Strategos Total War

[Old-King_CoalII]

Hello makers of Europa Barborum! I am working on a mod of my own that will occur in Greece between 500 and 150 BCE.

The reason I am coming to you is that I have used a number of your models for the mod. I need your permission to continue with the work on this project.

PS. I am just wondering, did you manage to give each factiona unique general on the battle map? I mean like, each faction with it's own general referenced to in descr_model_battle.

[Aemilius Paulus]

PS. I am just wondering, did you manage to give each factiona unique general on the battle map? I mean like, each faction with it's own general referenced to in descr_model_battle.

Actually, that is the same question that was bothering me too. I thought generals were tied to culture, not faction. So is EB the proof that they are tied to faction?

[Maion Maroneios]

Hello makers of Europa Barborum! I am working on a mod of my own that will occur in Greece between 500 and 150 BCE.

That's a very long period. Don't want to extinguish your flame of passion of this mod-in-the-making, but are you certain that you will be able to represent (efficiently and accurately) all of these:
1) The city-states of Hellas
2) The Persian Wars
3) The clash between Athens and Sparta
4) The rise of Thebes
5) The rise of Macedon
6) The conquests of Megas Alexandros
7) The splitting of Alexandros' Empire and forming of entirely new factions
8) The Diadochi Wars after Alexandros' death
9) The various civil wars and clashes between factions, as well as the emergence of several new ones
10) The Galatian campaigns in Greece and forming of a state in Anatolia
11) The rise of Rome
12) Many others as well

Maion

[Aemilius Paulus]

That's a very long period. Don't want to extinguish your flame of passion of this mod-in-the-making, but are you certain that you will be able to represent (efficiently and accurately) all of these:
1) The city-states of Hellas
2) The Persian Wars
3) The clash between Athens and Sparta
4) The rise of Thebes
5) The rise of Macedon
6) The conquests of Megas Alexandros
7) The splitting of Alexandros' Empire and forming of entirely new factions
8) The Diadochi Wars after Alexandros' death
9) The various civil wars and clashes between factions, as well as the emergence of several new ones
10) The Galatian campaigns in Greece and forming of a state in Anatolia
11) The rise of Rome
12) Many others as well

Maion is definitely right. That is more ambitious than EB. Lot of Reforms there you will have. Either that or it will be inaccurate. I would stop at least before Philip II and Alexander.

So, my question is, what will be your map scope?

[bobbin]

Actually, that is the same question that was bothering me too. I thought generals were tied to culture, not faction. So is EB the proof that they are tied to faction?

Look in descr_model_strat.txt, it controls the stratmap models and hence the FM and captain models used.

[Celtic_Punk]

I suggest you do the Persian wars and the Peloponnesian wars and maybe the rise of makedon. (maybe not... makedonia blows )

[Old_King_Coal]

ok, this is the same Old_King_Coal as before, I just lost my passand I can't get it back :(

But anyway, all you need to know is at Rome Total War heaven in the modifications thread. Look for Strategos Total War. (I'd post a link but it won't let me)

So i take it that i do have permission?

[Aemilius Paulus]

But anyway, all you need to know is at Rome Total War heaven in the modifications thread. Look for Strategos Total War. (I'd post a link but it won't let me)

Here

So i take it that i do have permission?

No, we are not the spokespeople here. Private Message Foot or MAA

[Celtic_Punk]

you could make your own campaign map aswell. Shrink it so it doesnt strench so far west and shorten its span north so you have the hellenic influenced areas to the east, and much larger to allow for a lot more strategic movement in Greece. Make sure those Spartans have some boss Corinthian helmets!

[Old_King_Coal]

ok, now that you're done blowing eachother up :P

I can get to answering these questions...

@Celtic Punk: ya I am planning on having a big map, it will be proprtionately bigger than the vanilla one so no worries for flexibility in greece. Also, the Spartans will certainly have some corinthina helmets, along with pylos and thracian helmets as well.

@Maion Maroneios: I have posted a thing to the leader guy, I'll wait for his response

I'm having a little trouble deciding what to make the regular Spartan Hoplites aka Homoioi look like. I have a number of variations, so I'll take some votes on what to do from u guys.


ok, first one, (currently implemeted) has a pylos helmet and simple linothorax armor. Perhaps the most historical of the lot, as Spartans could never afford as good armor as other greeks since they were stuck in barracks for their military career.


Second one, similar to the one in EB. It has a pylos helmet but a muscle cuirass. This is based of an account that the homoioi carried muscle armor given to them from the state. This is less likely because Spata was not a rich state, it would not be likely to have hoplites armed in state-provided armor.


Third, one of my favorites . it has a Corinthian helmet and wears bronze muscle armor. Unlikely, though good looking I hope we can agree.


Much like the last except has no black paint on the helmet and has a different shield. The color-scheme on this shield is based of what reenactors and historians usually tend to feature.

well, what do you think? I cannot include them all

PS don't just make your decision based on the corinthian helmets. There are plenty of those

[Alsatia]

Nice skinning. Just wondering what is a chicken doing on the shield?

So many helmets of the same kind.

Quare volo non in achaia et macedonia esse familiaris ad aliquis romanus?

[Old_King_Coal]

ya, the chicken is based off depictions on Greek pottery, I thought it made a nice contrast to the lambda that always shows up.

btw, here is an example:

[Duguntz]

Why don't you try the Theban Helmet? I think they just kick asses! It's the same helmet helmet thand those guys on the right (with the Rooster, by the way, it's no chicken at all! rooster is a symbol of freedom... chicken is a symbol of... eggs and bacon with coffee!!! hmmmmm) But the theban helmet is rather cool and was very popular in the 5th and 4th century BC along with the traditional corinthian helmet... The only difference though is that the horsehair are more elevated and the hair drops longer in the back of he warrior... Yeah, perhaps looks a bit hollywood, but historically accurate, that is for sure! (and they kick asses!)

Cheers

[Celtic_Punk]

2nd last one!!!

[Maion Maroneios]

Nice work Coal, but you didn't answer my initial question? How are you going to incluse all those changes in the Hellenic world in a single mod?

Maion

[Cute Wolf]

Good things... especially those chickens on the shields LOL

Did ancient hellenes know about what "Conotative" terms "Chickens" have now?

[Old_King_Coal]

@Maion: ya, i forgot your q, sorry bu I do have an answer! I believe Euopa Barborum has managed to have 2 Marian reform-type things so if u guys can do it I figure I can! But I'll need help from scripters and such

@Cute Wolf: I don't know but I doubt the Greeks would paint chickens on their shields if they mean you're a coward. lol, i dunno what they might mean to the Greeks however.

[Cute Wolf]

@ Old King Coal
They paint chickens because they want some hot chicks as plunder...

Sorry, off topic, Btw, aside from that chickens, that's nice topics... for the Spartan skin I prefer 2 kind of spartans, the lower class (with just leather armor), and The Last Muscled one,,,

[Mediolanicus]

@Maion: ya, i forgot your q, sorry bu I do have an answer! I believe Euopa Barborum has managed to have 2 Marian reform-type things so if u guys can do it I figure I can! But I'll need help from scripters and such

@Cute Wolf: I don't know but I doubt the Greeks would paint chickens on their shields if they mean you're a coward. lol, i dunno what they might mean to the Greeks however.

Military reforms is something completely different from changing faction mid-campaign as your mod would require.

And I think those would be roosters rather than just "chickens".

[Old_King_Coal]

ok, so how would I doa faction reform as you say?

[Mediolanicus]

Well, AFAIK, you can't...

That's why Maion, Aemilius and me wonder what you are going to do about that and why we think it is impossible to recreate the period between 330 and 150 BC in your mod (Persia -> Alexandrian Empire --> Diadochi States)

[Old_King_Coal]

well I wouldn't really need the diadochi, as the map dosen't have anything east of Asia Minor there is no Empire to make, as such no Empire to split apart. See what I mean? Also Macedonia and Greece were still part of the Antigonid Empire after Alexander's death.

So I'm not going to worry too much about the successors.

[Maion Maroneios]

Then I'm afraid you'll lack the necessary historical accuracy, my friend.

Maion

[Old_King_Coal]

well if it's not possible there's no point in trying is there? also the map dosen't even include the places like Egypt and Syria where the Diadochi were positioned. I just can't do he Diadochi, end of story

[Maion Maroneios]

Then what are you actually going to include in your minimod? How are you going to represent:
1) The Peloponnesian Wars
2) The Iphikratean Reforms leading into the demise of Sparta
3) The rise of Thebes
4) The rise of Macedon by political and military reforms?

Maion

[Old_King_Coal]

pretty much ya, and If Macedonia manages to win Greece then they can go on to conquer Asia Minor. Also ROme and Carthage are included along with Scythia and Dacia, so there's no shortage of big conflict

[Celtic_Punk]

Coal you know what you should do? Make the whole map greece, the aegean, and the west coast of turkey. plus all the islands and what not. and call it Hellas Totalwar (or something better than that cause that sounds like some kind of hezbolla thing and thats bad news bears hahaha). But just make it on the Pelopenesian wars. And at the begining you can add the persian invaisions with scripted army spawns or something like that. this mod could climax with the pelopenesian wars and then finish off with the rise of makedon. All your factions would be various city states that played a central military role in greece at the time. The pelopenesian wars could be started by taking advantage of the unbreakable alliance thing. Sparta and Athens could take up 2 of the roman factions and when the right date/conditions (eg. persia defeated) you could be able to start the pelopenesian wars.
I don't know what it involves, and it would probably be the biggest endeavour, but this would require a totally new campaign map and what not. (obviously)

[Aemilius Paulus]

Actually, CP, I though of that too when I saw the thread. You have a fine idea there. True, the mod will be limited, but IMHO< with only one person working on the mod, it needs to limit its ambition. Not to mention, I would love such a tight-scope mod for a change. However, is it not true a mod like this already exists? With just Greece?

Maybe not, but anyway, I also think Italia needs to be added to CP's idea. Megale Hellas it will be, plus with the Roman Kingdom/Very Early republic. And Etruscans. An important Greek colony. With that, one may also add Crimean Peninsula as well.

[||Lz3||]

Fear... the chicken...



You cannot have a Greek mod without Syracuse.

[Celtic_Punk]

not on greece but on the isles. Arthurian Total War. I played it for a bit, then i found this and nearly died. Thoguh i really enjoyed playing as my ancestor's clan. But i kept getting clobbered.