Tax Levels -- When do they accrue?

[Hiroshi-O'Duff]

I assume (based on most of the rest I've seen in the game) that my tax level really only matters financially if it's changed in AUTUMN. Is this correct?

Is it conceivable (and preferrable) to set the tax rate to the lowest level all year long, then set it to PUNITIVE in AUTUMN?

Summary: Do they pro-rate your taxes based on every selection all year long?

Duff

[smoothdragon]

Yeah, set the tax rate low for most of the year and then punitive in Autumn. The people will be pissed off for a season, but then feel happy for the other three seasons. That would balance it out in your favor, since you don't collect taxes in the other three seasons anyway.

[Shiro]

Many consider this a form of cheating, but whatever you want.

[Hosakawa Tito]

Consider it political diplomacy.If the AI didn't get to deficit spend it would do this too.Stinking underhanded politicians.
Tito

[solypsist]

in this case, both sides are right.
it is taking advantage of technicality that the game designers didn't consider (whoever griped about poor game-testing a month ago should've made his point using this example) but in the case of beginners or weak players who need some sort of advtantage to beat the AI (short of using actual cheat codes) this is a good way to do it. Plus there's the fact that we, as human beings, make mistakes and there's always the chance of forgetting to reset/lower the tax rate, resulting in a tidal wave of revolts, which may deter any further tax-rate manipulation.

[Zen Blade]

Personally, I would like to see this dealt with in the patch, but doubt it will.

It could be fixed quite easily in having the screen pop up each autumn and ask, "what level of taxes do you wish my lord?" That would be the only allowable time to change it. Very simple to impliment and very realistic.

-Zen Blade

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Zen Blade Asai
Red Devil
Last of the RSG
Clan Tenki Council-Unity

[Shiro]

Nice idea Zen! Let's hope they really do read the forums.

[This message has been edited by Shiro (edited 04-19-2001).]

[Catiline]

I got caught playing at this trick this afternoon, marching across Japan as Shimazu, all of a sudden my troop production centres were churning out troops for Ronin with all my armies at least 3 turns away, unless i used the port bug.

Where'd that autosave get to?

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It's not a bug, it's a feature

[celtiberoijontychi]

i don't think using ports to defend ur own province is a cheat.
when a rebellion occurs, u get the message and have 1 turn to deploy troops for defense. At this point, the province is still yours, so there is no bug

[The Bear]

If you don't have to punch in a cheat code, it's not a cheat,it's not a bug, it's a feature (sorry Catiline). In any case , whatever get's you throught the night, it's alright (sorry John)...

[Forward Observer]

There seems to be a lot of debate over whether playing with the tax rate or using the so called "port bug" is cheating, but it is always possible that the designers planned these as unwritten strategies to be discovered by the player. Since amphibious landings were practiced, this really could have been planned feature. The tax rates are a bit iffy, but then a 110% tax rate doesn't make mathematical sense in the first place.

When you win at the game you are really only successfully overcomming the challanges set down in programing by the designers. Using these feature or tricks could also be looked on as exactly the same thing. You can carry the fair play idea to all extremes. For example attacking a 240 man army with an army of 900 from the rear doesn't seem quite fair either, but the game allows it, and if that's what you need to do to win ,you will do it. Remember: "All's fair in love and war" Just food for thought.

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Artillery adds dignity to what would otherwise be a vulgar brawl.



[This message has been edited by Forward Observer (edited 04-19-2001).]

[solypsist]

you're right, Forward Observer & The Bear it's your game and you're free to play it as you see fit.
game players range from a very easygoing type to a very self-disciplined sort, each with preferences on how to approach a game. By now some of the more veteran players have begun to set restrictions in order to keep the challenge of the game, and sometimes we forget that some players in earlier stages of playing just want to see what's around and test the AI. I know my first few weeks of playing I was using port-attacks and using an unlimited camera-view with no battle timer, just to have fun and avoid getting beaten by a (pre-patch 1.12) computer programmed to beat me. I even used the koku cheat just toget allthe stuff to see what it would do.
Anyway, yes, right now it's debatable whether the port-attack and tax-rate loopholes are cheating or part of the game, just understand that when people say it's cheating, they're not accusing you of being a poor player, just voicing their opinions from where they're at wit hthe game right now.

[henryh]

I did not know about the tax cheat loophole is this why most people on the forum seem to only mention shinobi as a ninja/geisha defense. I use about 1-2 or more in each (stable) province to keep taxes at about 125% or 110% all year round. When you consider 500 koku equals 20% farm growth I think that the 2 shinobi(200 koku) are very worthwhile. No upkeep costs unlike troops.

[ShaiHulud]

Henry... that's not cheating...hehe, that's despotism!

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Wind fells blossoms, rain
fells steel,yet bamboo bends and drinks

[henryh]

Hey I'm just wondering how many people use this feature? I read some of the Jo Beare's and Shaihulud's strategies( for expert level) and in those games I consistently find I am skint and the computer tends to have higher revolt settings. Making my high tax strategies hard to implement from the outset because I have to put in an outlay for shinobi of 500 + (ungarissioned terris *200) which I never seem to be able to afford because I am always involved in an arms race with the other players. Who all seem to pick on me now matter how carefully I choose my foes.

[Hiroshi-O'Duff]

I love the feedback. Thanks, all. Fact is, I generally kept it on NORMAL until this most recent game -- I was lazy, and never thought about it -- but this time around, I've noticed that I really NEVER need to lower it off of punitive after the first few months.

When I conquer a new territory, I generally have several HUNDRED units there, defending from additional rebuttal attacks. Until I get past ODA's wall of armies, I'll have no trouble keeping my territories happy. The problem will come when I break through and make a mad dash through his territories -- then I'll need to lower the rate or bring in shinobi to keep the populace happy.

Either way, thanks for the fantastic feedback, all.

Duff

[ShaiHulud]

Henry, Duff...... In my present campaign I just ran Shimazu out of 5 provinces in two turns with a total 1k of troops. If my taxes were set to punitive I'd be facing a lot of rebellions.

I think it's a clever idea, having loads of shinobi and taxes maxed. But, like the man said, it's costly to do so early, if ever. I've got a thin screen of shinobi on my defensive lines, nothing in the interior (am playing Oda). Their purpose is to catch ninja. (starting as honor 1, they do so often!)They are also all I could afford. Maybe a string of great harvests would allow it, tho.

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Wind fells blossoms, rain
fells steel,yet bamboo bends and drinks

[This message has been edited by ShaiHulud (edited 04-19-2001).]

[Zen Blade]

*bump*

---out of hope that the EA ppl will visit again and see our suggestions, comments on something that deserves a bit of tweaking.

-Zen Blade

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Zen Blade Asai
Red Devil
Last of the RSG
Clan Tenki Council-Unity