Spy Fired Shot That Changed West Germany

[Ice]

And on a darker note it became the chief justification for violent action by terrorist groups like the Red Army Faction and the Second of June Movement, which even took its name from the day of Mr. Ohnesorg’s killing.

It wasn't all good.

[Ser Clegane]

Teh old :)

But seriously - this has been a subject of big discussion here in Germany. The idea that this killing actually caused the events that followed (e.g., the terror by the RAF) is broadly rejected - and rightly so. To believe that such a simple causality exists would completely ignore the overall situation and atmosphere of that time.

Furthermore, it should be noted, that one thing that also caused the uproar was the anger over the fact that the killing of Ohnesorg was completely without consequences for the guy who shot him and the feeling that the powers of that time were actually protecting the "murderer".
If you subscribe to the idea that the shooting of Ohnesorg was indeed intentional (i.e. ordered by the Stasi) this would support the view of the left at that time that there was indeed no interest or will by the administration or jurisdiction to prosecute Karras, adding to the interpretation of the radical left that the ruling system of the time was corrupted.

The key learning in this case is that the influence of the Stasi in Western Germany was even more substantial than people would imagine - that the Stasi actually caused the uproar of the 68 generation is nothing else than a complete oversimplification (and the wet dream of some rightwingers here in Germany about the whole 68 movement being staged by the GDR).

[Louis VI the Fat]

'68' was an international revolution. Moreover, 68 also occured within the Eastern Bloc (Prague Spring). So, sorry, it can not be deemed the result of communist agitation. No matter how much the (hard)right would like it to be.


I am shocked at the extent of infiltration of East Germany into West German society. Nothing new indeed, but prennnially shocking nonetheless.


I also think simplification lies at the root. There is, and has been for decades, a battle between the (hard)right and the (hard)left for the history and nature of Germany. Much as there is elsewhere, but in Germany history is more political. And politics is more historical.

The democratic German right is not nazism, and the democratic German left is not communism. Alas, in Germany, more than elsewhere, there has been a real and historical element of undemocratic right and left, of fascism and communism. Which feeds the thought that those on the other side are undemocratic in nature and origin.
Infatilodytes, as usual, tend to pick a side, and to fit their opinion of the other side into this scheme. The result is unreasonable ideological extremists. Extremists, who peculiarly consider themselves moderates. Because they base their ideology on resistance to the alleged extremism of the other side. Which fuels the idea that the other side is made up of extremists (since there really are so many of them, and they talk so loudly). Which in turn fuels the ideological battle again.

The question then, is not whether 'the left' or 'the right' is correct. The sole question is how to limit both to a mere nuisance. To mere irritating background noise. To people who talk too loud and think too little. How to prevent their rigid, Manichean opinion of Germany from dominating and obstructing moderate, liberal democracy.

[Kralizec]

Teh old :)

But seriously - this has been a subject of big discussion here in Germany. The idea that this killing actually caused the events that followed (e.g., the terror by the RAF) is broadly rejected - and rightly so. To believe that such a simple causality exists would completely ignore the overall situation and atmosphere of that time.

Of course. But it's still very ironic.

[Fragony]

The key learning in this case is that the influence of the Stasi in Western Germany was even more substantial than people would imagine - that the Stasi actually caused the uproar of the 68 generation is nothing else than a complete oversimplification (and the wet dream of some rightwingers here in Germany about the whole 68 movement being staged by the GDR).

Of course. Blaming all on this murder is like blaming the start of WW1 on the murder of Franz Ferdinand. But the hardcore left justified itself with this murder, it's fun to rub it in.

funny detail, all threads about this posted on the antifa website were delete+instant ban.

[Louis VI the Fat]

the hardcore left justified itself with this murder

And the hardcore right justifies itself with the left justifying itself with this and etcetera

And the result are hordes of internetboys who think Germany needs a hardcore right to stop the left and a horde of hardcore lefties in squatted houses who think they are needed to stop the right. Most tiresome.

I'll pull an IA: two cheeks of the same arse.

[Fragony]

Not that fond of either personally. When something is funny it's funny and this is funny.