Fallout: New Vegas

[frogbeastegg]

Dedicated topic because discussion was taking over the news thread.

[TinCow]

From the news thread...

Not to be a party pooper, but Obsidian doesn't really have a good track record does it? They kind of have a reputation for getting farmed out sequels to games and turning them into disappointments....

KOTOR2 was a good game, but unfinished and ultimately disappointing compared to the first. NWN2, to me at least, was an unplayable mess when it first came out. Two expansions later and I hear its finally starting to come together, but I've stopped caring.

I'd love to be proven wrong, but when I hear Obsidian is getting to do another sequel to a different devs game, its more likely to elicit a sigh from me than excitement.

I think the key is that both KOTOR2 and NWN2, even with their OOB problems, had interesting storylines and well-written dialog. These are often the areas in which Bethsoft has difficulties, especially since they enacted their 100% voice acting thing and the subsequent 50,000 line limit in the games. I'm hoping that Obsidian can stick a strong story on Bethsoft's otherwise strong software. IMO, since Obsidian probably doesn't have to worry about software issues or the game being rushed out the door, FO:NV has a lot of potential.

[johnhughthom]

The thing that frustrated me most about playing KoTOR 2 and NWN 2 at release was that it was so obvious there was a very good game trying to get out of the technical mess, the eternal problem of developers with sky high ambition against publishers wanting the money now. I have always believed Obsidian could make a genuine classic RPG if somebody gave them the time. Lets hope Bethesda are that company.

[TB666]

Would be better if Bioware did it but they would no doubt remove the ability to mod the game.
Obsidian is really living on their Black Isle days and for me, that "glory" they got back then is gone now.
Their games so far has been been nothing but a buggy mess(hey kinda like Fallout 1 and 2).
Their fanbase always state that it was Atari's fault but this time it is not Atari so this is really the time for them to prove that they are good developers.

[frogbeastegg]

Good Old Games is having a Fallout week. There's a pair of articles about the making of Fallout 1 and Fallout 2 which I found to be good reading, and I think others here might like them.

The bundle deal with DRM free, fully patched versions of Fallout 1, 2 and Tactics isn't to be sneezed at either. They're all guaranteed to work on modern PC; great news since my attempted playthrough of Fallout 1 was murdered by a variety of issues with my machine. They also come with an assortment of nice extras, such as soundtracks.

[tibilicus]

I thought for a minute this was an announcement about the rumoured Fallout MMORPG..

[DisruptorX]

The thing that frustrated me most about playing KoTOR 2 and NWN 2 at release was that it was so obvious there was a very good game trying to get out of the technical mess, the eternal problem of developers with sky high ambition against publishers wanting the money now. I have always believed Obsidian could make a genuine classic RPG if somebody gave them the time. Lets hope Bethesda are that company.

I didn't get that feeling at all. Somehow it seems that Troika got all the genius from Black Isle, and Obsidian got all the fail. NWN 2 would be a mediocre game if it had a half decent UI and AI, but no more.

As for Bethesda, I don't know if they are capable of making a "classic". Certainly their games are all worthy of being played, but most of the fun comes from just exploration and messing around and whatnot.

[Whacker]

I think the key is that both KOTOR2 and NWN2, even with their OOB problems, had interesting storylines and well-written dialog.

IMO this was about the only thing that saved KOTOR2. I couldn't force myself too far through NWN2 because of the interface problem, which xhole so lovingly likes to point out to me every time I've brought it up with him.

These are often the areas in which Bethsoft has difficulties, especially since they enacted their 100% voice acting thing and the subsequent 50,000 line limit in the games.

IMO this was one of the biggest wastes of time and money they spent on Oblivion, when they could have been focusing on other aspects of the game.

I'm hoping that Obsidian can stick a strong story on Bethsoft's otherwise strong software. IMO, since Obsidian probably doesn't have to worry about software issues or the game being rushed out the door, FO:NV has a lot of potential.

My dear friend I really do hope you are joking, my sarcasm meter has been broken as of late. Bethesda has a penchant for releasing very, very buggy software. Not Troika-bad buggy, but still pretty awful. They almost make Creative Assembly look good. Obsidian also has a rather sordid history as well with their games, however they've also been around much much shorter.

I thought for a minute this was an announcement about the rumoured Fallout MMORPG..

Interplay has retained the rights to create and publish a Fallout MMO, but they tried to sell that to Bethesda. Apparently Bethesda has decided they don't want to be in that market. Who knows where it's going now.

I didn't get that feeling at all. Somehow it seems that Troika got all the genius from Black Isle, and Obsidian got all the fail. NWN 2 would be a mediocre game if it had a half decent UI and AI, but no more.

As for Bethesda, I don't know if they are capable of making a "classic". Certainly their games are all worthy of being played, but most of the fun comes from just exploration and messing around and whatnot.

Troika was a very sad tale of what happens to a Dev house with some real potential. In fact a lot of the old shops that churned out some classics have gone the way of the dinosaur.

As for Bethesda, my general dislike of them and their business direction is no big secret. I did not play the ES games prior to Morrowind, but I am to understand the early ES games were true RPGs in the sense of what an RPG really is. Unfortunately Beth has decided they want to market to a different audience which does not include RPG players. As such I would agree with you sentiment that they are most likely incapable of producing a "classic" game, though I'm sure the hordes of Beth fanboys would drown me out screaming accolades of Oblivion and Fallblivion. On the flip side, to their credit, Beth is very good at making almost-no-depth sandbox style FPS games.

[DisruptorX]

Daggerfall had more player options than say, Oblivion, and wasn't as dumbed down, but it wasn't anything like say, Fallout.

I don't think much of the hate Bethesda gets from some crowds is fair at all, however. They make sandbox RPGs, and aside from some horrific design flaws in Oblivion (level scaling done as wrong as it can be done), they are good at that niche. Take a look at first person RPGs from the 90s. Can you honestly say that something like Eye of the Beholder has more depth than Morrowind or Fallout 3? Hell no. If anything Fallout 3 shows that they are improving and getting better. Vastly more in depth game than Oblivion and NPCs that almost have character. Assuming their next game improves likewise, I have high hopes from them. As opposed to Bioware, who's games are getting progressively worse, Bethesda is getting better.

Can they put out a game as genius as say Baldur's Gate or VtM:Bloodlines? Not so sure on that. But I feel they make solid games, Oblivion aside.