EB naval warfare

**iounas** · 05-06-2009, 10:55

Anybody else feel its pointless in having a navy..
Upkeep is too high for what you get. My 3 ports are blocked by 3 of those 3500 upkeep ships.. so my enemy is at a loss.. and due to computer advantage on VH autoresolve I would need 2 of those ships to defend one of my ports so I dont bother as its not cost effective..
Im Carthage and have only 2 smallest ships for transport..

**anubis88** · 05-06-2009, 11:05

Originally Posted by iounas

Anybody else feel its pointless in having a navy..
Upkeep is too high for what you get. My 3 ports are blocked by 3 of those 3500 upkeep ships.. so my enemy is at a loss.. and due to computer advantage on VH autoresolve I would need 2 of those ships to defend one of my ports so I dont bother as its not cost effective..
Im Carthage and have only 2 smallest ships for transport..

I never experienced the AI having an advantage in autocalc naval battles. I seem to win quite a lot of them. If your playing on rtw.exe there is indeed little need to have a navy, but there's a whole other thing when playing with BI.exe.

In my Seleucid campaign right now, i will absolutly need a navy, since KH and the ptoleamaic empire attack me with armys on my undefended areas. It will be cheaper to have a navy then 2 large armies to hold all the invasions.

P.S. If your port is blocked you lose a lot of income, especially with carthage

**athanaric** · 05-06-2009, 12:22

Being a great fan of island empires, I currently use my large Makedonian fleet to sink Carthaginian reinforcement shipments. I've already drowned one Qarthadastim FM

. I've also chased pirates even in the Baltic sea. Oh, and that is with RTW exe.

I think a navy of a certain size is vital if you really want to control the Mediterranean. Besides, as a "civilized" faction you will literally swim in money soon enough. Better use it for navies (Nees Megistai FTW) than let it corrupt your FMs.

**Fluvius Camillus** · 05-06-2009, 12:29

Originally Posted by athanaric

Being a great fan of island empires, I currently use my large Makedonian fleet to sink Carthaginian reinforcement shipments. I've already drowned one Qarthadastim FM

. I've also chased pirates even in the Baltic sea. Oh, and that is with RTW exe.

I think a navy of a certain size is vital if you really want to control the Mediterranean. Besides, as a "civilized" faction you will literally swim in money soon enough. Better use it for navies (Nees Megistai FTW) than let it corrupt your FMs.

Lol I'd rather built one Pentere or one Trieremiolai, good cost/effectivity ratio. Sinks 3 group pirates easily, then retrain. Also handy as transport because you will rarely encounter a force stronger than yours.

**athanaric** · 05-06-2009, 12:45

Originally Posted by Fluvius Camillus

Lol I'd rather built one Pentere or one Trieremiolai, good cost/effectivity ratio. Sinks 3 group pirates easily, then retrain. Also handy as transport because you will rarely encounter a force stronger than yours.

The pirates aren't that much of a problem (It's just that I hate them and pursue them everywhere), but the Ptolies are. They usually build some Nees Megistai, which can pose a real threat to your regular fleets. Although of course the Trieremiolai are the most cost-effective ships (for the Romaioi it's the Covered Liburnes).

**satalexton** · 05-06-2009, 12:50

it's handy to have a strong navy around, it makes troop deployment a LOT faster, and safely.

**Fluvius Camillus** · 05-06-2009, 13:03

Originally Posted by athanaric

The pirates aren't that much of a problem (It's just that I hate them and pursue them everywhere), but the Ptolies are. They usually build some Nees Megistai, which can pose a real threat to your regular fleets. Although of course the Trieremiolai are the most cost-effective ships (for the Romaioi it's the Covered Liburnes).

Indeed, covered Liburnes really are awesome ships!

**/Bean\** · 05-06-2009, 13:32

Originally Posted by iounas

Anybody else feel its pointless in having a navy..

Wasn't that worth opening the thread for?

**Chris1959** · 05-06-2009, 17:31

Also don't retrain fleets when they have suffered losses, at least not in the early game.

A depleted fleet costs a fection to maintain and retraining only takes one season not several for the larger fleets.

Some might say a bit of an exploit, I see it more of ships being in reserve ready for rapid re-commission when actually needed rather than building hulls from scratch.

**anubis88** · 05-06-2009, 20:38

Originally Posted by Chris1959

Also don't retrain fleets when they have suffered losses, at least not in the early game.

A depleted fleet costs a fection to maintain and retraining only takes one season not several for the larger fleets.

Some might say a bit of an exploit, I see it more of ships being in reserve ready for rapid re-commission when actually needed rather than building hulls from scratch.

You confuse me. Don't reatrain fleets or retrain fleets? Which one is your suggestion?

**/Bean\** · 05-06-2009, 21:03

I think he means don't retrain until you need them, because retraining only takes one turn, whereas if you found you needed one and it takes 2, 3 or 4 turns, it can be a bit late.

**Belisarius II** · 05-06-2009, 23:02

Navies are something that you'll start using in the mid-game effectively. Once you hit that certain point in the game where money doesn't matter anymore, you'll start building navies en masse.

I only use navies for 3 things: Guarding my ports, transporting my armies, and destroying enemy/pirate fleets. I usually never blockade an enemy faction's port because I see it pointless since they AI gets a money script in the first place.

**Rilder** · 05-06-2009, 23:51

They are a good way of controlling your coffers, get to much cash, Build ships... Need money, disband a couple fleets.

**Cute Wolf** · 05-07-2009, 12:28

My suggestion for naval warfare... If you seems to had more men.... use auto_win

BTW, only do this in early game while your economy is in great deficit... otherwise it was a bland cheating!

**iounas** · 05-07-2009, 19:21

Originally Posted by Belisarius II

Navies are something that you'll start using in the mid-game effectively. Once you hit that certain point in the game where money doesn't matter anymore, you'll start building navies en masse.

Well right now I own all of Italy,Africa, almost own all of Spain and I cant afford anything as every neighboring country is in war with me and only me..every turn I fight many defensive battles barely winning..

**Dutchhoplite** · 05-07-2009, 21:44

Who are you at war with??

And don't say: everybody

**iounas** · 05-07-2009, 22:43

Originally Posted by Dutchhoplite

Who are you at war with??

And don't say: everybody

Rome, Lusotana, Macedonia, Ptolemaics..
Romes enemies=me+2 town aedui
Lusotanas enemies = only me
Ptolemaics enemies = only me
Macedonia has more enemies and bother me every second or third turn

I dont know how Im still holding Alexandria and Memphis (2 main Ptolemaic cities)..
Several times in a row my forces melted away in a siege against their phalanxes but I was saved by time limit..I have only regional units there..no point in bringing in elites from Carthage when they would die in 2 battles..really crazy battles..and its on VH/M

**MarcusAureliusAntoninus** · 05-08-2009, 03:02

I like building fleets as a prestige thing. Even if I don't have any enemies at sea, having a big fleet shows that I'm a great power. They also help keep my income from exploding an allow me something to disband when my income takes a dive. Plus, every now and then a huge pirate fleet shows up and needs to be crushed.