Successor game rules, draft one.

[ULC]

Can Counts create Houses? But without the legitimacy of the "First Four"? Can a Duke utterly disown his own House and provide said legitimacy to the upstart Count led House?

If so - fun times indeed

[Zim]

As it currently stands if a Count successfully became independent they would go down to Baron status until they managed to convince the Council to vote into creation their new House. They'd be free to create a defacto House, but would be blocked off from the higher ranks until their House gained legitamacy.

I had done that to make the Houses more stable in that one would need to join one to gain access to the higher ranks. Maybe that's going too far?

In your scenario is the Duke dropping his own House to rule the new one? Or dropping his rank to bestow it on the Count? The former is easy enough but I hadn't even considered the latter. I can see a Duke losing their title as part of a peace agreement in a Civil War.

Can Counts create Houses? But without the legitimacy of the "First Four"? Can a Duke utterly disown his own House and provide said legitimacy to the upstart Count led House?

If so - fun times indeed

[ULC]

As it currently stands if a Count successfully became independent they would go down to Baron status until they managed to convince the Council to vote into creation their new House. They'd be free to create a defacto House, but would be blocked off from the higher ranks until their House gained legitamacy.

I had done that to make the Houses more stable in that one would need to join one to gain access to the higher ranks. Maybe that's going too far?

In your scenario is the Duke dropping his own House to rule the new one? Or dropping his rank to bestow it on the Count? The former is easy enough but I hadn't even considered the latter. I can see a Duke losing their title as part of a peace agreement in a Civil War.

The idea is that a Count fights for his right to have a House, but he isn't as strong, but he isn't subjected to the whims of the First Four.

The second part is the idea that a Duke could disown his own House in favor of another, such as said Count above, for his own reasons - thus stripping one of the First Four of it's legitimacy, and granting it to the Counts House, who is now a Duke. This would allow for a dynamic change in the Houses and for some interesting storyline. This would of course be a part of the Dukes will, so death or retirement must come first.

Also, yes, that was also implied - what if a Count defeated a Duke and demanded the title for peace?

[Zim]

Well, as it stands a Count could fight to leave a House and even form a defacto House of new members or fellow deserters, but would lose access to the higher ranks (busted down to Baron).

So said Duke would be giving his title of Duke to the Count? If he dies he can make anybody he wants his heir. I'd be interested in hearing whether people think Dukes should be able to "retire" while still alive and give his title to another.

I definitely think an addition to the rules should be made to allow losing the title through civil war.

The idea is that a Count fights for his right to have a House, but he isn't as strong, but he isn't subjected to the whims of the First Four.

The second part is the idea that a Duke could disown his own House in favor of another, such as said Count above, for his own reasons - thus stripping one of the First Four of it's legitimacy, and granting it to the Counts House, who is now a Duke. This would allow for a dynamic change in the Houses and for some interesting storyline. This would of course be a part of the Dukes will, so death or retirement must come first.

Also, yes, that was also implied - what if a Count defeated a Duke and demanded the title for peace?

[ULC]

Hmmm...you mentioned another rank as a possibility...maybe we should have a rank that a King can bestow, that adds power and prestige to a House, or some other function, that another House would want, creating friction through sucking up and power gain? I keep thinking Archduke or Master of Arms as possible titles.

[Zim]

That might not be a bad idea, although we should take care to keep things from getting too complicated. Maybe the Mast of Arms to lead the King's army (on that note I don't think I gave the king any prioritized units, better fix that).

[AussieGiant]

I'm not trying to be rude here,

but,

I think everyone should just stop talking about more rules.

Just play the damn game and if you want more rules, then do it "In Character" as part of the frame work already created.

That was nearly the single most effect aspect of KotR.

-EDIT- The "egypt" and "balloon" is to ensure those of you that know me well enough realise this is a bit of friendly slapping.