clout. Who cares about them. There cities can be taken over there children can fall in with these Cartels. These cartels which are better armed than the federalies or Rangers.

    Screw them. There voices are to soft to be heard let them get killed off..

    GAH
    There, but for the grace of God, goes John Bradford

    My aim, then, was to whip the rebels, to humble their pride, to follow them to their inmost recesses, and make them fear and dread us. Fear is the beginning of wisdom.

    I am tired and sick of war. Its glory is all moonshine. It is only those who have neither fired a shot nor heard the shrieks and groans of the wounded who cry aloud for blood, for vengeance, for desolation.

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    The very model of a modern Moderator Xiahou's Avatar
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    Default Re: Dear South Texas: WE DON'T CARE ABOUT YOU

    Interestingly, Mexico is now listed right next to Pakistan for governments at risk of rapid collapse.

    Apparently, things are getting pretty ugly down there and with our still porous border, it's unsurprising that some of it is spilling over....
    "Don't believe everything you read online."
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    smell the glove Senior Member Major Robert Dump's Avatar
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    Default Re: Dear South Texas: WE DON'T CARE ABOUT YOU

    I've always been of the opinion that if the US were out break out into some sort of collapse or civil war that South Texas would be a bloody mess thanks to the underpoliced border towns on our side and the heavily armed gangs on their side. My wifes dad has a huge ranch and tract of land right on the border near Uvaldi, a house filled with relic guns and expensive antiques, all sorts of expensive big boy toys, yet he lives alone, has not so much as a dog and doesn't lock his doors. Personally, I think he's insane.
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    Enlightened Despot Member Vladimir's Avatar
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    Default Re: Dear South Texas: WE DON'T CARE ABOUT YOU

    http://www.foxnews.com/printer_frien...491964,00.html

    But it's Fox news so don't trust it. Texas is a passive culture and doesn't believe in preparedness.


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    Senior Member Senior Member Fisherking's Avatar
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    Default Re: Dear South Texas: WE DON'T CARE ABOUT YOU

    Texas officials are planning for the worst-case scenario: how to respond if the violence spills over the border…

    What Strike says is that it has spilled…it just doesn’t seem to be quite big enough for those in Austin to do much about it though…

    All Politicians do is talk. I have no use for them…unless it is as a door stop.


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    Old Town Road Senior Member Strike For The South's Avatar
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    Default Re: Dear South Texas: WE DON'T CARE ABOUT YOU

    How many Texans have to be killed before plans become action? If these were "proper" Texans something would be getting done.
    There, but for the grace of God, goes John Bradford

    My aim, then, was to whip the rebels, to humble their pride, to follow them to their inmost recesses, and make them fear and dread us. Fear is the beginning of wisdom.

    I am tired and sick of war. Its glory is all moonshine. It is only those who have neither fired a shot nor heard the shrieks and groans of the wounded who cry aloud for blood, for vengeance, for desolation.

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    RIP Tosa, my trolling end now Senior Member Devastatin Dave's Avatar
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    Default Re: Dear South Texas: WE DON'T CARE ABOUT YOU

    Quote Originally Posted by Strike For The South View Post
    How many Texans have to be killed before plans become action? If these were "proper" Texans something would be getting done.
    Its sad, we waste billions, and dare I say trillions on inner city slime and continue to allow decent Americans to fend for themselves against the southern border invasion. This country is being Balkanized and no one gives a crap.
    RIP Tosa

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    Old Town Road Senior Member Strike For The South's Avatar
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    Default Re: Dear South Texas: WE DON'T CARE ABOUT YOU

    Quote Originally Posted by Devastatin Dave View Post
    Its sad, we waste billions, and dare I say trillions on inner city slime and continue to allow decent Americans to fend for themselves against the southern border invasion. This country is being Balkanized and no one gives a crap.
    Thats a pile of horse This has to do with Mexican gangs killing American citizens. The people in San Antonio, Laredo, Harlingen, McAllen and Chourps are some of the best Americans I know. But when there offed people assume because there Mexican they had it coming or that they don't speak english and therefore must be part of the gang.

    The people being crapped aren't inner city chollos, thats why this is such a big problem.

    Nevermind that many of these Mexican aren't immigrants and don't even speak bloody Spanish.

    This country is going to become balkanized if we let these citizens cries fall on deaf ears. When they are forced to go to the gangs for protection when the gangs get a permanent foothold here. Then we will be balkanized.
    Last edited by Banquo's Ghost; 02-21-2009 at 13:00. Reason: Language
    There, but for the grace of God, goes John Bradford

    My aim, then, was to whip the rebels, to humble their pride, to follow them to their inmost recesses, and make them fear and dread us. Fear is the beginning of wisdom.

    I am tired and sick of war. Its glory is all moonshine. It is only those who have neither fired a shot nor heard the shrieks and groans of the wounded who cry aloud for blood, for vengeance, for desolation.

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    RIP Tosa, my trolling end now Senior Member Devastatin Dave's Avatar
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    Default Re: Dear South Texas: WE DON'T CARE ABOUT YOU

    Quote Originally Posted by Devastatin Dave View Post
    Its sad, we waste billions, and dare I say trillions on inner city slime and continue to allow decent Americans to fend for themselves against the southern border invasion. This country is being Balkanized and no one gives a crap.
    Quote Originally Posted by Strike For The South View Post
    Thats a pile of horse This has to do with Mexican gangs killing American citizens. The people in San Antonio, Laredo, Harlingen, McAllen and Chourps are some of the best Americans I know. But when there offed people assume because there Mexican they had it coming or that they don't speak english and therefore must be part of the gang.

    The people being crapped aren't inner city chollos, thats why this is such a big problem.

    Nevermind that many of these Mexican aren't immigrants and don't even speak bloody Spanish.

    This country is going to become balkanized if we let these citizens cries fall on deaf ears. When they are forced to go to the gangs for protection when the gangs get a permanent foothold here. Then we will be balkanized.
    Well then, good luck Muchacho...
    Last edited by Banquo's Ghost; 02-21-2009 at 13:02. Reason: Edited quote
    RIP Tosa

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    Old Town Road Senior Member Strike For The South's Avatar
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    Default Re: Dear South Texas: WE DON'T CARE ABOUT YOU

    Anywhere else and the country would be up in arms. If it was Goodson instead Gonzalez the Nat'Guard would be there.

    I would use first names but they've all been anglicized, Those rotten non-assimilating immigrants.
    There, but for the grace of God, goes John Bradford

    My aim, then, was to whip the rebels, to humble their pride, to follow them to their inmost recesses, and make them fear and dread us. Fear is the beginning of wisdom.

    I am tired and sick of war. Its glory is all moonshine. It is only those who have neither fired a shot nor heard the shrieks and groans of the wounded who cry aloud for blood, for vengeance, for desolation.

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    Corporate Hippie Member rasoforos's Avatar
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    Default Re: Dear South Texas: WE DON'T CARE ABOUT YOU

    Ahhh


    The sweet aroma of angry Republicans...


    ...that is what you get when you live in a country that tries to (create and then) clean up other peoples' mess as a method to ignore the mess back home.


    Although in the case of Mexico, the U.S is beginning to harvest the crops of it's own policies. If money was spent in a serious effort to improve the Mexican economy and infrastructure then the problems of crime and illegal immigration would be much less. But as far as I can see, even mentioning the idea, raises a whole army of rednecks chanting 'they took our jobs and gave em to Mexicans!'
    Last edited by rasoforos; 02-21-2009 at 06:00.
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    Old Town Road Senior Member Strike For The South's Avatar
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    Default Re: Dear South Texas: WE DON'T CARE ABOUT YOU

    Quote Originally Posted by rasoforos View Post
    Ahhh


    The sweet aroma of angry Republicans...


    ...that is what you get when you live in a country that tries to (create and then) clean up other peoples' mess as a method to ignore the mess back home.


    Although in the case of Mexico, the U.S is beginning to harvest the crops of it's own policies. If money was spent in a serious effort to improve the Mexican economy and infrastructure then the problems of crime and illegal immigration would be much less. But as far as I can see, even mentioning the idea, raises a whole army of rednecks chanting 'they took our jobs and gave em to Mexicans!'

    What? Do you even know what this is about? Do you know who lives in South Texas?
    There, but for the grace of God, goes John Bradford

    My aim, then, was to whip the rebels, to humble their pride, to follow them to their inmost recesses, and make them fear and dread us. Fear is the beginning of wisdom.

    I am tired and sick of war. Its glory is all moonshine. It is only those who have neither fired a shot nor heard the shrieks and groans of the wounded who cry aloud for blood, for vengeance, for desolation.

  13. #13
    Corporate Hippie Member rasoforos's Avatar
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    Default Re: Dear South Texas: WE DON'T CARE ABOUT YOU

    SFTS

    I know that criminality is leaching from Mexico to South Texas. Are we in agreement here?

    I understand your anguish about the government not doing much. My belief (having lived near a border that seperated countries of vastly different income levels) is that it could all have been avoided if the U.S had used some of its vast resources to ensure high employment levels and adequate infrastructure in Mexico. It never did, giving in to concerns that U.S jobs would be lost, and thus contributed to the current state of Mexico.
    Last edited by rasoforos; 02-21-2009 at 17:41.
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    Old Town Road Senior Member Strike For The South's Avatar
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    Default Re: Dear South Texas: WE DON'T CARE ABOUT YOU

    Quote Originally Posted by rasoforos View Post
    SFTS

    I know that criminality is leaching from Mexico to South Texas. Are we in agreement here?

    I understand your anguish about the government not doing much. My belief (having lived near a border that seperated countries of vastly different income levels) is that it could all have been avoided if the U.S had used some of its vast resources to ensure high employment levels and adequate infrastructure in Mexico. It never did, giving in to concerns that U.S jobs would be lost, and thus contributed to the current state of Mexico.
    Mexico has plenty of funds and adequate infrastructure. It's one of the more developed countries in the world. We aren't talking about Somalia here. We also invest plenty into Mexico. Ever heard of the Maquiladoras? The drugs is what the criminals are selling. These aren't petty criminals these people kill whomever get in there way of there pushing. More funds has jack all to do with it.
    There, but for the grace of God, goes John Bradford

    My aim, then, was to whip the rebels, to humble their pride, to follow them to their inmost recesses, and make them fear and dread us. Fear is the beginning of wisdom.

    I am tired and sick of war. Its glory is all moonshine. It is only those who have neither fired a shot nor heard the shrieks and groans of the wounded who cry aloud for blood, for vengeance, for desolation.

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    Senior Member Senior Member Idaho's Avatar
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    Default Re: Dear South Texas: WE DON'T CARE ABOUT YOU

    All of you miss the point. The prohibition infrastructure has created a massive powerful and rich criminal network able to locally overpower law enforcement.

    The US govt should buy coke at 10c a gram and heroin at 5c a gram from growers, and give it away to whoever wants it.

    No inner city crime
    No criminal gangs

    The only problem is that govts and society at large has to take responsibilty for the human desire for narcosis.
    "The republicans will draft your kids, poison the air and water, take away your social security and burn down black churches if elected." Gawain of Orkney

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    Ultimate Member tibilicus's Avatar
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    Default Re: Dear South Texas: WE DON'T CARE ABOUT YOU

    A sorry situation indeed.

    Maybe with all the other task forces the world is forming to fight threats such as terrorism and piracy in somalia amongst other things we should have a world wide clamp down on these drug cartels who ship tons of cocaine over the border every year.

    I remember reading some where that the gangs are getting bigger and getting a bigger foot hold in the states. I believe one of these gangs is called MS13?

    Anyone care to inform me on the situation?


    "A lamb goes to the slaughter but a man, he knows when to walk away."

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    Old Town Road Senior Member Strike For The South's Avatar
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    Default Re: Dear South Texas: WE DON'T CARE ABOUT YOU

    Quote Originally Posted by tibilicus View Post
    A sorry situation indeed.

    Maybe with all the other task forces the world is forming to fight threats such as terrorism and piracy in somalia amongst other things we should have a world wide clamp down on these drug cartels who ship tons of cocaine over the border every year.

    I remember reading some where that the gangs are getting bigger and getting a bigger foot hold in the states. I believe one of these gangs is called MS13?

    Anyone care to inform me on the situation?
    There have always been gangs here on the border. The problem is Zeta and MS-13 are bigger and more ruthless than anything ever seen before.

    I agree with Idaho that we should legalize that stuff but I don't believe that will help as the gangs will make sure the growers don't sell
    There, but for the grace of God, goes John Bradford

    My aim, then, was to whip the rebels, to humble their pride, to follow them to their inmost recesses, and make them fear and dread us. Fear is the beginning of wisdom.

    I am tired and sick of war. Its glory is all moonshine. It is only those who have neither fired a shot nor heard the shrieks and groans of the wounded who cry aloud for blood, for vengeance, for desolation.

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    Member Member Alexander the Pretty Good's Avatar
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    Default Re: Dear South Texas: WE DON'T CARE ABOUT YOU

    They can make sure the Mexican growers don't sell. Surely a little American know-how will get us producing all sorts of goodies in our backyard - who will then pay taxes and stimulate the economy! Win-win!

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    Corporate Hippie Member rasoforos's Avatar
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    Default Re: Dear South Texas: WE DON'T CARE ABOUT YOU

    Quote Originally Posted by Strike For The South View Post
    Mexico has plenty of funds and adequate infrastructure.
    I will have to disagree. I respect your opinion, anf you clearly have a hands on experience of the situation since you live there, but a look at the economic figures might change your mind. If it isn't economic deprivation that causes high crime rates then what is it?
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    L'Etranger Senior Member Banquo's Ghost's Avatar
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    Default Re: Dear South Texas: WE DON'T CARE ABOUT YOU

    Quote Originally Posted by rasoforos View Post
    I will have to disagree. I respect your opinion, anf you clearly have a hands on experience of the situation since you live there, but a look at the economic figures might change your mind. If it isn't economic deprivation that causes high crime rates then what is it?
    Rather a lot of things, actually, invariably in complex interaction.

    For example, by any standards, Chad has far greater economic deprivation than Mexico, but they don't have a high crime rate or a drugs war. (Unless you count occasional scuffles over khat).

    Indeed, one might make a case from the revelations during this current economic climate that in fact, extreme wealth causes high crime rates.

    Just because people are poor, doesn't mean they turn criminal.
    "If there is a sin against life, it consists not so much in despairing as in hoping for another life and in eluding the implacable grandeur of this one."
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    Corporate Hippie Member rasoforos's Avatar
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    Default Re: Dear South Texas: WE DON'T CARE ABOUT YOU

    No Banquo you misunderstand me here...

    Of course poverty is not always an indication of high crime rates. (There is a proven negative correlation between GDP per capita and crime rates of course but that is besides the point)

    However, I believe that,when an impoverished country borders a rich country then the criminal elements of the former leach into the latter. Also, the people of the poor country have very few opportunities of becoming rich but a lot of chance to observe their rich neighbors and wish for that sort of life.

    By investing in the poorer country and giving its people a comfortable life and realistic options for them to obtain wealth through legal means you make crime a less attractive option and thus reduce cross-border crime.

    Of course the US had and sort of still has a lot of 'Giant Sucking Sound' enthusiasts who did not see the benefits of making sure Mexico is stable prosperous and relatively wealthy.

    Ironically my Irish friend your country is a good example of how a lil bit of good Foreign Direct Investment can transform an economy and make a poor country prosperous. The US invested heavily on far away countries because it was more acceptable and theoretically would not destroy jobs (not true of course but people bought it). Mexico was generally left out.

    To clarify things a bit. Of course the factor presented in my argument is not the only contributing factor. Just a major one in my oppinion.
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    Senior Member Senior Member Idaho's Avatar
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    Default Re: Dear South Texas: WE DON'T CARE ABOUT YOU

    Quote Originally Posted by Strike For The South View Post
    There have always been gangs here on the border. The problem is Zeta and MS-13 are bigger and more ruthless than anything ever seen before.

    I agree with Idaho that we should legalize that stuff but I don't believe that will help as the gangs will make sure the growers don't sell
    Why would criminals be able to control a legal market? The profits won't be sufficient to warrant criminal involvement. We don't get gangs controlling the coffee or tequila trade do we?
    "The republicans will draft your kids, poison the air and water, take away your social security and burn down black churches if elected." Gawain of Orkney

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    L'Etranger Senior Member Banquo's Ghost's Avatar
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    Default Re: Dear South Texas: WE DON'T CARE ABOUT YOU

    Quote Originally Posted by rasoforos View Post
    No Banquo you misunderstand me here...
    My apologies then. Thank you for the clarification.

    Quote Originally Posted by rasoforos View Post
    However, I believe that,when an impoverished country borders a rich country then the criminal elements of the former leach into the latter. Also, the people of the poor country have very few opportunities of becoming rich but a lot of chance to observe their rich neighbors and wish for that sort of life.
    Disparity of wealth is certainly an indicator, I would agree. This is true within societies as much as between them, and without knowing as much as Strike about the specifics, I might look to intra-cultural wealth disparity within the Mexican population straddling the border as a driver for this criminal activity.

    However, legal differences providing opportunity for exploitation are more likely to be the main cause here, I think. During Prohibition in the US, the northern border with Canada was a hotbed of smuggling and criminal activity - not because Canada was an order of magnitude poorer, but because booze was legal there. I suggest that this situation (in respect of enforcement) is much more pertinent to the Mexican frontier - but perhaps, manpower made easier to find because of fewer economic options.

    Quote Originally Posted by rasoforos View Post
    Ironically my Irish friend your country is a good example of how a lil bit of good Foreign Direct Investment can transform an economy and make a poor country prosperous.
    Well made point, and particularly in reference to the move away from northern terrorism. However, those terror groups are now drug gangs (well, they always were) and wickedly violent still. So economic prosperity in the Republic has not removed the drugs wars, rather undermining your proposed solution.
    "If there is a sin against life, it consists not so much in despairing as in hoping for another life and in eluding the implacable grandeur of this one."
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    Corporate Hippie Member rasoforos's Avatar
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    Default Re: Dear South Texas: WE DON'T CARE ABOUT YOU

    Banquo

    I sometimes hate envy you for being able to pose arguments in such a well-constructed and linguistically immaculate way.

    I see your point and I cannot disagree to it.

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    Old Town Road Senior Member Strike For The South's Avatar
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    Default Re: Dear South Texas: WE DON'T CARE ABOUT YOU

    Quote Originally Posted by rasoforos View Post
    I will have to disagree. I respect your opinion, anf you clearly have a hands on experience of the situation since you live there, but a look at the economic figures might change your mind. If it isn't economic deprivation that causes high crime rates then what is it?
    Mexico has the 10th largest economy in the world and the northern states have the highest HDI. If we were talking about petty crime than I'd agree but these gangs are very rich. Poor people really don't play a role in this equation. Even the crooked cops don't take bribes because there poor. They take them because they don't want to die.


    Quote Originally Posted by Idaho View Post
    Why would criminals be able to control a legal market? The profits won't be sufficient to warrant criminal involvement. We don't get gangs controlling the coffee or tequila trade do we?
    But these criminals never made there living off tequila.
    There, but for the grace of God, goes John Bradford

    My aim, then, was to whip the rebels, to humble their pride, to follow them to their inmost recesses, and make them fear and dread us. Fear is the beginning of wisdom.

    I am tired and sick of war. Its glory is all moonshine. It is only those who have neither fired a shot nor heard the shrieks and groans of the wounded who cry aloud for blood, for vengeance, for desolation.

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    Senior Member Senior Member Idaho's Avatar
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    Default Re: Dear South Texas: WE DON'T CARE ABOUT YOU

    Quote Originally Posted by Strike For The South View Post
    But these criminals never made there living off tequila.
    Who would you rather buy cocaine off: a registered centre with quality controlled product, health advice and cheap; or a corner dealing handing out vague amounts of something in little plastic bags for lots of money? The gangs wouldn't last a month.
    "The republicans will draft your kids, poison the air and water, take away your social security and burn down black churches if elected." Gawain of Orkney

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    Enlightened Despot Member Vladimir's Avatar
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    Default Re: Dear South Texas: WE DON'T CARE ABOUT YOU

    I agree with Idaho. Let's legalize everything to eliminate crime!


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    Praefectus Fabrum Senior Member Anime BlackJack Champion, Flash Poker Champion, Word Up Champion, Shape Game Champion, Snake Shooter Champion, Fishwater Challenge Champion, Rocket Racer MX Champion, Jukebox Hero Champion, My House Is Bigger Than Your House Champion, Funky Pong Champion, Cutie Quake Champion, Fling The Cow Champion, Tiger Punch Champion, Virus Champion, Solitaire Champion, Worm Race Champion, Rope Walker Champion, Penguin Pass Champion, Skate Park Champion, Watch Out Champion, Lawn Pac Champion, Weapons Of Mass Destruction Champion, Skate Boarder Champion, Lane Bowling Champion, Bugz Champion, Makai Grand Prix 2 Champion, White Van Man Champion, Parachute Panic Champion, BlackJack Champion, Stans Ski Jumping Champion, Smaugs Treasure Champion, Sofa Longjump Champion Seamus Fermanagh's Avatar
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    Default Re: Dear South Texas: WE DON'T CARE ABOUT YOU

    Quote Originally Posted by Idaho View Post
    Who would you rather buy cocaine off: a registered centre with quality controlled product, health advice and cheap; or a corner dealing handing out vague amounts of something in little plastic bags for lots of money? The gangs wouldn't last a month.
    Government run? You'd replace criminals with bureaucrats?

    How about stopping the prohibition -- I agree that the current approach to the War on Drugs is self-defeating -- and then letting private industry take over.

    Government running the sale and distribution end would just shift the crime groups from criminal drug gangs to criminal smugglers.

    Government should set purity standards, publish health warnings, and police fraud.


    Drugs are and infama, but government prohibitions of such things have never worked unless and until the government ruthlessly attacked the market side of the equation. So unless you want to continue wasting money and lives to interdict a product with a viable market, the Gov is better off getting out of the game.
    "The only way that has ever been discovered to have a lot of people cooperate together voluntarily is through the free market. And that's why it's so essential to preserving individual freedom.” -- Milton Friedman

    "The urge to save humanity is almost always a false front for the urge to rule." -- H. L. Mencken

  29. #29
    This comment is witty! Senior Member LittleGrizzly's Avatar
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    Default Re: Dear South Texas: WE DON'T CARE ABOUT YOU

    Personally i would have recreational drugs sold in either pharmacy's or police stations. I don't understand what you mean about the gangs being smugglers instead, if the goverment was growing (or buying) and selling (through intermediataries) so there would be no profit in smuggling drugs ??

    Let's legalize everything to eliminate crime!

    Let's have the goverment make every activity with the slightest bit of risk illegal for our own good!
    In remembrance of our great Admin Tosa Inu, A tireless worker with the patience of a saint. As long as I live I will not forget you. Thank you for everything!

  30. #30
    Arena Senior Member Crazed Rabbit's Avatar
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    Default Re: Dear South Texas: WE DON'T CARE ABOUT YOU

    I am, oddly enough, going to agree somewhat with Idaho.

    A lot of this violence has to do with the spectacular failure of our drug war.

    It has little to do with the US not spending enough money on Mexico. Poverty is not causing the violence, nor would giving Mexico lots of money end poverty there.

    There are very violent gangs, like MS-13, that would still be a problem, though I think a huge amount of the border violence would dissipate.

    CR
    Ja Mata, Tosa.

    The poorest man may in his cottage bid defiance to all the forces of the Crown. It may be frail; its roof may shake; the wind may blow through it; the storm may enter; the rain may enter; but the King of England cannot enter – all his force dares not cross the threshold of the ruined tenement! - William Pitt the Elder

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