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  1. #1
    Member Member Geush's Avatar
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    Default Diseases as a possible set of traits in EB II

    Hello! Long time lurker, seldom poster.

    I was considering the old debate regarding the origins of syphilis (that is, whether it is a New World disease or described in classical Greek texts) when I remarked upon a lack of diseases in EB character traits.

    We have things like madness (loss of influence or management), Lame (permanent movement impairment), Under the Weather/Bedridden (temporary stat decrease) but there are a host of other ailments that we humans are susceptible too, infectious or congenital, that the family members and generals don't have to deal with.

    I understand that trying to include too much is burdensome, but if the team would include a few infectious diseases that were known or referenced in the period, we would gain. They could modeled after specific illnesses or have specific effects and be given generic Attic names.


    Syphilis, as a more complex example (in stages, as per many other traits)

    I. Lesion - This man has developed an open sore in a noteworthy region of his body. It could be connected with his habitual carousing or the will of the gods. At any rate, he had better visit the disciples of Asklepios.
    [Chance of acquiring this trait should be very small; increased by size of the city; increased by large trade; increased by womanising/adulterous traits; increased by taverns/brothels; decreased by reclusive traits]
    [25% chance per season of developing into stage II]

    II. Rashes, Ulcers, and Lesions - This man's outer body has begun to show horrible signs, reflecting a profound sickness within. He may have difficulty concentrating or a slight degree of organ failure.
    -1 Command, -1 Management, -2 Influence, -15% movement
    [50% chance per season of going into dormancy]

    III. Sickness Subsided - Although it no longer progresses outwardly, the illness remains, dormant.
    -1 Command, -1 Management, -1 Influence, -10% movement
    [5% chance per season of progressing into A, B, or C]

    IV A. Locomotor Ataxia - Shuffling and shambling, this man finds it difficult to walk or direct his body. He has become clumsy and hard to understand.
    -2 Command, -2 Management, -2 Influence, -20% movement, -1 hit point

    B. Ungrounded Mind - Insomnia, memory loss, and fainting spells disrupt his daily life. He can no longer be relied upon to manage his affairs or those of the kingdom.
    -1 Command, -4 Management, -2 Influence, -10% movement, -1 hit point

    C. Growths - Fleshy lumps grow unhindered on his bones, organs, and skin. His health is severely impaired and his countenance has grown terrifying.
    -1 Command, -2 Management, -4 Influence, -15% movement, -2 hit points




    Much more easily you could make broad classes, say, physically degenerative (-hp and movement) that might progress under forced march and never recover. Or leprosy.


    Thanks, hope this is something to chew on.

  2. #2

    Default Re: Diseases as a possible set of traits in EB II

    Good idea.

    The scriptors should (hopefully) not have a problem. Like how they change traits e.g The Spartan Agoge.

    'Let no man be called happy before his death. Till then, he is not happy, only lucky." -Solon


  3. #3
    Near East TW Mod Leader Member Cute Wolf's Avatar
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    Default Re: Diseases as a possible set of traits in EB II

    are you think the only disease that growth in several steps are just syphilis.....

    There lies lueprosy, tubercolusis, pox, and much more.... this was better to be united in "seasonal sickness" trait... (coffined to bed, under the weather... etc).. because eventually, this poor guy who infected with syphilis will be forced to cut his own P

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  4. #4
    urk! Member bobbin's Avatar
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    Default Re: Diseases as a possible set of traits in EB II

    I know there's a inbred set of traits already in EB, my Makedonian royal family tend to get them from time to time.


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    Near East TW Mod Leader Member Cute Wolf's Avatar
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    Default Re: Diseases as a possible set of traits in EB II

    Inbred... those incest loving sister maniac is the PTOLIES!!!!

    But ln EB II we could made someone ACTUALLY marry their own sister.... (Princess agent condition: ON!)

    So we could use the Historical "PPTOLIES FAMILY"

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    Member Member Darius's Avatar
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    Default Re: Diseases as a possible set of traits in EB II

    Hopefully doctor/apothecary ancillaries would help fight getting the traits and maybe reduce their severity over time.
    All men will one day die, but not every man will truely live.

  7. #7

    Default Re: Diseases as a possible set of traits in EB II

    Well as a matter of principle it could be fun to have a stuttering king with maximum acumen.

    However as a gameplay matter don't you think your generals/governors are horrible enough?

    In M2TW I find the only way to prevent them from turning 10 dread jerks is to put them on Crusades and make sure they are the Crusaders who take the city/castle.

    As for the original Rome Total War they always get so many horrible stats.

    Even with endless good ancillairies they will generally lose all management and be a finnancial liability, and they will usually lose influence fast.

    Now Medieval Total War 1 had a somewhat easier time as far as generals go, but then every unit had one.

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    Near East TW Mod Leader Member Cute Wolf's Avatar
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    Default Re: Diseases as a possible set of traits in EB II

    @ Tancred...
    On vanilla RTW, maximizing taxes... fight outnumbered (but not outskilled...)... and never built "tavern / Brothel temple (aphrodite, freya, ceres and other "godess"... (there's no brothel in RTW yet))... will almost made your FM into a high management, high influence guy... with prim and proper behaviour... Iron fist is the best... When playing as those overpowered Romans, u need nothing but gladiators (especially Julii... Samnite Gladiators is enough for anything!)... There's nothing deep in roleplaying... unlike EB

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    Member Member Irishmafia2020's Avatar
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    Default Re: Diseases as a possible set of traits in EB II

    Diseases are a common addition to most MTW2 mods, and I believe that there are some "disease packs" which can be generally added without too much difficulty to almost any mod of that engine... having said that, these diseases became a major point of frustration for many players of MTW2 mods because they became so commonplace as to make nearly all generals useless. In almost every case they had to be toned down, and their effects lessened so that the game remained fun. I hope that diseases are added to the game, but when more than 20% of your generals get them (up to 90% in some mods) then role playing is out of the window, and your families become useless...

  10. #10
    master of the wierd people Member Ibrahim's Avatar
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    Default Re: Diseases as a possible set of traits in EB II

    I'm surprised ramad* and judhaam** aren't mentioned; both would have been an issue in ancient arabia.

    *a type of eye disease

    **like leprosy-joints fall off.

    EDIT: say, why not have region related diseases, so if a roman goes into arabia, he has a good chance of contracting ramad in he desert?
    Last edited by Ibrahim; 06-12-2009 at 21:22.
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  11. #11
    Member Member Geush's Avatar
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    Default Re: Diseases as a possible set of traits in EB II

    Yes, the chance to contract diseases would need to be very small. This would also make a little bit of work go further, since you could potentially play a long time without seeing them.

    What Ibrahim's talking about would be fantastic if it can be done. Didn't Xenophon write about frostbite amongst the 10k when they went into the Caucasus? You could name that in proto-Germanic, Hai, and Celtic and attach it to appropriate regions.

    Even better, you could make it so that the chance of getting frostbite increased dramatically when your troops were at -2 or -3 morale due to starving in foreign territory. Then foraging would get even better, representing wilder peoples abilities to deal with extreme conditions and disadvantaging urbanized soldiers who were campaigning out of their element.

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