Late-Term Abortion Provider Gunned Down In Church

[Andres]

I trust our fellow humans to make the right decision. I do not believe that anyone will take a convenience abortion at 7 months "because they didn't feel like doing it earlier".

If someone wants to go through with a late abortion, there will be an extraordinary reason for it, simply because noone would want to hurt themselves more than necessary(at 10 weeks its a simple and quick pill, at 6 months it's a large operation).

I have faith in my fellow humans. I trust them to make the right decision themselves.

That's not what you said previously now, is it?

You draw the line at birth, you allow your fellow humans to do a late term abortion for no extraordinary reason and it would be very naive to think there wouldn't be some people who would do a late term abortion for no extraordinary reason.

I'm all for a compromise: allow it until the 12th week; allow it under extreme circumstances until the 16th week (I believe amnioscentesis can be done after 14 weeks?).

What you propose (draw the line at birth) is madness.

[HoreTore]

That's not what you said previously now, is it?

You draw the line at birth, you allow your fellow humans to do a late term abortion for no extraordinary reason and it would be very naive to think there wouldn't be some people who would do a late term abortion for no extraordinary reason..

It's not what I've said previously no, but that might have something to do with me not having said anything about it before... Funny, eh?

As for "would some retards exploit it?" - just why, might I ask, would anyone do just that? Why on earth would they bring extra pain and suffering to themselves? I don't buy that.

But then again, this is subjective. I trust people to choose what is best for them. I won't make such a choice for anyone else.

Why do you want to play god with other people, by the way? Why this urge to control others, why not realize that you know what's best for yourself, and let other people and their doctors find out what's best for them?

[Andres]

Why do you want to play god with other people, by the way? Why this urge to control others, why not realize that you know what's best for yourself, and let other people and their doctors find out what's best for them?

Why do we have laws?

Why not just all live in complete anarchy and let everybody decide what's best for themselves?



But I'll back out of this one since I don't think we'll ever agree.

Let's just agree to disagree then, ok?

[Ronin]

Why do we have laws?

Why not just all live in complete anarchy and let everybody decide what's best for themselves?



But I'll back out of this one since I don't think we'll ever agree.

Let's just agree to disagree then, ok?

I think you will find that most laws restrict what you may do to others....so your example doesn´t really apply.

[HoreTore]

I think you will find that most laws restrict what you may do to others....so your example doesn´t really apply.

JACKPOT!

[Andres]

I think you will find that most laws restrict what you may do to others....so your example doesn´t really apply.

That's what I meant indeed. My questions were rhetorical.

[Kadagar_AV]

Abortion should be an option at any time.

IF someone choose a late, or very late abortion there must be a reason for it.

Either because the offspring is severly damaged already, or because the mother is psychotic. I dont want psychotic people to raise kids anyway.

It's not like 2 people have sex, she gets pregnant, and then she decides some 8 months later to have an abortion just "because".

There is a reason.
















On a sidenote, and this is IMPORTANT: History has showed that people will have abortions one way or the other no matter what the law says.

Can anyone argue against this?

Now, I would much prefer these abortions to be made in a controled enviroment than on some kitchen table with a butcher knife.

THIS is one of the most important aspects of this discussion, and it has been neglected thus far.

[Louis VI the Fat]

History has showed that people will have abortions one way or the other no matter what the law says.

Can anyone argue against this?

This is the Backroom. We can argue against everything.

In this case, I'd argue that yes, indeed, people will have abortions regardless of legal prohibition.

Likewise, people will murder, steal, and pillage regardless of legal prohibition. This is not generally considered good cause for legalization of murder and theft.

This unlike, however, alcohol prohibiton. Which is owing to previous experience generally considered unfeasonable. In turn again, unlike drugs, the use of which is commonly prohibited, despite similar objections. Ah...the law...always balancing between the feasonable and the desirable, between the practical and the ideal.

If I would think abortion immoral, I might yet be against prohibition because of the reason you stated.

[Philippus Flavius Homovallumus]

Well spoken!

Do people who prefer 'natural' sex abstain from the use of contraceptives like the pill or condoms too?
And what of peridocal abstinence. Is that natural? Or is counting the days already 'unnatural'?
And what of 'no sex before marriage'? Marriage is a recent invention. Therefore 'no sex before it' is unnatural too.

I also suggest that people 'accept the consequences' of running really fast and refuse to see a doctor in case of tripping over real bad.


Unlike many other animals, but like several, humans have sex as a means of social bonding.

Oh, I know we have sex for social reasons, mainly to bond couples together, thereby increasing the stability of the environment into which the offspring are born.

Nature is canny like that.

But if I hear a fetus say "no, I don't want an abortion", I'll happily agree that that one fetus shouldn't be aborted.

So, we shouldn't provide CPR unless someone can ask? What about surgery for headshot victims?

Why do you want to play god with other people, by the way? Why this urge to control others, why not realize that you know what's best for yourself, and let other people and their doctors find out what's best for them?

I don't think we're playing God, Judge maybe, but definately not God. You are the one advocating the destruction of deffenceless life, is that not Godlike?

Also, a true atheist is someone without any beliefs about the supernatural etc. That's what you look like to me. In any case, my point was that you do not subscribe, so far as I know, to any higher principle than human experience. You cannot, therefore, claim any higher justification than nature because humans are merely animals. Highly evolved animals, but still animals.

[HoreTore]

Oh, I know we have sex for social reasons, mainly to bond couples together, thereby increasing the stability of the environment into which the offspring are born.

Nature is canny like that.

Yes, that's nature. And we have decided that nature sucks, so we fixed nature. The last thing life is about is reproduction.

So, we shouldn't provide CPR unless someone can ask? What about surgery for headshot victims?

Of course we should. But do remind me, what do we do to people in a veggie state...?

Also, a true atheist is someone without any beliefs about the supernatural etc. That's what you look like to me. In any case, my point was that you do not subscribe, so far as I know, to any higher principle than human experience. You cannot, therefore, claim any higher justification than nature because humans are merely animals. Highly evolved animals, but still animals.

I can disregard nature just as easily as I can disregard God, gods, Flying Spaghetti Monsters or Tim.