Bugs and Patch Changes v1.5

[Red Harvest]

I'm going to start this thread as a placeholder for when the patch arrives sometime in the next 48 hours. (If Mods object, etc. then delete or lock as appropriate.)

The Readme is nice but it is general, and as it states it probably omits a number of small or subtle changes...or perhaps uses classic British understatement. So what I hope to do in this thread is to compile a list of changes and fixes that have been implemented compared to RTW 1.3. I will try to edit to maintain a list of what we find (although I could be out of pocket for a considerable time in the coming weeks--so a moderator might want to take over if I don't appear for an extended time after the patch is released.) Some general guidelines:
1. Contribute what you observe that is different/changed.
2. For obvious things like changed stats, just provide before/after number.
3. If you are uncertain about something that requires some testing, it might be best to have a separate thread to discuss it and flesh it out before adding it to the list.
4. CA comments would of course be very helpful toward compiling a complete supplemental list.

A similar thread for BI 1.6 might be useful. I'm not a good candidate for managing the BI list, as I don't have BI at the moment and won't have any "history" to compare. (Hopefully this RTW patch will prompt me to remedy that, and change my sig.)

And as always...a separate bug/workaround type list would be handy to keep in a different thread. Bugs of course could be in this thread, assuming they are *changes* from the previous release, not pre-existing bugs.

EDIT to begin lists for RTW 1.5, looks like my original format is going to require changing:
Undocumented fixed/changed items.
1. Officers seem to all have their weapons now. Before they had a tendency to show up for battle at times with no sword. Lots of punching... (Several...need more time to confirm.)
2. British Generals have been upgraded to 5 def. skill from 1. (Red Harvest.)
3. Generals_unit_upgrade added for Pontus "East Pontic Generals"
4. The AI has resumed using its warcry more consistently. In 1.3 it would often not warcry when attacking. In 1.5 it seems more prone to do so...including in custom tests. Glad to see this back! (Red Harvest)

Confirmed officially documented fixed items.
1. Naval invasion seems to be working according to initial reports. (Many.)
2. The AI uses its pila now. (Many.)
3. Barb Archer Rebel/Slave officer removed.
4. Spear warbands now have secondary swords and slightly lower cost/upkeep.
5. Berserker hit points have been cut to 2, and armour increased to 2. Recruiting and armour/weapon upgrade cost have been increased.
6. Memory leak has been partially fixed. It takes much longer to get the same level of leak. However, symptoms are exactly the same as before. CA gets partial credit.
7. Javelin skirmish AI appears to be improved. It is more likely to use them as skirmishers now. Archers/slingers still have some serious issues (not firing at times, marching through enemy fire, etc.) but they do seem to behave more like skirmishers on average.


Unfixed issues.
1. The two highest level horse temples are still buildable for Gaul, etc. and should not be according to the messages provided onscreen. (Red Harvest, many others) EDIT: Confirmed by Intrepid Sidekick/Capt. Fishpants, the two highest level horse temples should be buildable by Roman factions only.
2. SPQR still has Greek family members. (Seasoned Alcoholic)
3. Some reports of not having control of reinforcements in battle. (Various.)
4. "Short_pike" does not work properly. Phalanx units with it won't shoulder arms when phalanx is toggled off, and when attacked in phalanx, the pikes don't seem to hold the enemy off at all, the whole first row switches to swords. (Red Harvest.)

New 1.5 Bugs
1. AI seems to be able to very successfully use pila after it engages in melee...even after it did the initial hurl and charge. (Red Harvest.)
2. Academy class buildings might not be providing intended law bonus. (Barbarossa82.)
3. Disasters don't seem to work properly. The triggers are unreliable now (and appeared to be in 1.3 as well.) I've not seen a storm at sea in 1.3 or 1.5. I can get Etna to smoke, but not erupt (except for the historical event.) I have seen two floods, but no deaths from them. Have so far been unable to trigger a quake, or drought, or storm at sea in 1.5.. I know the disaster file is getting referenced, since I can make Etna smoke (by plugging in a coordinate as well as a frequency.)
4. Slave resources don't seem to be adding to population anywhere, even when the growth icon shows they should. There is growth in year zero, but none of the projected slave population growths are actually received. (Pode, Germanvs, and others. Confirmed.)
5. There have been quite a few reports of problems with siege towers, particularly the larger ones. Typically, men will mill about running in and out and can't be commanded. Eventually, they move up the tower. Sometimes they bypass the tower and end up on the wall before the ramp opens, this can cause a CTD. (MAt, and others.)
6. There is no option to turn off the battle timer in provincial campaigns. (Red Harvest)
7. During a Civil War test (as provincial campaign using straightforward descr_strat diplomacy mod) found that agreeing to a ceasefire with an AI Roman faction allows them to siege and blockade without being at war...and if the player's popularity is low, he can't counterattack in any way, leaving him helpless. It looks like the AI cannot attack ships or armies, but it can siege and blockade. War continues against other Roman factions. (Red Harvest)

[Seasoned Alcoholic]

With regards to a new RTW v1.5 bugs thread, it may be useful to everyone if the first page documents the entire list of encountered (and confirmed) bugs. I'm taking this idea straight from Kraxis' Sticky BI bugs thread. Before anyone posts a potentially new bug they should double-check the entire list to date to avoid duplications. It would need to be updated on a frequent (perhaps daily) basis, depending on how many members are posting in there.

Perhaps once the patch is released, someone could post the final readme version in here, and this could prevent duplications on this topic. It may contain a few more documented changes / fixes than what CA have already provided.

[Kekvit Irae]

I have plans for a RTW Bugs/BI Bugs/Undocumented Features thread to sticky so there will be only one sticky instead of three. All I need is someone dedicated enough to maintain it

[Catiline]

The different flavours of RTW/Bi probably need different threads for bug I think. This one's stickied for now, to merge with BI bugs at a later date

[Zawath]

I think Golden band are much better now. I don't remember their original stats but they seem a bit higher.

[Seasoned Alcoholic]

RTW v1.5

SPQR start with 2 Greek-named family members. It appears that their names are generated at random at the start of a new imperial campaign.

Of course, it depends how you interpret this as to what you believe it to be.

Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 

How do I interpret the SPQR starting with 2 greek-named family members? No comment

[EDIT:]Double-checked descr_strat and there aren't any entries in the family section under Romans_Senate for these 2 named charachters. Looks to be bugged.

[Oaty]

New 1.5 Bugs
1. AI seems to be able to very successfully use pila after it engages in melee...even after it did the initial hurl and charge. (Red Harvest.)
(Red Harvest)

Not an introduced bug. I have been able to hurl pila from an engaged units in multiple ways since patch 1.2 and maybe earlier.

One way is guard mode with fire at will on. The unit can stay engaged and the rear ranks of the unit will throw pila. However if the unit becomes too disrupted it will be unable to throw.

Two just fire at will on. The unit will more likeley becom engaged once hit, but if the unit does not counter attack it can still throw from rear ranks.

Three probably the most obvious is to right pila click on a nearby unit that is within range.


Why this has become suddenly obvious is the fact that the A.I. always has FAW on. And now the A.I. is at the same level as the human.

[Jambo]

One thing that really puzzles me is that Praetorian Cohorts are buildable with Army Barracks+ AND also the Imperial Palace (both now post marian reforms). Didn't they used to be buildable from the Imperial Palace only?

This relative freedom to build the Praetorian Cohort using Barracks and or Palace construction pathways seems to make the other Legionnaire types rather pointless. They're also buildable anywhere on the map, which seems rather unhistoric.

[Red Harvest]

One thing that really puzzles me is that Praetorian Cohorts are buildable with Army Barracks+ AND also the Imperial Palace (both now post marian reforms). Didn't they used to be buildable from the Imperial Palace only?

This relative freedom to build the Praetorian Cohort using Barracks and or Palace construction pathways seems to make the other Legionnaire types rather pointless. They're also buildable anywhere on the map, which seems rather unhistoric.

I had the same question, Jambo and for the same reasons.

[Red Harvest]

Were the Thracian bastarnae intended to have warcry? They don't presently, while the merc bastarnae units do.

Also have been intending to mention that it appears to me that in 1.5 the AI is again using warcry more consistently. It was not doing so in 1.3 and it was costing it in 1vs1 match ups. Glad to see this apparently fixed!

[player1]

heh...
Maybe they are more "civilized" then their mercenary friends?

[Rilder]

hmm this is a maby undocumented patch change but i've noticed the reforms happen exact turn you finish your imperial palace, i loaded my 1.2 brutus campaign were i hadnt had the reforms and a imperial in italy then the moment i got to the next turn i got the reforms, further testing i started a scipii campaign and did the add_poulation Capau 5000 then worked up to an imperial and lo and behold as soon as i finished "A New man, Gaius Marius" when it was like 250 bc.

[Germanvs]

Slave-trading definately does not work, nor has it ever worked.

[player1]

You mean pop growth bonus due to slave trade?

[Germanvs]

Yes, I mean that. The icon for increased population growth appears neatly, but if fact it doesn't do anything. Factual growth is the same as if no slaves were being traded.

Dragging off half the population upon capturing a settlement works splendid.

[[GG]vonDöbeln]

Maybe it's been mentioned before but... Playing Armenians in RTW v1.6 and Cantabrian circle seems to be broken. When I click the button the unit (neither HA or Cataphract Archers work) shifts a bit, but never starts moving in a circle.

[GG]vD

EDIT!
Ehh I have NO IDEA why some parts of the text appears in red, bold letters! LOL

[Jambo]

Well, eventually one reared its ugly head in the RTW Imperial Campaign today (1.5). It was a siege assault where I was using large siege towers to assault a large stone wall. The city was the one beside Athens and Sparta (Corinth?).

Essentially all started fine - the siege towers were set against the walls and the men congregated round the foot of the towers. However, my praetorians simply wouldn't enter the towers! The only way I could achieve this was to constantly click the unit to the walls above and the men entered in dribs and drabs with each click.

Pity, all was going so well too. I think some others have noted this problem prior to this thread, but together it might be worth working out precisely where this problem lies. Currently I've no idea whether this is an issue with large stone walls or large siege towers yet, but I plan to find out.

[Red Harvest]

Yep, this one has been reported by a number over at .com. My own experience with a man bypassing the ramp of a small siege tower (before it dropped) and ending up on the wall while the rest were inside the tower. When I tried to send him on the game CTD'ed.

What unit size are you using?

[Atilius]

Saw something very similar to what RH experienced.

I had three siege towers attacking the walls of Larissa. They all reached the walls at about the same time but only one began to empty. The other two each had a single guy fall out of the tower onto the wall before the ramp dropped, but no one else followed. After selecting the units and clicking on the walls, several minutes later the soldiers finally began exiting the towers.

Fortunately, the game didn't crash.

I always use the "huge" unit scale but have never seen anything like this. This was the first time I had attacked a stone wall with the RTW 1.5 patch.

[Tyrac]

Saw something very similar to what RH experienced.

I had three siege towers attacking the walls of Larissa. They all reached the walls at about the same time but only one began to empty. The other two each had a single guy fall out of the tower onto the wall before the ramp dropped, but no one else followed. After selecting the units and clicking on the walls, several minutes later the soldiers finally began exiting the towers.

Fortunately, the game didn't crash.

I always use the "huge" unit scale but have never seen anything like this. This was the first time I had attacked a stone wall with the RTW 1.5 patch.

I had this same bug. 2 Towers and had one empty its unit as normal and the other let out one man. The tower draw bridge/gate/ramp was closed when i looked and I could not get men up it beyond that first one. This was in B.I. however and was on large unit settings.

[gardibolt]

The slavery population growth problem should be moved from the "new 1.5 bugs" category to "unfixed issues." It never worked in practice at all. Here's my post on testing from the Ludus Magna thread on Slave Resource:

OK, here's the breakdown turn by turn in 1.0 unpatched/unmodded (and no slave trader retinue), Normal tax rate:

Summer 270: After Segesta is enslaved, its pop is 450 and rate of growth is stated as 2% (1.5% base farming and .5% slavery, with no squalor). Everything except the pop stays the same for Segesta through the end of the test in Winter 267.
Arretium ends up with 4225 pop and 2% growth, (2.5% base farming, .5% farm upgrade less 1% squalor) after enslaving. Built the governor's house.

Winter 270: Segesta pop 457
Arretium pop 4309, growth rate drops to 1.5% (2.5 base + .5 farm upgrade - 1.5% squalor). Built roads.

Summer 269: Segesta pop 464
Arretium pop 4374, growth rate stated as back up to 2% (2.5 base+ .5 farm upgrade + .5% slavery - 1.5% squalor). Everything except the pop stays the same through the end of the test in Winter 267.

Winter 269: Segesta pop 471
Arretium pop 4440

Summer 268: Segesta pop 478
Arretium pop 4507

Winter 268: Segesta pop 485
Arretium pop 4575

Summer 267: Segesta pop 492
Arretium pop 4644

Winter 267: Segesta pop 499
Arretium pop 4714

From this, it seems clear that the .5% slavery bonus isn't actually getting added in. The Arretium pop increase matches the stated percentage in Summer and Winter 270. But when the slavery is added in 269, it never actually increases pop at the right rate--at 2% the Winter 269 pop should be 4461. But it only increases 1.5%, to 4440, indicating that the .5% kicker for slavery never gets added in. The Segesta population increase is never right, since the slavery kicker is there from the beginning: it should be increasing by 9 population, but it goes up by only 7---i.e., 1.5%

So this has never worked properly, even in 1.0. The population equation doesn't seem to be picking up the slavery bonus for whatever reason.

Don't make Santa cry.

[Ludens]

1. Officers seem to all have their weapons now. Before they had a tendency to show up for battle at times with no sword. Lots of punching... (Several...need more time to confirm.)

Yesterday saw a brigand captain (commanding a militia cavalry) fleeing without his sword. I do not know if he started the battle with it (his unit had both skirmished and fought during the battle).

[professorspatula]

Officers still have the no weapon issue. Most of the time they have it, occasionally it disappears. It's been that way since day 1 as far as I've experienced it.

[Jambo]

It would seem the AI's units also get stuck entering the large siege towers too. This causes havoc to the whole AI siege assault procedure. :/

Is there anything WE can do to solve this problem? Like, mod out large siege towers, remove large and or epic walls? I've compared 1.3 and 1.5 descr_engines.txt and the only difference is the improvement of the ram (i.e. less likely to ignite).

Does ayone know yet whether this happens with the standard stone walls? The only walls I've found so far that causes the problem is the large stone walls and the siege towers used to assault them. There aren't enough epic walls around in my campaign yet to test whether they're borked too.

[Red Harvest]

Moderators et al.: I'm in the middle of a major relocation. I won't have much opportunity to update this thread for probably a week or more and have zero time for play testing (indeed I haven't had much opportunity for playtesting for days.) Please feel free to edit the list at the stop as you feel appropriate. This is not really "my" thread, but one for the community.

I'll check back when I can. Merry Christmas everyone.

[x-dANGEr]

Any help appreciated with regard to this problem:

Old graphics card-related bug with new twist, as far as I know. Just came back
after a long while to the game. It works fine on my older system, which runs
using a GeForce 4 Ti 4200.

However on my newer system, running the game on a GeForce FX 5200, there is
menu flickering and corruption which makes the game unplayable, as you might
know. Firstly, has there as yet been any way found to overcome this in RTW
alone?

Secondly, I in some way overcame this when I installed BI, in so much as RTW
and BI are both playable on the newer system. But now I find that several things
still do not work: [Presumably again due to the card?] There are no opening
cutscenes, for RTW or BI; several in-game graphics are missing. [No graphics in
the Senate tab, and numerous other graphics, e.g. captured wonder,
faction destroyed.] Is there any fix for this?

This happened to me before. I had 2 PCs, playing R: TW on one of them just fine. Then it got hit with Virus, so I went to the other one and played their. On the main menu, wherever I move my mouse, it stays their and laggs, I go to another menu, the first menu keeps showing up. Maybe the Graphics

[Germanvs]

Throwing games is actually free of charge.

In the financial tab it will be noted, but when you actually compare the net-figure with what you have in your coffers, you'll see you didn't pay a dime.

Germanus runs off to issue build-orders for Arena's wherever possible

[Kaidonni]

Actually, it deducts from your income per turn - depending on how frequent the games are. Just like units. So, you will get 400 less for throwing games, say, in Messana, monthly. Turn it back to yearly, and hey presto, your income per turn will go back to what it would have been had you not thrown those games monthly.

[WarHawk1953]

Hello,
I am getting fustrated . I have patched the game with, 1.1,1.2,1.3 and 1.5. The problem I am having :

Playing Julii in imperial campaign, with Med/Med, large units. At least 12 times I would be playing 2 to 5 turns. The game will freeze, nothing moves, mouse frozen. At least 4 of the 12 times in crashed back to desktop.

Here is my system:
E-Machine T2245
Time of this report: 11/15/2005, 16:34:43
Machine name: LARRY
Operating System: Windows XP Home Edition (5.1, Build 2600) Service Pack 2 (2600.xpsp_sp2_gdr.050301-1519)
Language: English (Regional Setting: English)
System Manufacturer: eMachines, Inc.
System Model: Imperial
BIOS: Revision 0.90
Processor: Intel(R) Celeron(R) CPU 2.20GHz
Memory: 510MB RAM
Page File: 210MB used, 1037MB available
Windows Dir: C:\WINDOWS
DirectX Version: DirectX 9.0c (4.09.0000.0904)
DX Setup Parameters: Not found
DxDiag Version: 5.03.2600.2180 32bit Unicode
HD 40Gig
HD 120Gig
DISPLAY NVIDIA NVIDIA GeForce FX 5500 256 memory(on board graphics turned off)
Media Avance Avance AC97 Audio
CDROM HL-DT-ST CD-RW GCE-8400B
CDROM HL-DT-ST DVD-ROM GDR8161B

Monitors
Model Max Resolution Viewable Area Serial Manufactured
PTW 2160 1600 x 1200 32 x 24 cm 6900 July 2004
Mouse Logitech Logitech-compatible Mouse PS/2
DirX 9c

By Whats required I have it.

Has anyone patched to 1.5 and have the same problem?

[WarHawk1953]

Moderator,
Please move the above post to the Apothecary, Game Freezes thread. I have tried a fresh install updated drivers and only patches 1.1 and 1.2. Frezzing still takes place within 3 or four turns! So it is not patch 1.5