France: too weak in the game? (given the current province lineup)

[Slaists]

Is it just me or is France really too weak given the current province lineup? I am not talking about the case when a player controls it but rather when the AI does.

In my last three games:

1) France always lost Alsace to Wuttenberg early in the game
2) Subsequently French main province got taken either by the Dutch or Savoy...
3) Given #1 & #2, France ceases to exist...

I feel, in the XVII century (especially while the Sun King is around) all neighbors (such as Savoy and the Dutch) should be trembling with fear from the French and covering behind their walls rather than successfully destroying France in the first decades.

I suspect, breaking up the huge blob that the current mainland France is into a few provinces would solve the problem.

[Kikosemmek]

Oddly enough, I never saw that happen. France is quite the force in all of my games, and stationed two armies within my borders (that are still there, mind you, even after I took away their military access privileges).

In my first campaign, I took France and Alasce-Lorraine. In my second game, France is still a world power and seem to be doing well. They have more than one army in France and a near full-stack in Alasce-Lorraine.

The faction that I find getting destroyed prematurely is Austria (by the 1720s, in both of my games, they were either destroyed or in their last province, which I think is Transylvania), usually by Poland-Lithuania and Prussia simultaneously, but mainly the by the former. I also saw the trend of Prussia booming to power early, and then losing to a behemoth Poland-Lithuania, who then impinge on my own borders.

[JeromeBaker]

I have seen France be strong and weak, but it depends on which faction I am. When I play as Prussia I usually draw all the attention from Europe factions which means France gets to be quite strong. When I play as GB or UP, I smash the french navy early on and they sputter out and are never a threat during the game. I dont like to play as France because their starting provinces dont interest me much. I agree that they should divide France into having at least one extra region.

[anweRU]

I agree that France should have at least one more region. The French AI (along with the Spanish AI) is seriously handicapped with the amount of territory it has to build up, vs. the armies it needs to maintain in Europe. UP can eliminate France by 1703. Not a very realistic scenario!

My personal opinion is that the minor nations should be seriously cut. Their income is too large vs. their holdings, and they can field larger armies than major nations! France should not be out-gunned by Wurtemberg!

[Fisherking]

I have not seen a game where France was a dominant military power.

I think I saw them take Savoy once and maybe Wurttemberg once but never a great power.

It has been the most prestigious faction in a game or two and seems to have a lot of tech advancements.

I also see the other powers suffering from time to time but I do think that France could be stronger.

But all the major factions seem to have those troubles at times. With the possible exception of Russia, who seems to have an easy time with all but player factions.

[Sheogorath]

France in my games almost inevitably gets locked into a stalemate with Savoy. Apparently the French AI is unwilling to capture cities in Europe, so they just kick Savoy out of their territory, then Savoy comes along with a fresh army and kicks the French forces back to Paris...then a fresh French force shows up and returns the favor...
And it just goes on and on and on...

[Slaists]

I have seen France be strong and weak, but it depends on which faction I am. When I play as Prussia I usually draw all the attention from Europe factions which means France gets to be quite strong. When I play as GB or UP, I smash the french navy early on and they sputter out and are never a threat during the game. I dont like to play as France because their starting provinces dont interest me much. I agree that they should divide France into having at least one extra region.

Well, oddly enough, in my last three games (the ones I described in which the French were destroyed) I was playing Prussia and I did not touch the French (even not so much as to being at war with them) before they were wiped out.

I agree that France should have at least one more region. The French AI (along with the Spanish AI) is seriously handicapped with the amount of territory it has to build up, vs. the armies it needs to maintain in Europe. UP can eliminate France by 1703. Not a very realistic scenario!

My personal opinion is that the minor nations should be seriously cut. Their income is too large vs. their holdings, and they can field larger armies than major nations! France should not be out-gunned by Wurtemberg!

I suspect that's the key: the strategic map AI of the colonial empires does not prioritize holding European territory enough.

As to the minor powers: I don't want them weaker. I'd like the major ones stronger...

[Slaists]

heh. I fired up another VH Prussia campaign the other day. first 20 years highlights:

1. Wuttenberg destroyed France by 1715 and is attacking Spain now...
2. Westphalia destroyed the Dutch (1718) they're at war with Spain too...

Prussia (me) had nothing to do with it...

A different highlight: Polish declared war on Prussia (me). I defeated them in two battles and offered peace for 1000. The gem of the answer I received was: "no, no, no, we offer peace + 6000!..." I guess, Poland had an annoying budget surplus.

[anweRU]

France was still alive and kicking with its two European provinces instact when I finished my short Swedish campaign last night. It gave Wurtemburg a bloody nose early on, so W parked its bloodied stack on the bridge between Alsace and its capital, and kept it there for the next 30 years or so. The French built up several stacks, but never captured Flanders from the Dutch, despite having clear superiority (3 stacks at border + 1 in Paris + 2 Spanish stacks parked in Flanders vs. 2 Dutch stacks).

It did lose its Canadian provinces to the British, after first capturing Maine and Boston. Unfortunately for the French, I bought Jamaica from the Brits a few turns earlier, so there was a fun counter-march by the Brits. The same turn the French captured Boston, the British captured Quebec! Then returned and cleansed their former territories of any lingering French armies... (I had bought New Foundland around 1725 I suppose).