When is a fascist not a fascist?

[CountArach]

An uncomfortable truth. Facism is the bastard child of the left. They are still left wing, look at the social policies. About as far away from the free arket as you could get.

So what you mean is that Fascism is Keynesian. Keynesianism is not Socialism by any means - Socialism is the centralisation of the modes of production in the hands of the working class. Fascists believed in state intervention for the benefit of Corporations - every Fascist regime in history has had Corporatist structures within it.

Further, Socialism is built around the use of trade unions - Fascism had always destroyed unions and replaced them with state-run organisations.

[Beskar]

He is probably in the opinion Stalin is actually a Communist as depicted in the Communist Manifesto.

In short - He isn't.

[CountArach]

He is probably in the opinion Stalin is actually a Communist as depicted in the Communist Manifesto.

In short - He isn't.

The same argument I've been making for at least 6 months in the Backroom. I'll get sick of repeating myself one day.

[Evil_Maniac From Mars]

He is probably in the opinion Stalin is actually a Communist as depicted in the Communist Manifesto.

In short - He isn't.

You think Stalin is a fascist? I would remind you, before you answer, that there is more than one variant of communism.

[CountArach]

You think Stalin is a fascist? I would remind you, before you answer, that there is more than one variant of communism.

Stalin was a Stalinist. Funny how these terms already exist, init?

[Evil_Maniac From Mars]

Stalin was a Stalinist. Funny how these terms already exist, init?

And what is Stalinism? A variant of communism (or an interpretation of it, etc). I don't see your point with defining Stalin as Stalinist though. Is Marxism not a form of communism because it is Marxism?

[KarlXII]

And what is Stalinism? A variant of communism (or an interpretation of it, etc). I don't see your point with defining Stalin as Stalinist though. Is Marxism not a form of communism because it is Marxism?

We have specific varieties of every umbrella political theory. Democracy can be Parliamentary, Republican, Representative, Direct. Monarchy can be Absolute, Constitutional.

[Evil_Maniac From Mars]

We have specific varieties of every umbrella political theory. Democracy can be Parliamentary, Republican, Representative, Direct. Monarchy can be Absolute, Constitutional.

That was what I was arguing (to a certain extent). A square is a rectangle, though not all rectangles are squares.

[InsaneApache]

Hey guys. Try typng Benito into google. He was the author of the fascists after all. It's amazing how much you pick up from not reading history, isn't it?

[CountArach]

Hey guys. Try typng Benito into google. He was the author of the fascists after all. It's amazing how much you pick up from not reading history, isn't it?

Mussolini was indeed a former Socialist, however the nationalistic bastardisation he offered was thoroughly unsocialist. And to show I do know what I'm talking about I'm actually going to quote from *shock and horror* an historian. This is from Robert Paxton in "The Anatomy of Fascism", one of the most complete studies of the formation and policies of Fascism.

pp. 145-147:

In no domain did the proposals of early fascism differ more from what fascist regimes did in practice than in economc policy. This was the area where both fascist leaders conceded the most to their conervatiuve allies.
[...]
Fascism was not the first choice of most businessmen, but most of them preferred it to the alternatives that seemed likely in the special conditions of 1922 and 1933 - socialism or a dysfunctional market system. [...] Mussolini's famous corporatist economic organization, in particular, was run in practice by leading businessmen."

Peter Hayes puts it succinctly: the Nazi regime and business had "converging by not identical interests." Areas of agreement included disciplining workers, lucrative armaments contrats, and job-creation stimuli. Important areas of conflict involved government economic controls, limits on trade and the high cost of autarky
[...]
Fascists had to do something about the welfare state. In Germany, the welfare experiments of the Weimar Republic had proved too expensive after the Depression struck in 1929. The Nazis trimmed them and perverted them by racial forms of exclusion. But neither fascist reime tried to dismantle the welfare state (as mere reactionaries might have done).

I can't be bothered to type any more right now, but rest assured I know what I am talking about and the facts are on my side.