How you can use the crusades/jinhads in eb 2

[lordbuxton]

In times of strife and war when i kingdom was invaded a king gave a sort of call to arms.

I think this should be added in one way or another.

Basicly a king with a fair bit of influencend in a homeland region should be able to summon a few units of millita/ peasant level troops If a enemy army is present in a homeland region.

Tell me what you think.

[Mulceber]

I imagine that the jihad/crusade will be one of the things that are scrapped for EB2 - just like the supremacy of the papal states will be, and like the senate was in EB1. -M

[/Bean\]

They won't tell you...

[bobbin]

AFAIK you need a papal states faction to have crusades so they're out and the team hasn't said anything about if or what they'll do with jihads.

[decimator22]

Jihads might work if there is a variety of Gallic factions, or Iberian or German etc.. and you give the jihad option to the Gallic factions to unite against a common enemy. No one really knows what will happen with the feature.

[Megas Methuselah]

Jihads might work if there is a variety of Gallic factions, or Iberian or German etc.. and you give the jihad option to the Gallic factions to unite against a common enemy. No one really knows what will happen with the feature.

If this were to be implemented into EB in such a way, why would it possibly be limited solely to the Celtic factions?

[bobbin]

I remember a while back someone suggesting they could be used to model migrations which was a pretty interesting idea.

[Alsatia]

Jihads might work if there is a variety of Gallic factions, or Iberian or German etc.. and you give the jihad option to the Gallic factions to unite against a common enemy. No one really knows what will happen with the feature.

That should work to give the romans hell but it would be annoying, having 5 jihad armies heading for rome every 5-10 turns.. About the gallic factions uniting, it seems doubtful since they mostly warred between themselves.

I remember a while back someone suggesting they could be used to model migrations which was a pretty interesting idea.

Not sure about this one, there were few any at all at the classical era based on my knowlege, but could be used if EB was moved to the fall of Rome (Extremely Unlikely).

[Mulceber]

Jihads might work if there is a variety of Gallic factions, or Iberian or German etc.. and you give the jihad option to the Gallic factions to unite against a common enemy. No one really knows what will happen with the feature.

That would be interesting, but the problem is, the only time we know of that really happening (AFAIK) is against Caesar, and even then it was pretty late in the Gallic War. I mean, Arminius managed to unite a few (Germanic) tribes, but it was really only for the Teutoberg forest massacre. I think Vercingetorix was really the first and last person to unite so many celts for so long. -M

[Megas Methuselah]

It'd be a idiotic feature, then.

[Alsatia]

It'd be a idiotic feature, then.

Absolutely agree.

[Cute Wolf]

There was two ideas one serious, and one foolish...

The serious idea... give the jihad ability for nomadic faction, because the jihad units are free from upkeep, they're best used for roleplaying "gathering new horde" and taking one specified settlements...

The stupid idea:

Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 

Give this ability for Saby'n or Kardhastim

[Alsatia]

LOL. Bit stupid

Shame on me, just posted on ETW about M2TW, Ahh... The Shame....

[bobbin]

That should work to give the romans hell but it would be annoying, having 5 jihad armies heading for rome every 5-10 turns.

As i recall there is set minimum number of years between crusades/jihads but I don't know how long it is or if it can be changed. But i do agree they sould probably be left out.

Not sure about this one, there were few any at all at the classical era based on my knowlege, but could be used if EB was moved to the fall of Rome (Extremely Unlikely).

Eh? no mirgations in the classical era? Might want to check that.

There's the Cimbri-Teutones right in the middle of EB's timeframe, galatian migrations just before, yuezhi around 180bc, Saka before that, the Parni (Phalava) around 250bc and the Helvetii around 50bc. Those are just the ones i can think off the top of my head. Migrations weren't limited to the late empire times.


ps good luck with the chemistry olympiad cute wolf! just sat my 3rd year organic exam this morning, I owned them radical clocks.

[Alsatia]

Sorry. I'm not that good with my classical History.

[Watchman]

Wasn't the Celts' standard method for dealing with overpopulation to have around half the bunch pack up their stuff and move somewhere else en masse, too...?

[bobbin]

Tat was probably true for all peoples in some part, look at the amount of colonies founded by the greeks for example, they were done essentially to control population in the mother city.

[Megas Methuselah]

One could argue that this could work hand-in-hand with the idea of colonizing regions into becoming type 2, or even type 1, governments. But this is an old dream, IIRC.

Still kind of ridiculous, though.

[Rilder]

If the Koinon Hellenon were individual factions I bet the Jihad feature would work well but as it stands I don't think the mod really needs it.

[Macilrille]

Arminus rather united the Germans when fighting off Germanicus attempt at reconquest, not as much for the Varus Disaster. I have always thought the descriptions of the annihilation of varus sounded more like what the Finns did to the Soviets in the Winter War away from the main (S) front, up in the forests, cut them to manageble bits and annihilate them one by one. Finns called those bits "Motti" = 1 Cubic M of firewood ha ha ha ha, I <3 Finns

[Watchman]

Stupid Soviets tried to play mechanised warfare in woods. Got eaten alive by what was really a rather seriously old forest-warfare tactic.
Can't help but pity the hapless grunts though.
(As an aside, they later pulled some rather similar moves on the even less "woodwise" Germans in the northern sector during the Continuation War - the Finns had to rescue their allies on at least one occasion from such encirclement.)

That said though, Arminius pulled a rather major surprise backstab on poor Varus. Succesful surprise attacks tend to lead to decimated armies at the best of times, so eh... The degree to which he "united the Germans" is kinda questionable though, as he'd just managed to gain the following of a handful of tribes; IIRC he spent the next quite a while warring with other chieftains and wannabe kings...

[decimator22]

If this were to be implemented into EB in such a way, why would it possibly be limited solely to the Celtic factions?

I meant you could choose only celts, or germans or nomads etc...

As many have said it would probably make more problems than help us enjoy the game.

[Mulceber]

Succesful surprise attacks tend to lead to decimated armies at the best of times, so eh... The degree to which he "united the Germans" is kinda questionable though, as he'd just managed to gain the following of a handful of tribes; IIRC he spent the next quite a while warring with other chieftains and wannabe kings...

Very true, and then there's the fact that he ended up being assassinated by his own people. -M

[Macilrille]

You could say germanicus united them, pressure creates counterpressure. Arminus succeeded in uniting many (not all) German (and possibly one or two Danish) tribes, for a while... That is, for as long as Roman Legions invaded each summer, bent on reconquest. Another, smaller block of german tribes was allied to Marbod of the Marcomanni. When the Romans gave up, Arminus tried to keep the alliance going by warring with Marbod, but as his own power became too great other magnates/tribes rebelled.

When the Crusaders had settled infighting and quarreling was not uncommon either, so superficially similar, and the structure of Medieval society was made in the Iron Age, so... slightly similar. I think Crusades and Jihad should not be included. I would love to see smaller factions allying themselves to greater and become protectorates of theor iwn volition, like Syracouse, Massilia, Pergamon, Cyrene and Ptolomai Egypt did with Rome, and others probably did with AS and Macedonia.

[gamegeek2]

I would guess they would make for a good hording representation, without the overpoweredness of the BI horde.

[antisocialmunky]

I wouldn't mind seeing a giant stack of Cimbri ravage Gaul and Italy.

[Macilrille]

Nor would I, but that would require them to be included as a faction. I think they should be to counter the Suebi juggernaut, but I am probably biased by living on Cimbri Chersonesos and being descended from them and/or the Haerudi ;-)