5th Rate Model = 4th Rate?

**NimitsTexan** · 03-05-2009, 08:53

Seriously, who picked the model for the 5th Rate? It has two full gun decks, plus gunports cut on the quarterdeck . . . it is, as far as I can tell, an obvious two-decker. Now, FLS has some notion of what a frigate is supposed to look like, as the 6th Rate, Carronade frigate, and 24lbs, and even the Razee frigate all use more or less 5th Rate-ish models. So who was the genious that decided the standard 5th Rate should be a two-decker?

**Jack Lusted** · 03-05-2009, 09:13

Seriously, who picked the model for the 5th Rate? It has two full gun decks, plus gunports cut on the quarterdeck . . . it is, as far as I can tell, an obvious two-decker.

Correct, it is based on the 44-gun ships used by the Royal Navy that were used in a similar role to frigates. And it is not the same as the 4th Rate.

**Fisherking** · 03-05-2009, 09:26

Originally Posted by Jack Lusted

Correct, it is based on the 44-gun ships used by the Royal Navy that were used in a similar role to frigates. And it is not the same as the 4th Rate.

Thanks Jack!

I for one never knew about those.

It sounds like a case of too light to fight, too heavy to run. But my game has not come yet…

Can you tell us about the best Frigates? At least in game terms.

You would appear to have a special interest in this field also.

Thanks again for the quick clarification!

**Sir Beane** · 03-05-2009, 09:50

Originally Posted by Fisherking

Thanks Jack!

I for one never knew about those.

It sounds like a case of too light to fight, too heavy to run. But my game has not come yet…

Can you tell us about the best Frigates? At least in game terms.

You would appear to have a special interest in this field also.

Thanks again for the quick clarification!

Carronade frigates are probably the best Frigates. They carry carronades for a super-heavy broadside, in exchange for limited effective range. They hit very hard up close however.

**Fisherking** · 03-05-2009, 09:53

Originally Posted by Sir Beane

Carronade frigates are probably the best Frigates. They carry carronades for a super-heavy broadside, in exchange for limited effective range. They hit very hard up close however.

But I don’t want to get that close with a Frigate!

You have the game…give us some movement and other stats on them!

**Sir Beane** · 03-05-2009, 09:56

Originally Posted by Fisherking

But I don’t want to get that close with a Frigate!

You have the game…give us some movement and other stats on them!

I only saw them once in a Custom battle

. I might try and fit them into a quick guide I'm aiming to write today or tomorrow, to go into the Empire Summary Thread.

**Tsavong** · 03-05-2009, 10:03

According to wikipedia Fifth Rates at the start of the 18th century were generally "demi-batterie" ships, carrying a few heavy guns on their lower deck (which often used the rest of the lower deck for row ports) and a full battery of lesser guns on the upper deck. However, these were gradually phased out, as the low freeboard (the height of the lower deck gunport sills above the waterline) meant that it was often impossible to open the lower deck gunports in rough weather. From mid-century, a new Fifth Rate type was introduced - the classic frigate, with no ports on the lower deck, and the main battery disposed solely on the upper deck.

Sixth Rate ships were generally useful as convoy escorts, for blockade duties and the carrying of dispatches; their small size made them less suited for the general cruising tasks the Fifth Rate frigates did so well. Essentially there were two groups of Sixth Rates. The larger category comprised the Sixth Rate frigates of 28 guns, carrying a main battery of twenty-four 9-pounder guns, as well as four smaller guns on their superstructures. The second comprised the "post-ships" of between 20 and 24 guns, too small to be formally counted as frigates (although colloquially often grouped with them), but still requiring a post-captain (i.e. an officer holding the substantive rank of Captain) to take command.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rating_...the_Royal_Navy

**NimitsTexan** · 03-05-2009, 20:31

Originally Posted by Jack Lusted

Correct, it is based on the 44-gun ships used by the Royal Navy that were used in a similar role to frigates. And it is not the same as the 4th Rate.

Well, that's sort of depressing . . . the demi-batteries were generally useless (and in my opinon, ugly as well) and phased out in favor a single deck 38s by the second half of the E:TW period . . . I really wish E:TW had used one of the various 32/36/38 gun 5th Rates as a model, especially as the ship in game is descrivebed (and used) as a traditional frigate.

That, or a traditional frigate should have been offered as an upgrade to the demi-batterie 5th rate (same firepower, but more manuverable).

**Fisherking** · 03-05-2009, 20:48

The stats are here: https://forums.totalwar.org/vb/showthread.php?t=113781

As I said in an earlier post, I think they did some things for convention that I may have done a bit differently.

Frigate speed for one big one! These were usually the fastest sailers in the fleet, and with good reason.

But I won’t go all technical at the moment. I wonder what the American Heavy Frigates look like?

It will surely give us something to mod.