Successor game rules, draft one.

[ULC]

Yes so why don't we just play AD&D on line?

You guy's are going rule mad.

Thats where I thought this dueling thing was going, although in a far and away simpler format. Suddenly I am tempted to duel everyone from KotR against each other

It's fun though, and it will most likely happen rarely. Most extremely simple systems have to much random chance in them.

And this will mostly be a write up of how everything plays out, with me or whomever as arbiter.

You know what, I'm going to go do that - pit the old electors against their hated rivals and see who wins . It's just to tempting to pass up.

[econ21]

Yes so why don't we just play AD&D on line?

You guy's are going rule mad.

I thought you would be interested in the idea of rules for duels, as it was the memory of Arnold impotently pursuing Jan that made me suggest the idea. I agree there is a risk of over-complexity, although with duels requiring mutual consent, it will be easy for a player to opt out if the rules just do their head in. Let's ponder on it for a few days and then when we have one or two specific proposals, we can decide.

Most times, this judgment was first conducted on horseback with lances and if necessary was prolonged with whatever weapons were chosen, axes, swords, maces...

That's exactly what I had in mind - I like grounding rules in history, otherwise everything risks seeming arbitrary. My thinking is that the opening jousting would be relatively bloodless and with few modifiers (they would primarily relate to experience, age and any traits relating specificallly to riding). The fun - risk of death and rules compexity - would really start if it got to combat on foot, although I take AGs point that we don't want to go overboard.

I like TCs and YLCs ideas. I'll do some research on the history and possible rules, then come back in a couple of days with a proposed system that steals draws from them. Once we have exhausted discussion, we can put any specific proposals to Zim for approval and if they receive it, organise a poll if there is a choice or disagreement among other players.

[GeneralHankerchief]

I thought you would be interested in the idea of rules for duels, as it was the memory of Arnold impotently pursuing Jan that made me suggest the idea. I agree there is a risk of over-complexity, although with duels requiring mutual consent, it will be easy for a player to opt out if the rules just do their head in. Let's ponder on it for a few days and then when we have one or two specific proposals, we can decide.

One of the biggest problems in LotR was a sort of rule overload in which the complexity and sheer volume of things we had to familiar with was bogging down the game. Midway through the PBM, TinCow called a time-out and a group of us worked together to streamline things. Since then, there's been a kind of spoken and unspoken consent to make it as KISS as possible.

[ULC]

One of the biggest problems in LotR was a sort of rule overload in which the complexity and sheer volume of things we had to familiar with was bogging down the game. Midway through the PBM, TinCow called a time-out and a group of us worked together to streamline things. Since then, there's been a kind of spoken and unspoken consent to make it as KISS as possible.

I'm hoping that I can do a KISS for the participants, and handle the rules complexity on my side - this way, the participants would only need to play a rock paper scissors game, and try to focus on the psychology of their opponent. It's proven that you can consistently win at RPS, through strategy

[Zim]

If any duel system is picked, I'd say the easiest thing to do would be to place it outside the official KOTF rules, rather like TinCow's race in the Hippodrome. A "tournament field" thread could be created to act as both an IC thread and site for duels. Anyone wanting to fight one would then have to agree to go by the ruleset presented, or do it all as a story or whatever they prefer. I could implement any in-game changes they agreed on (say one character died, or they were betting a province or something).

That way the main rules don't get cluttered up, and if certain things worked or didn't it would be much easier play around with the duel rules.

[ULC]

If any duel system is picked, I'd say the easiest thing to do would be to place it outside the official KOTF rules, rather like TinCow's race in the Hippodrome. A "tournament field" thread could be created to act as both an IC thread and site for duels. Anyone wanting to fight one would then have to agree to go by the ruleset presented, or do it all as a story or whatever they prefer. I could implement any in-game changes they agreed on (say one character died, or they were betting a province or something).

That way the main rules don't get cluttered up, and if certain things worked or didn't it would be much easier play around with the duel rules.

I'm already adapting my rules to take this into account, which will centralize each characters stats for the duel system and will allow fair creation of Champions. We could go one step further and create full tourneys with the system, both for mounted and unmounted combat.

[econ21]

If any duel system is picked, I'd say the easiest thing to do would be to place it outside the official KOTF rules, rather like TinCow's race in the Hippodrome. ...

That way the main rules don't get cluttered up,...

In that spirit, it's probably best to split off discussion of tournament rules into a separate thread, so it does not crowd out or over-shadow consideratin of the core game rules. I'll start a new thread for it.

[TinCow]

One of the biggest problems in LotR was a sort of rule overload in which the complexity and sheer volume of things we had to familiar with was bogging down the game. Midway through the PBM, TinCow called a time-out and a group of us worked together to streamline things. Since then, there's been a kind of spoken and unspoken consent to make it as KISS as possible.

QFT, though I don't generally think this applies to ancillary rule systems like the chariot races. The biggest problem I see with the duels is not that they will be too complex (only one person really needs to understand them anyway) but that they won't be used. I originally imagined the chariot races as a way for people to gamble their possessions with others and to resolve disputes by seeing whose team won a race. It was never used for that.

If there is a serious risk of death from dueling, I doubt we'll see it used too much. I don't know about you, but I'm not likely to risk my avatar's life on a roll of the dice. If I'm going to get myself killed, it will be in a PvP battle. This is the reason I suggest drinking challenges instead.

[ULC]

QFT, though I don't generally think this applies to ancillary rule systems like the chariot races. The biggest problem I see with the duels is not that they will be too complex (only one person really needs to understand them anyway) but that they won't be used. I originally imagined the chariot races as a way for people to gamble their possessions with others and to resolve disputes by seeing whose team won a race. It was never used for that.

If there is a serious risk of death from dueling, I doubt we'll see it used too much. I don't know about you, but I'm not likely to risk my avatar's life on a roll of the dice. If I'm going to get myself killed, it will be in a PvP battle. This is the reason I suggest drinking challenges instead.

Oh, I see how it is - exclude those who can't or won't drink. And what if I dislike the alcohol in question?How fair of you

[AussieGiant]

The new thread is covering this gents.

And I make the same issue TC just did. It's a nice threat to have, which maybe all it needs to be as if someone in the Diet session has enough steam up he can use it as a leverage point.

Can you imagine Arnold with good duelling characteristics in a Diet session....sweat lord, it could have been a blood bath...literally.

Having said that...it's a hell of a risk.

[_Tristan_]

I originally imagined the chariot races as a way for people to gamble their possessions with others and to resolve disputes by seeing whose team won a race. It was never used for that.

I hate to contradict but I can remember at least one instance of this : settling the dispute between Methodios (myself) and Nikiphoros (Warmaster Horus) over Scopia of all provinces ().

And I must admit that I rather like the idea of non-lethal (but shameful, for the loser) "trial by god".

[ULC]

I hate to contradict but I can remember at least one instance of this : settling the dispute between Methodios (myself) and Nikiphoros (Warmaster Horus) over Scopia of all provinces ().

And I must admit that I rather like the idea of non-lethal (but shameful, for the loser) "trial by god".

So you like my rule set? Anything you'd like to see, amended, added, removed? Posted in the correct thread of course

[_Tristan_]

See my post in said thread