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Thread: Has a surrender ever been accepted?

  1. #1

    Default Has a surrender ever been accepted?

    Out of curiosity, since I hit this button every time to see if it does anything, has anyone ever seen the AI accept a surrender? The most meaningless provincial territory defended by two 0-rank militia will happily refuse the option against two full stacks of late period veteran units, is this another case of the backend code simply ignoring any other outcome?

  2. #2

    Default Re: Has a surrender ever been accepted?

    I've attempted numerous times but to no avail! I mean I'm curious about when it works and what happens if they do accept. I guess they just retreat and give the town to you. I guess this made sense with what CA promised concerning the AI being able to judge the importance of a battle... which I haven't seen yet because I've never seen them retreat from a battle.

  3. #3
    Praeparet bellum Member Quillan's Avatar
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    Default Re: Has a surrender ever been accepted?

    Full stack against 2 armed populace = no surrender. That's been my experience.
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  4. #4
    Senior Member Senior Member Barkhorn1x's Avatar
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    Default Re: Has a surrender ever been accepted?

    All these towns seem to be peopled with fanatical volksturm who fight to the death - EVERY time.

    I hope this get's fixed as towns in this era did not fight on when the deck was clearly stacked against them.
    "Après moi le déluge"

  5. #5

    Default Re: Has a surrender ever been accepted?

    Well from a money standpoint, the armed populace dying in battle cost nothing, they kill your troops for free.

    I honestly don't think I will ever see a surrender, as the AI puts a premium on real estate.

  6. #6

    Default Re: Has a surrender ever been accepted?

    Maybe some sort of auonomous AI for each city so that the populace will only fight if it thinks it can win as a normal populace would not normally fight.

  7. #7
    The drunken Duke Member Suraknar's Avatar
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    Default Re: Has a surrender ever been accepted?

    Nope never happened either, I think some functionality is missing somewhere in the AI.
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  8. #8
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    Default Re: Has a surrender ever been accepted?

    Not in my experience, and I've had some pretty lopsided odds.
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  9. #9

    Default Re: Has a surrender ever been accepted?

    I've had a successful demand for surrender. The whole province doesn't switch over, just some of the units defending disband. I suspect it has something to do with happiness in the settlement, but I haven't really tested it yet.

  10. #10
    Member Member Skott's Avatar
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    Default Re: Has a surrender ever been accepted?

    I try it almost before every battle and no luck so far. Even with a full stack vs 1 enemy unit its always been rejected. I'm guessing its borked.

  11. #11
    ex Lord Member Melvish's Avatar
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    Default Re: Has a surrender ever been accepted?

    I never succeeded in obtaining surrender . Is it a bug or a feature i wonder? Sometime in history armed citizenry could be downright stubborn and refuse surrender even when facing impossible odds.

    Battle of Saint-Eustache, Canada December 14, 1837
    UK forces: 1,280 infantry(veteran), 220 militia, 5 cannons, 1 rocket battery; CO: John Colborne (Waterloo hero)
    Patriot forces : 200 armed (some without firearms) citizenry ; CO: Jean-Olivier Chénier (physician, no army background)

    Colborne offer to spare the town if rebel accept surrender into captivity : refused.

    result :
    UK : 3 dead
    Patriot : 70 dead, 120 captured, CO dead and excommunicated for having fought on holy ground
    Town and Church looted then burned.
    Last edited by Melvish; 03-24-2009 at 04:26.
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  12. #12
    Slixpoitation Member A Very Super Market's Avatar
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    Default Re: Has a surrender ever been accepted?

    Hey, history quiz time!

    While this is the Lower Canadian side of things, what happened in Upper Canada?

    Name the battle if you please. :D
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  13. #13
    ex Lord Member Melvish's Avatar
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    Default Re: Has a surrender ever been accepted?

    Battle of Montgomery's Tavern, Canada, December 7, 1837
    UK forces: ~1000 (regulars and militiamen), 1 gun; CO : James Fitzgibbon (hero of the Canada-USA war of 1812)
    Republic of Canada forces : 210 well armed militia (seized a Toronto armory, defeated UK forces and killed Colonel Robert Moodie on December 5); CO: Anthony Van Egmond (Dutch Napoleonic War veteran)
    ~300 unarmed citizenry; CO: William Lyon Mackenzie

    result:
    UK: 1 dead, 5 wounded
    Republic of Canada: 3 dead, 5 wounded, forces routed. Anthony Van Egmond captured, William Lyon Mackenzie escaped

    Tavern looted then burned


    Republic of Canada flag
    Last edited by Melvish; 03-24-2009 at 04:35.
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  14. #14
    Member Member Phog_of_War's Avatar
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    Default Re: Has a surrender ever been accepted?

    Quote Originally Posted by Melvish View Post
    Battle of Montgomery's Tavern, Canada, December 7, 1837
    UK forces: ~1000 (regulars and militiamen), 1 gun; CO : James Fitzgibbon (hero of the Canada-USA war of 1812)
    Republic of Canada forces : 210 well armed militia (seized a Toronto armory, defeated UK forces and killed Colonel Robert Moodie on December 5); CO: Anthony Van Egmond (Dutch Napoleonic War veteran)
    ~300 unarmed citizenry; CO: William Lyon Mackenzie

    result:
    UK: 1 dead, 5 wounded
    Republic of Canada: 3 dead, 5 wounded, forces routed. Anthony Van Egmond captured, William Lyon Mackenzie escaped

    Tavern looted then burned


    Republic of Canada flag


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  15. #15
    Village special needs person Member Kobal2fr's Avatar
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    Default Re: Has a surrender ever been accepted?

    Quote Originally Posted by Melvish View Post
    Battle of Montgomery's Tavern, Canada, December 7, 1837
    UK forces: ~1000 (regulars and militiamen), 1 gun; CO : James Fitzgibbon (hero of the Canada-USA war of 1812)
    Republic of Canada forces : 210 well armed militia (seized a Toronto armory, defeated UK forces and killed Colonel Robert Moodie on December 5); CO: Anthony Van Egmond (Dutch Napoleonic War veteran)
    ~300 unarmed citizenry; CO: William Lyon Mackenzie

    result:
    UK: 1 dead, 5 wounded
    Republic of Canada: 3 dead, 5 wounded, forces routed. Anthony Van Egmond captured, William Lyon Mackenzie escaped

    Tavern looted then burned


    Republic of Canada flag
    1500 guys slugging it out, and only 4 dead, 10 wounded total ? What the hell kind of battles do they have in Canada ?
    Anything wrong ? Blame it on me. I'm the French.

  16. #16
    Villiage Idiot Member antisocialmunky's Avatar
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    Default Re: Has a surrender ever been accepted?

    Hugging battles.
    Fighting isn't about winning, it's about depriving your enemy of all options except to lose.



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  17. #17

    Default Re: Has a surrender ever been accepted?

    Does anyone know the mechanics for how surrender *should* work? Ie, if you surrender, do you get to withdraw the garrison before the city falls? In which case, maybe it's a feature put in for the forthcoming mp campaign? And the AI just doesn't know how to use it?

  18. #18
    Member Member Liberator's Avatar
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    Default Re: Has a surrender ever been accepted?

    I think the surrender issue is intertwined with the fact that there is no more city looting.
    I mean - why should they surrender? If you could threaten them, like "surrender or we rape your city to the ground and burn your women", there would be a reason to surrender. But for the ordinary town people, nothing changes after a city is conquered.
    Last edited by Liberator; 03-24-2009 at 15:16.
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  19. #19
    Member Member Mr Frost's Avatar
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    Default Re: Has a surrender ever been accepted?

    Quote Originally Posted by Melvish View Post
    ... result :
    UK : 3 dead
    Patriot : 70 dead, 120 captured, CO dead and excommunicated for having fought on holy ground
    Town and Church looted then burned.
    I see they brought the top shelf irony on that day
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  20. #20
    ex Lord Member Melvish's Avatar
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    Default Re: Has a surrender ever been accepted?

    Quote Originally Posted by Kobal2fr View Post
    1500 guys slugging it out, and only 4 dead, 10 wounded total ? What the hell kind of battles do they have in Canada ?

    Well the thing is that it more like 210 rebels entrenched into the tavern vs ~1000 green infantry & militia. The other unarmed 300 did not take part in the battle. The British forces marched on the tavern but wavered after a couple of volley from the rebel holed into the tavern. Then Fitzgibbon brought up a cannon and started to shell the building. The rebel got the hint that their position was compromised and they decided to exhibit Anglo-Saxon commonsense and escaped while they still can.

    At the battle of Saint-Eustache it went very differently because the Patriot where facing crack British troops. They were entrenched into the church but Colborne was using his cannon and rocket to slowly turn the church to rubble. They left the church and formed the line to meet the British to show them foolish Frenchman courage. After 1 (some say 3) exchange(s) 70 of them lied dead and many more were wounded. Those that where not wounded try to flee but most are shot or captured.

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    @Mr Frost: French Canadian have the reputation of having a great sense of humor...
    Last edited by Melvish; 03-24-2009 at 17:31.
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  21. #21
    Heir to the Scottish Throne Member Relic's Avatar
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    Default Re: Has a surrender ever been accepted?

    Mhm. Unfortunately they all seem to believe in martyrdom.

  22. #22

    Default Re: Has a surrender ever been accepted?

    Quote Originally Posted by Liberator View Post
    I think the surrender issue is intertwined with the fact that there is no more city looting.
    I mean - why should they surrender?
    So the non-citizen units can escape to fight on more favorable terms later.

    A couple militia units aren't even going to slow a full stack of late-period units down. They will all die inflicting a dozen casualties, and then the AI needs X money and Y turns to replace them before you get to the next battle in the area.

  23. #23
    Slixpoitation Member A Very Super Market's Avatar
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    Default Re: Has a surrender ever been accepted?

    These aren't real battle you guys. Well they are, but they are extremely lopsided from the beginning. You Amis, Euros, and others have your glorious rebellions and we Canadians get a few drunk guys getting way in over their head and surrendering after a few shots...
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  24. #24
    Village special needs person Member Kobal2fr's Avatar
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    Default Re: Has a surrender ever been accepted?

    Quote Originally Posted by A Very Super Market View Post
    [...] and we Canadians get a few drunk guys getting way in over their head
    As far as I know, that's how all revolutions get started :)
    Anything wrong ? Blame it on me. I'm the French.

  25. #25
    Gognard Member MikeV's Avatar
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    Wink Re: Has a surrender ever been accepted?

    Quote Originally Posted by Ordani View Post
    Out of curiosity, since I hit this button every time to see if it does anything, has anyone ever seen the AI accept a surrender? The most meaningless provincial territory defended by two 0-rank militia will happily refuse the option against two full stacks of late period veteran units, is this another case of the backend code simply ignoring any other outcome?
    Appears to be unimplemented. Think of it as an opportunity for them to add a "cool new feature" in a future patch.
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  26. #26
    Member Member TB666's Avatar
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    Default Sv: Re: Has a surrender ever been accepted?

    Some people have reported to have gotten the AI to surrender but it does seem to be a rare cases and still no idea what triggers it.

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