Next step - eco sim?

[loony]

I was jus wondering, how the next TW is going to look like. And the more I think, the more it is going to be like a diplomacy/economy simulation.

In the 18th century there still were professional armies and mercenaries and the troops required long drills to be an effective force on the field. However, as technology progressed already during the french revolution we saw conscription and masses of inexperienced soldiers who were just a tat less effective than those with a lot of time and treasure invested in them.

With the times going forward and the technology allows for even the least experienced troops to pack a punch, it is obviuos that the whole "getting an edge" will completely result on:
a) proper economy and technology
b) population control (enough body mass for armies and content enough to fight form not against you)
c) logistics and procurement (economy and strategic map movement)
d) diplomacy

What do you think?
Would you guys actually like a more strategic perspectivel; to be more of a manager/strategist that general/warrior?

[Phog_of_War]

For what its worth, I kind of hope we get a Feudal Asia type game as the next Total War.

That said, what you describe sounds like too much micro-management for me personally. You know the battles are not going to go away in TW games because if they did we would just have a really good looking game of Risk. The balancing act that all goverments have to play with taxation/repression vs. the happiness of the common mob is intresting in its own right but, well, its just boring if it were by itself.

Besides, being a General and sending your brave, beautiful boys off to die glorious deaths is....fun, in a viceral kind of way

[Hollerbach]

There are games that focus mainly on the kind of issues raised in the first post, such as the Europa Universalis series. However TW games have always been, in the end, about war and battle and hence will always have more warfare than might be considered 'historically accurate' (depending on the time period, some periods were bloodier than others). I don't see a problem with this. If the campaign system in TW became too elaborate such that it was a complete game in itself (i.e. as elaborate as say CivIV) then the battles would become annoying things you want to get through to get back to the real game!

Generally the balance in terms of gameplay is pretty good in TW games, which is what makes them so popular I think.

[Beskar]

In a future TW game, I would like to see some real combat. Combat where it is far more tactical than it is currently. At the moment, it is pretty much "lets go into line opposing each other and fire". It is rather basic and full of big open spaces. I would like to see real artillery firing and exploding, which creates an impact on the battle field, so for example, units can use caters for cover. Have units actually fighting in cities properly with smarter AI which hides behind lamp posts, and can run down alley ways. Have some hero units, and by hero units, I don't mean units with totally imba stats, have them with better stats obviously, but they are only really effective if you use them right (these would be rakes for example which can play in battles) which can be used to assassinate the commander and making a really big dent in the enemy forces by doing this. A "fog of war" on the battle field. Ever get annoyed how the enemy can see you a squad on the otherside of the map behind a forest of trees with no explanation?



Have different things playing a big impact. On the campaign strategy, there be more variables and situations. Dynamic borders opposed to just set territory. Allow there to be rebels, but not in the sense of Barbarian Invasion or the way it is in game now, but rebels having far more options, able to recruit, able to hit+run, to be able to do things in the game which is it is currently limited by.

[Meneldil]

What you're describing is Europa Universalis. CA will never go that way, because ultimately, TW games are not supposed to be complex simulations. Economy and diplomacy are minor parts of the game.

[quadalpha]

Anyone with me on wanting to see an operational phase before battles? Your deployment on the battle map can depend on how well you did in the operational phase.

[Mailman653]

Well, based on that survey that came out last month. The ideas they have floating around is a STW type game, an 1800-1860's TW game, a WW I TW game and a Greece TW.

[Warhammer3025]

No love for the pike and musket era? Damn philistines

[Bob the Insane]

No love for the pike and musket era? Damn philistines

There is, however Pikes have not exactly been a strong point of any of the CA releases...

I mean, the RTW pikes where problems the best realized (if not the prettiest). In M2TW, pike where initially awful but some modders improved the Pikes. However it was difficult to coax the AI into using the right. The the early Pike units of ETW have the same core issue, they raise the pikes on contact with the enemy...