How is Multiplayer?

[t1master]

from the ccs forums...

Also a steam problem which is why baz couldn't join other peoples games I discovered is infact due to location. Americans can't play with europeans for instance. It's all to do with where you set your locatrion to in steam so everyone will need to change to the same continent if they want to play together.

so coupled with no apparent general lobby, it makes it hard for the old community to get together and play as in the past.

is this so for those who are playing online?

[miniwally]

no-one was on :( anywhere to arrange times at when people will be on in this forum?

[RTKBarrett]

from the ccs forums...



so coupled with no apparent general lobby, it makes it hard for the old community to get together and play as in the past.

is this so for those who are playing online?

Yep it was a nightmare for me... heres a basic look at the problems with the game atm *Excuse the lack of numbering points, i copy and pasted*

Units get tired too easily. Charges go into thin air. Cavalry lose formation too easy. Infantry can run away from cavalry in formation. Square formations are made of rubber infantrymen. Commands get ignored. Groups bug out. You hear random clicking sounds as if from the UI activity of other players. You can't see shot range on snow, because it's grey on grey. Impeding objects fail so bad that they carefully avoided putting any on MP maps. Single player is a collection of bugs and AI quirks & cheats.

[Kanamori]

Yep it was a nightmare for me... heres a basic look at the problems with the game atm *Excuse the lack of numbering points, i copy and pasted*

Units get tired too easily. Charges go into thin air. Cavalry lose formation too easy. Infantry can run away from cavalry in formation. Square formations are made of rubber infantrymen. Commands get ignored. Groups bug out. You hear random clicking sounds as if from the UI activity of other players. You can't see shot range on snow, because it's grey on grey. Impeding objects fail so bad that they carefully avoided putting any on MP maps. Single player is a collection of bugs and AI quirks & cheats.

Have you played MTW VI? Because if they scaled the running around down to the old fatigue system... i'd love it, and also threw the kill rates down (I have no idea if this was balanced in MP with valor/armor or not). And I disliked the chargefest that the powerful charges rome-m2tw made... but I haven't played Empires yet...

Are the formation problems worse than they were in Rome and M2 (first ranks only charging and cavalry fanning out to never group back in and actually attack the unit they're supposed to be attacking)?

[Kenchi_Sulla]

Have you played MTW VI? Because if they scaled the running around down to the old fatigue system... i'd love it, and also threw the kill rates down (I have no idea if this was balanced in MP with valor/armor or not). And I disliked the chargefest that the powerful charges rome-m2tw made... but I haven't played Empires yet...

Are the formation problems worse than they were in Rome and M2 (first ranks only charging and cavalry fanning out to never group back in and actually attack the unit they're supposed to be attacking)?

I haven't really noticed speed problems with the units so far. Cavalry charges as a unit. It just takes you some time to disengage, which is fine I think. Kill rate in shooting and melee seems good to me. Ofcourse if you like amazing slaughtering charges and cavalry blobbing you'll be dissapointed.

Artillery, which was a major concern to me, is really fun to use. Its a tactical asset on the battlefield but they are vulnerable as well. I find they are most vulnerable to sharpshooter units (skirmishers).

Also, they seem to have balanced the game around the "medium" and "large" money settings we get.

I am a happy camper so far. I would like to hear other peoples opinions on how to improve though

[Tomisama]

I couldn’t believe when I saw that people were complaining about no lobby or chat in the lobby.

The game is inside one of the largest game player lobbies on the planet, it’s called Steam.

You can see everyone interested in the game, if they are online, see if they are playing, send them a message, chat in text or voice, all both inside and out side the game you may be in.

You can create groups, join groups, and create friends lists of people both inside and out side your groups, create group chat rooms and invite people, or get invited.

The possibilities to find and communicate are basically unlimited.

Check my signature link below. You will see I belong to 5 groups.

Empire Total War at 1, 074 members

Empire Multiplayer at 122 members

Code of Honour at 18 members

Clan Wars Competition at 11 Members

The Imperial Guard at 4 members

Plus 12 friends

That's 1,241 people that play Empire, that I have literally at my fingertips (some of course are in multiple groups) .

Not to mention that all active games are visible, and have possibilities to join or watch with players I may or may not already know yet.

And if you don’t have time to chat, and just want to find a quick game, Steam will set up a match for you in minutes.

Who needs a lobby?

[Crazed Rabbit]

Yeah, there's no direct lobby like in MTW, but there's steam; you can chat with all sorts of individuals, join group chats, invite people to games.

Ive played four MP battles against my roommate. We're 50-50.

Report on one of the battles;

Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 

Today, I got a big Polish army with 4 Winged Hussars and 5 Uhlans. He had a standard british set up ( we were in late and agreed to no arty, as it ruins the experience [at least in late era, exploding shells+mortars =mass death It forces you to charge immediately to keep your loses down or lose a significant fraction of men before you engage {and arty doesn't run out of ammo}]). He set up stakes around his army, I used my long range inf to take him out and sent my cav in through the side. I was winning until then, when my cav met the inf squares, which destroyed my winged hussars (heaviest cav in the game, I've read they had spears that let them hit past the bayonets) and other cav. My inf by that point was pretty toast, so i lost. :(

So a new game, he goes Poland I go America. Some wooded map. He's got an all light dragoon and winged hussar army. I've got a standard US army (substituted inf for arty).

Lucky for me, this map has an outcropping of rock. The only entrance is at the base of the hill. The raised part slopes up with the hill, surrounded on the three higher sides by rock:
........................
....+++++++++....
....+---------+....
....+---------+....
....+---------+....
....+---------+....
....//\\//\\//\\//....

...=grass outside of outcropping. + = rock --- = area on the top of the outcropping // = stakes

The top part of this image is higher up on the hill. So I had my four units of long rifle men set up stakes at the base - two rows of them. I hide all the rest of my army behind the stakes, except for four units of cav. I had my line inf form up into four squares right behind the stakes (as squares seem much more effective than just a line of infantry, even receiving the charge to the front [too effective]).

........................
....++++++++++....
....+----------+....
....+----------+....
....+----------+....
....+[]-[]-[]-[]+....
....//\\//\\//\\//....

[] = squares

So he's got to charge his army through two rows of stakes and into squares of line inf. First he dismounts some dragoons and charges in, getting sniped by my long rifle men behind the squares. I charge my cav into the rear of the dragoons and they run.

Next comes the grand hussar charge. He loses a third of them to the stakes, and the rest shortly thereafter. Not one of my inf units is below 50% men. It's a slaughter - 600+ of his 700+ dead, and i lose only 250 or so (mostly my cav outside the 'fort').

Good times.

CR

[PanzerJaeger]

I'm not really digging the loss of a chat lobby either, but I haven't really used steam very much to meet opponents in other games, so it may be fine.

I've played a few MP games and I'm still collecting my thoughts. I do agree with CR's assessment:

( we were in late and agreed to no arty, as it ruins the experience [at least in late era, exploding shells+mortars =mass death It forces you to charge immediately to keep your loses down or lose a significant fraction of men before you engage {and arty doesn't run out of ammo}]).

As it stands now, I think MP will need a dedicated group who agree on some standard rules. Jumping in random games has been hit or miss for me. Luckily, Steam seems to be a good way to organize such games.

[Swoosh So]

I couldn’t believe when I saw that people were complaining about no lobby or chat in the lobby.

The game is inside one of the largest game player lobbies on the planet, it’s called Steam.

You can see everyone interested in the game, if they are online, see if they are playing, send them a message, chat in text or voice, all both inside and out side the game you may be in.

You can create groups, join groups, and create friends lists of people both inside and out side your groups, create group chat rooms and invite people, or get invited.

The possibilities to find and communicate are basically unlimited.

Check my signature link below. You will see I belong to 5 groups.

Empire Total War at 1, 074 members

Empire Multiplayer at 122 members

Code of Honour at 18 members

Clan Wars Competition at 11 Members

The Imperial Guard at 4 members

Plus 12 friends

That's 1,241 people that play Empire, that I have literally at my fingertips (some of course are in multiple groups) .

Not to mention that all active games are visible, and have possibilities to join or watch with players I may or may not already know yet.

And if you don’t have time to chat, and just want to find a quick game, Steam will set up a match for you in minutes.

Who needs a lobby?

Totalwar does, your multiplayer group has a grand total of 122 members thats pretty poor by any standard. And for the simple fact that about 50 people here say no lobby and your the first to mention these groups. So its likely imo that new mp players may not even use the groups and not become part of the totalwar community.

The groups will have to be used ofc by the community now and its good u pointed it out, im sure most people will join these groups now, but reallly you want an in game lobby so the new players can dive straight into the community b4 they get fed up and leave with 1 off games.

I mean picture a new player getting beat in games, they have nowhere to discuss after the battle if they dont know about the groups, probably will get frustrated and leave.

On another note im waiting on some friends reports about the game and if its good ill probably buy it and sign up to these groups (for lack of a better option). I would ask that the org make these group details front page news at some point soon if they can to help the mp community get started, i mean org is 3rd totalwar page on google and in a position to get the ball rolling.

[ELITEofWARMANGINGERYBREADMEN88]

You have to have a Lobby Tomisama. How the hell can you tell then if your buddy is doing SP or MP, or is AFK or not? I can't tell who's in MP or who's not just because they are on in the CWC group or ETW .Org Group.....

[RTKBarrett]

Have you played MTW VI? Because if they scaled the running around down to the old fatigue system... i'd love it, and also threw the kill rates down (I have no idea if this was balanced in MP with valor/armor or not). And I disliked the chargefest that the powerful charges rome-m2tw made... but I haven't played Empires yet...

Are the formation problems worse than they were in Rome and M2 (first ranks only charging and cavalry fanning out to never group back in and actually attack the unit they're supposed to be attacking)?

Yes i have played mtw and VI and from what i can remember, the fatigue system was nowhere near as drastic as this... picture the scenario. You have just lost all your artillery pieces and begin walking up the map towards the enemy line... naturally with 200 or so metres to go u speed up to engage with a frontal charge. Your cavalry at this point will be be warmed up, which is not unusual. However when engaging with another cavalry unit quick signs being to appear that your cavalry are not up to the task *whether they are superior or not statistically wise*. Thirty seconds of melee and the unit becomes tired, very tired and finally exhausted. Any flank from an infantry firing will rout the unit engaged instantly which is to be expected.

However if your unit survives and routs the enemy, you are left with a useless unit as:

A) Its charge has no punch whatsoever, less so than any heavy cav fully exhausted in mtw
B) Some soldiers of the unit wont respond and will walk whilst the others "sprint"
C) Infantry will still be fresh/warmed up and can easily finish off the unit

As far as the formation changes. It seems that units will sometimes "forget" orders and will hang back.. ive sometimes rushed in with 5 units of line inf thinking "wait, wheres my 6th?!"...

Oh he has the order on the UI card and when i press space to confirm his course of direction, its there. However hes not interested.

The kill rates in skirmish are reasonably high but charging headfirst into a volley is pretty much suicidal.. which makes this game pretty static, sit still and watch your men shoot. If you move to counter a position and get shot... you will lose any benefit of a ridge with the losses sustained.

If you ever played NTW, you will be upset to know that the lordz mod is superior in pretty much all forms of gameplay. Artillery are accurate to the point where they can be considered balanced and not luck factored. Infantry skirmishing abilities are strong but kill rates are low giving more variety and time to prepare a charge. Cavalry pack a punch and have reasonable stamina levels.

You might be able to tell i am extremely dissapointed with this game...