Archer

[Armeniacus]

Why are the archers so good in battle? I mean when l or the AL use archers in battle then we can easily win the battle. All we have to do is to shoot arrows then everyone will die. Can you do the archers less effective in battle?

[Maion Maroneios]

I believe we have a problem here. First of all, what difficulty are you playing? Secodnly, what faction are you playing? If you're playing the Sweboz, for example, it's only natural a hail of arrows is going to hit those half-naked dudes of theirs. Just for the record of it, arrows tend to be lethal when hitting a target. Especially when that target is not wearing any kind of armour, or a good shield.

Maion

[Armeniacus]

1) l am playing the faction Aedui

2) l don't know

[Fluvius Camillus]

1) l am playing the faction Aedui

2) l don't know

Trousers dont really block arrows, also a bare six pack neither does... Try getting the heavy troops or charge the enemy archers with you general/other cavalry.. Dont get your general killed though!

[Maion Maroneios]

1) l am playing the faction Aedui

2) l don't know

You've inversed your points. Plus, the Aedui are Barbaroi. Showing off bare-chasted doesn't help against arrows as well. So you see, it's natural you get so many casualties when someone used archers against you.

My advice: First of all, stop trying to convince the EB team about having to tweak the game to your own likeness, because they won't. Not until you provide solid evidence that supports your claims, instead of threads like this where you whine about "faults" you see in the game.

Now, about the archers problem. The best way to counter them, would be with slingers. Their range is greater (at least from wetsern archers), they have more ammo and they are wider-spread (meaning more hard to hit). Also, never forget to have a solid cavalry wing with you. Use fast cavalry and utilize hit-and-run tactics to drive away enemy archers and skirmishers in general. Or, another thing you could do, is hide in woods, or charge at an enemy very fast to prevent casualties from projectiles.

Maion

[Armeniacus]

Okay

[anubis88]

Also, who's AL, and how does it,he or she use archers?

[Apázlinemjó]

Also, who's AL, and how does it,he or she use archers?

Look at the AL topic, you will understand.

[Spearman]

Would those be the Roman archers you were looking for in a previous thread? Just saying, if your gonna spam the forums with pointless threads about archers try and give us a little more substance.

1) l am playing the faction Aedui

2) l don't know

1) Use celtic archers/slingers to counter

2) I honestly think that you would be happier with vanilla RTW, perhaps BI.

3) at least you came up with a little more thoughtful title!

Where's MarcusAurilius and his magical thread lock wand?

[athanaric]

Leuce Epos. These guys are your friends when you face archers, Armeniacus. Don't forget though that most "barbarian" archers carry spears for melee.

[Mulceber]

Would those be the Roman archers you were looking for in a previous thread?

Just thought I'd point out that technically, the Romani do have archers: Cohors Sagittariorvm Levantinorvm

-M

[Maion Maroneios]

If you take a look at his posts, you'll see he does mention them. He rather wanted factional archers to be implemented into the game, not late-period auxillia troops.

Maion

[Watchman]

Not sure how well it works in practice, but might be worth a try to just forget the tactical niceties and CHARRRRRRRRRRRRGE like a proper barbarian warrior. After all, those guys in shirts and pants come in *large* blocks, move very fast, and tend to have pretty good stamina... as the Greeks also figured out, one of the better moves you can pull when faced with superior firepower is getting in close ASAP to mix it up mano y mano.

[Maion Maroneios]

as the Greeks also figured out, one of the better moves you can pull when faced with superior firepower is getting in close ASAP to mix it up mano y mano.

Ah, yes... The good 'ol days of the Persian Wars *nostalgic*

Maion

[Macilrille]

Counter against archers

1. wear armour. Few archers are AP, so get some armoured units.
2. run them down with cavalry or even fast light infantry- as long as they run, they do no damage shooting.
3. Charge
4. Kill them with Slingers

[Scud]

Few archers are AP, so get some armoured units.

Are there actually any archers which have the armour piercing ability? Wouldn't the lack of AP apply to all archers in game, unless I am mistaken. :|

[soup_alex]

Are there actually any archers which have the armour piercing ability? Wouldn't the lack of AP apply to all archers in game, unless I am mistaken. :|

You're right, as far as I know. Although there's a bit of variety in ammunition, range and attack, there aren't any archers with AP bows.
Some javelins are AP (particularly Iberi and Romani), and obviously all slings are AP.

Counter against archers

1. wear armour. Few archers are AP, so get some armoured units.
2. run them down with cavalry or even fast light infantry- as long as they run, they do no damage shooting.

This applies to all archers, except perhaps Numidians, whose secondary weapon (club) is sometimes even more deadly than their arrows. If you see these b*stards, don't charge them with your best, most heavily-armoured troops!

[Watchman]

No archers with AP, sorry. The closest candidate for one was the Caucasians (who Xenophon described as using very tall, powerful bows and large heavy arrows the Greeks reused javelins, that apparently had a fairly easy time punching through shields and armour), but when it was asked if they should thus be given AP there was much going pale of face and rising of hair at the implications...

Well, think about it; the Hai would probably end up pretty monstrous if their baseline peasant archer dished out AP arrows at those attack values they have.

[satalexton]

Those arrows are indeed monsterous, they make such wonderful additions to the Makedonian Taxis...

[vartan]

Oh, how those Hai archer-peasants rain down hell upon the enemy!

[Nachtmeister]

Counter against archers

1. wear armour. Few archers are AP, so get some armoured units.
2. run them down with cavalry or even fast light infantry- as long as they run, they do no damage shooting.
3. Charge
4. Kill them with Slingers

This is interesting - I usually use archers (among other things) as a counter-unit against slingers and find them to be very effective...
As in "kill some of them at range so that every subsequent volley of them will do less damage because fewer men can shoot fewer projectiles".

[/Bean\]

I find archers to be a fine compliment to my armies. I use slingers as my AP and long range slingers, and always stick my archers behind my infantry line on flaming arrows. Works well to down the spirits of the entire enemy army, not just those fired upon.

[Macilrille]

<3 Cretan Archers, nothing like them in the Roman setup...

[Celtic_Punk]

1-2 units of cretans, plus 2-3 units of slingers, and then add your hoplites. unbeatable.

even if the stupid makedonian charges with his cavalry, just focus all firepower on him and he'll be dead in no time.

[Nachtmeister]

1-2 units of cretans, plus 2-3 units of slingers, and then add your hoplites. unbeatable.

even if the stupid makedonian charges with his cavalry, just focus all firepower on him and he'll be dead in no time.

Not unbeatable in Mikra Asia no more... Thureophoroi with hippeis xystophoroi is what you need there... Archers are then suddenly degraded from a battle turning unit to a specialist support unit.

[athanaric]

This is interesting - I usually use archers (among other things) as a counter-unit against slingers and find them to be very effective...
As in "kill some of them at range so that every subsequent volley of them will do less damage because fewer men can shoot fewer projectiles".

I found foot archers to be effective against slingers, who are in turn effective against HAs. Against armoured steppe nobles your Rhodian Slingers should be more useful than archers.

[Macilrille]

I just noticed a nice detail.

I had a Roman army facing off with some Gauls, unwashed, longhaired, moustached Averni spearmen. I got an Accensi om their R Flank, a Celtic Slinger (Gauls wishing to be civilised of course, romanisation spreads as I write), and a Cretan Archer in front.

The poor Gauls withered under this barrage, but I had the chance to soom on to them and was amazed.

The Creatan Archers' arrows stuck in the ground. I loved it. Pincushion, it looked so cool and nice and ... REAL

[Maion Maroneios]

1-2 units of cretans, plus 2-3 units of slingers, and then add your hoplites. unbeatable.

even if the stupid makedonian charges with his cavalry, just focus all firepower on him and he'll be dead in no time.

Nice going dude! Why don't you make the rest of your army missiles as well, with a couple of Rhodioi and some Eastern archers for added flavour? Cheating? Nah...

Maion

[/Bean\]

Oh no! Maion doesn't like the secret to defeating the armies of Makedon being openly spread on the Org! Run, little children, run!

[Nachtmeister]

No he's right - it simply is not very representative of what was normally fielded by the southern Greek city-states... It's a bit like a Roman fullstack of extraordinarii or a Qarthadastim fullstack with more than one unit of elephants. Dedicated missile units should be the exception in a Greek army - something like 1-3 units total. Especially when fighting in Hellas proper. Of course, Bosphoran warfare is an entirely different matter.
Most of the missile damage in a mainland Greek army should come from skirmishers, not long-range units. Decreasing the numbers of / baiting hetairoi with slingers is fine - but just hammering them into oblivion before they can reach the front line is just a plain abuse of the game engine imo.