EBII Cataphract Formation

**antisocialmunky** · 05-20-2009, 13:11

:-\ alot of times the pointy stick was better because it had AP.

**Cute Wolf** · 05-20-2009, 13:41

and pointy stick combat cause death against levy spearmen... or even a very same type of horsemen that have also ap secondary...

**Watchman** · 05-20-2009, 20:52

Doesn't even need to be AP, depending on the unit involved. Though I must say that in EB1 I've found it very effective to swamp Eastern FamiCav catas with those axe-wielding dudes in shirts on horseback - the kontos being all but useless in melee against that sort of warrior.

**russia almighty** · 05-20-2009, 23:23

Originally Posted by Watchman

Doesn't even need to be AP, depending on the unit involved. Though I must say that in EB1 I've found it very effective to swamp Eastern FamiCav catas with those axe-wielding dudes in shirts on horseback - the kontos being all but useless in melee against that sort of warrior.

Kontos wielding units with any experience are pretty freaking monstrous.

I had one unit of companions that just ate anything thrown at them. 10 attack man, 10 attack.

**antisocialmunky** · 05-21-2009, 02:33

Originally Posted by Watchman

Doesn't even need to be AP, depending on the unit involved. Though I must say that in EB1 I've found it very effective to swamp Eastern FamiCav catas with those axe-wielding dudes in shirts on horseback - the kontos being all but useless in melee against that sort of warrior.

True but its been my observation that with heavy cav vs heavy cav, sometimes the spear works better than the secondary weapon if that secondary has no AP. I've been trying to figure that out forever... Is it spear bonus/mount effect + AP?

Medium cav just evaporates vs Heavy cav unless its ridiculously high end like Campanians even those Thracian Prodromoi with those AP sabres die horribly...

.

**bobbin** · 05-21-2009, 03:08

The big cavalry lances in the game (Kontos etc) have 0.4 lethality along with AP and the spear bonus which combines to make them very powerful against cavalry units.

I personally would never change to the secondary weapon when engaging other cavalry as the spears are usually far more effective.

ps Thraikioi Prodromoi's sabres aren't AP, they have 2 higher attack and 0.01 less lethality compared to the normal Prodromoi swords.

That said they do look absolutely bad ass.

**Watchman** · 05-21-2009, 07:21

Spear bonus ? Like Hell they do. Only infantry gets that, period. The cavalry lances just get crazy-high lethality values, to go with some hardcore attack-speed penalties and AP - decent enough for dealing with armoured opponents I guess (though I'm pretty sure at least maces are a better option, and usually kopises too), but nigh useless against hordes of unarmoured foes relying mostly on high defskill.

**Atraphoenix** · 05-21-2009, 11:14

I prefer square formation for charges it makes more damage than wedge.
Plus For Pahlava breakthrough is the worst logical tactic that favours wedge formation.

**bobbin** · 05-22-2009, 10:35

Originally Posted by Watchman

Spear bonus ? Like Hell they do. Only infantry gets that, period. The cavalry lances just get crazy-high lethality values, to go with some hardcore attack-speed penalties and AP - decent enough for dealing with armoured opponents I guess (though I'm pretty sure at least maces are a better option, and usually kopises too), but nigh useless against hordes of unarmoured foes relying mostly on high defskill.

Oops my bad, must have been dozing when i typed that. Maces and axes are better than the lance but i find kopises a bit too weak for the job(usually have low lethality), those nasty pickaxe things the saka cataphtacts get are pretty effective as well.