Starting with P&MTW

[Peasant Phill]

As the XL mod is giving me problems, I decided to try a different mod. My eye fell on Pike &Musket 1.5 by Cegorah.

This mod will probably use different tactics which I'm unfamiliar with (I'm more of a early and viking campaign man). Which faction and era should I choose that will give me the opportunity to learn the new tactics (read forgiving enough)?
What tactics would that be?
Where can I find the units and unit stats for that specific faction?


Thanks in advance.

[The Lizard Pope]

It's an unfinished mod so I suggest that you start with one of the western powers. The muslim and steppe armies have far fewer unit and building types.

You are best starting off in an early era as you'll be familiar with a lot of the units: pikemen, arbalesters, lancers and shock infantry armed with halberds or two-handed swords. Gunpowder units are not very effective until later when muskets and regimental cannons (you'll love these) arrive, until then arbalests are your missile weapon of choice.

There is a large difference in strength between the major and minor powers. Spain have the most powerful military of the early era and are a good first choice. The central European countries have good cavalry but might not have the financial muscle that the Spanish or French kings can command. The Swedes are the first to adopt modern military techniques but they have small armies and start in a difficult position as they have to fight the Russian bohemoth for control of the Baltic. The Italian states are small but rich and have access to the best in western soldiers, they were my choice to start with

Tactics vary with country and era. For early western European states pike, shock troops, arbalesters and cavalry are used much as you'd find in MTW. Pike and heavy cavalry units are expensive to raise and maintain so keep their use to a minimum. Pike are very tough, deal out a lot of damage in melee and have excellent morale so are hard to rout. You'll have to use missile troops to disrupt them before melee. Arbalesters are great at this and you can never have enough of these excellent troops. Shock troops are used to attack the flanks of shaken pike units and some can even hold off cavalry. I use some gunpowder units to affect the morale of enemy pike but they aren't essential. Cavalry are used much as in MTW. It's all about combined arms and using a variety of units to their best effect. I have a core of 2-3 pike, 3-4 shock infantry units, 4 arbalesters, 2-4 cavalry (mainly lancers) and maybe 2 arquebus units. The A.I loves pikes and will field them in large numbers

This changes as gunpowder becomes more effective. The introduction of the musket means that pike become less important. Muskets are best deployed in long thin lines which are vulnerable to cavalry. Armies are now lines of muskets backed by pike or halberds to counter enemy cavalry and shock infantry. As soon as you can build regimental cannons do so, I usually field four batteries of these. It's all about maneuvering your troops to deliver maximum firepower while remaining protected from enemy cavalry. As guns become more effective you find yourself fielding melee infantry less and less. Eventually it's just muskets, cavalry and artillery.

There's some information in the forum but as it is an unfinished mod there's a lot figure out by yourself. You will have to come to terms with this new era in warfare, much like the Europeans at the time had to do. It's one of my favourite mods, Cegorah has done a fine job.

[seireikhaan]

Well, a few things I would say:

First of all, for starting factions. Spain is my recommendation. They have lots of titles, lots of rich provinces, access to elite late troops as well as having early stalwarts to boot. Additionally, some very powerful historical generals, like Pizzarro and Cortez who emerge early. Plus, the tactical situation of Iberia gives an easy to defend situation, unlike France who can get ganged up on.

Battles are a very different monster for most factions in this game. Early on, the best units will be "mercenary" units who require an inn to be trained. These include a couple variants of pikes, a musket unit, and a zweihander unit. The pike and zweihander units are incredibly powerful in melee, and will decimate almost all non-merc units in melee. The musket mercs are fairly substandard in melee, particularly in comparison to the pikes and zweihanders, but are your best bet for trying to wear down the giant pike units who, though very powerful and pretty well armoured, are quite slow.

Early cavalry include light lancer units who basically exist to run down archers(yes, there are some still left around to train in the "early" period of the game) and muskets. They hold no water in melee and are generally quite weak. After a bit though, you'll be able to start caracole units, who are essentially mounted pistol wielding troops. These guys are great for harassing the pikes and zweihanders for ages and ages, particularly in western europe and the eastern steppes.

As the game progresses, you'll get to a point where you can start training more "native" pikes who are comparable to to the mercs, at least as Spain. Spain has various Tercio units who are considerably cheaper(not that the Spanish need to be thrifty ). Other factions tend to be later coming in such native powerhouses. Anyways, after a bit you'll get to the point where battles are basically, well, pike and musket battles (). Battles can turn into giant, field long skirmishes of each army trying to out-position the other while trying to concentrate fire onto individual units to cause routing. Lots of fun.

Also, if you're in the mood for a bit of exploitation, regimental cannons are monstrously powerful units. Mobile cannons who fire in barrages of four shots. Quite accurate, and given they only have four men each, they pile up valor like crazy. I had a battle as the Ottoman Turks(defensive one, I should point out) where I literally had zero casualties against an army of roughly 1300, because I parked on a very steep hill and had 6 units of regimentals, in addition to a lot of muskets and horse archers. Enemy never got within firing range.



Factions to watch out for(ie, the powerhouses): Spain, Ottomans, Russians, and potentially the French. Russia will often stampede Eastern Europe with giant armies of very poor and badly trained troops and will often simply smother other factions with a giant zerg rush. Spain and France are both extremely rich and have lineups stuffed with powerful troops from top to bottom. Ottomans start with a lot of territory and have some of the game's best troops in the mid-game.



Hope that helps.

[Peasant Phill]

Thanks a lot for the advice.

I was considering Spain, France and Italian states to start with. Apparently Spain is the way to ease into the mod so I'll go with that. I'm more of an early and viking age general so a forgiving faction is really what I need.

[seireikhaan]

I must offer my apologies Phill.

I forgot one rather important thing for early starts. Cavalry is NOT going to be 'light lancers' as I stated, at least so long as you're in Europe and not using border riviers. The show in the west can be WON early on with men at arms and Lancers, both of which are absolutely insanely heavy cavalry. They have so much armor that that they actually resist early bullet fire. Plus, they can tear most units pre-mercenary period to pieces. The catch to beating and using them is fatigue. Play as though you were in the deserts of Sinai, as even in lush western Europe, they get very exhausted very easily. If fresh, they are almost unbeatable. However, if exhausted, they are incredibly slow, and I've actually repelled, with few casualties, men at arms in the past with town militia. As if you're wondering, yes, town militia are quite lousy.

[Geezer57]

Where can I find the units and unit stats for that specific faction?

You should be able to get some idea of unit stats by using the Gnome Editor and loading in the UNIT_PROD.TXT file, yes?

[Peasant Phill]

I was a bit startled when I started my Spanish campaing in the 'age of exploration'.

- Apparently you can't see the size of armies in the field by their banners.
- Both factions Portugal & Aragon (obvious choices to protect once flank) are to strong to attack just yet.
- Although grenada is in rebel hands, it seems it'll take multiple years before I can take the province with reasonable casualties.

On the plus side I immediatly have acces to a 8-star general (with title) and a 5-star general (again with title) on top of the king.

Proposed early strategy:
1) Take Grenada ASAP with as little casualties as possible and perhaps go as far in North Africa without stretching my resources to thin.
2) Build up an army to take on Portugal or Aragon (Whichever seems to be the easiest target) to set up the bottlenecks that'll protect the homelands.


The biggest problem so far:
I have absolutly no idea what the men at my disposal are to be used or what they are capable of.
What do I use Ballesteros or arbelasters?
Are Rondeleros shock troops?
What units should I build ASAP?
...

[seireikhaan]

Are you sure you have the latest version of P&M? I believe in my version, Granada is a playable faction. ~

Anyways, for troops:

Ballesteros are superior to arbalesters. They function nicely to decimate troops at a distance, and are capable flankers as well.

I believe Rondeleros are capable enough as early foot sloggers, but they will perish utterly against men at arms and lancers.

A combination of Rondeleros, Ballesteros, and Celadas(light cavalry, but irresistable charge can shatter units who've been softened by Ballesteros)should suffice very nicely for the time being.

One more thing to keep in mind: the tercio upgrades are built, much like a building. They require a variety of basic military buildings, although they are not officially listed. I remember the one that really buggered me for a while was the horse farmer-- the tercio requires that to be "built". Also, make sure to build gunsmisths- you need them for both the gun upgrade lines, but also for the Tercio, which is a whole other deal entirely.

Piquero make good foot sloggers after Rodeloros.

[Peasant Phill]

thanks.

Btw I play version 1.5 which I understood was the latest version.

[seireikhaan]

thanks.

Btw I play version 1.5 which I understood was the latest version.

I just checked my own version. Granada is rebel. So strange... I could have sworn they were a faction.

[Peasant Phill]

It's been a while since I had the chance to continue my campaign. I conquered rebelheld Granada without much trouble. I wanted to go a step further and invade Marocco (also rebel held) to secure a nice one province border to the south. However, it didn't come to that:
I seem unable to land a force from the Spanish mainland into Marocco although the landbridges are visible on the map.

1) Are there still landbridges in this mod? If there are, which ones?

No problem, I think, I'll just have to put a ship in the right sea lane. But apparently I can't put a ship there.

2) Is there a specific ship (type) I need? I believe I tried both deep sea ships as well as coast faring ships (at least the ones I got from the start)

[seireikhaan]

The straight of Gibraltar is considered a sea-blocker of sorts in Pike and Musket. You cannot link a navy directly from Gibraltar to the Atlantic for the purposes of invasion or trade, though you can ultimately fill all the correct lanes. This was done to prevent any one faction from become so ungodly rich they could practically buy their way to victory, as well as putting a stop to the Danes invading Egypt directly. You also cannot use Gibraltar as a land-bridge; that has indeed been removed. Only factions from the south and east of the straight can put a ship in the straight, though they can go no further than that. Assuming you are linking ships on your eastern front, what you should do is link ships to the eastern Atlantic(the big sea zone that serves little purpose in regular MTW) and put another ship on the coast of Africa. This should enable an invasion of Morocco. Or, you could build ships from the east and link from Valencia down the straight, and launch an invasion from your eastern seaborde. Lastly, make sure there isn't a large rebel fleet standing in the way. Its entirely possible you haven't ever yet declared war on the rebels, and the rebel fleets don't feel comfortable attacking yours, though they do still impede any naval invasions of rebel provinces.

[Peasant Phill]

Thanks, that explains a lot.