Old dudes

**Darius** · 06-14-2009, 09:28

Is there anyway to edit the game so that nobody over the age of 30 tries to marry my daughters? I'm tired of people older than her father (who is in his late 50's mind you) trying to marry my little girls. It's not just that its creepy, its just that I can't for the life of me bring myself to accept, no matter how good he is, knowing he's gonna bite it in a couple of turns anyway.

**Maion Maroneios** · 06-14-2009, 10:27

Hehehe, I understand you. I'm afraid that is not possible. Keep in mind that, during EB's timeframe, marriage was purely a political tool instead of a fusion of two people who are in love. I remember that married couples that loved each other were considered weird in Greece at least. So marrying your 16 year old daughter to a 50 year old guy with a lot of influence and wealth, was not very strange at that time. Just get over the stereotypes of today and try to think as they did back then.

Maion

**AttilaDerHunn** · 06-14-2009, 12:26

Originally Posted by Maion Maroneios

Hehehe, I understand you. I'm afraid that is not possible. Keep in mind that, during EB's timeframe, marriage was purely a political tool instead of a fusion of two people who are in love. I remember that married couples that loved each other were considered weird in Greece at least. So marrying your 16 year old daughter to a 50 year old guy with a lot of influence and wealth, was not very strange at that time. Just get over the stereotypes of today and try to think as they did back then.

Maion

wow.......that was.......well now we know that girls back then didn't dream of growing up to get married AFAIK

**Ca Putt** · 06-14-2009, 12:45

If an old geezer marries one of "my" daughters I try to get a picture of him via traints after which he should either not beat the poor girl if they have a bit on the side^^ or be so old and rich that nobody will be suprised if he dies soon ;)

**Andy1984** · 06-14-2009, 15:51

euhm... play as one of the harem-factions? That way you don't need to care about your 16 y.o. daughters.

**Maion Maroneios** · 06-14-2009, 16:38

Originally Posted by AttilaDerHunn

wow.......that was.......well now we know that girls back then didn't dream of growing up to get married AFAIK

Frankly, they weren't even allowed to dream at all. As you may know, a woman's role in Greek society was to bear children and take care of the household. No voting rights, no rights to express her oppinion freely, not even any rights of property or even freedom to go as she pleases.

Even though things changed a bit during the Hellenistic Period (were we see Princesses and Queens having considerable power for the first time), women were generally much less free than they are today. No equality at all.

A woman was basically raised by her mother to be a good wife (cleaning, cooking etc.), then around the age of 16 (which was the normal age of marriage for a girl) she was married to a male from another family. The age of marriage for a man, was typically 30. So you see there is already a considerable time gap. Having a good-looking wife was simply a bonus at that time, as the only thing she was expected to do was to bear you healthy children. You were typically "allowed" to have multiple partners (the so-called "Pallakides" or even "Hetairai") apart from your wife. Having sex with your wife only, or loving her as I said above, was generally considered weird.

Maion

**K-Dogs** · 06-14-2009, 22:44

With the exception of Spartan women, of course, who were the predominant figures in society whilst the men were at war.

**Fierro** · 06-14-2009, 23:49

In my previous romani campaign I constantly had 60-70+ year olds trying to marry my daughters!
What is the age limit when family members can no longer have children?
I saw some ~40 year olds have kids.. but I don't know when they can no longer do so.
If I knew the age and if the game showed the age of the wife who is getting married it would be better. Fine with me if a 60 year old woman marries a 70 year old man. They aren't going to be having kids regardless so might as well have another good family member. Now if I happened to marry my 13 (I think that's when they can get married?) year old daughter to some 70 year old who can't get it up anymore well that's a whole potential branch of the family tree cut off right there.

**Maion Maroneios** · 06-14-2009, 23:59

Originally Posted by K-Dogs

With the exception of Spartan women, of course, who were the predominant figures in society whilst the men were at war.

Indeed. But they were a rare exception. I was talking about the vast majority, not minor exceptions.

Maion

**Philippus Flavius Homovallumus** · 06-15-2009, 01:50

Originally Posted by Maion Maroneios

Frankly, they weren't even allowed to dream at all. As you may know, a woman's role in Greek society was to bear children and take care of the household. No voting rights, no rights to express her oppinion freely, not even any rights of property or even freedom to go as she pleases.

Even though things changed a bit during the Hellenistic Period (were we see Princesses and Queens having considerable power for the first time), women were generally much less free than they are today. No equality at all.

A woman was basically raised by her mother to be a good wife (cleaning, cooking etc.), then around the age of 16 (which was the normal age of marriage for a girl) she was married to a male from another family. The age of marriage for a man, was typically 30. So you see there is already a considerable time gap. Having a good-looking wife was simply a bonus at that time, as the only thing she was expected to do was to bear you healthy children. You were typically "allowed" to have multiple partners (the so-called "Pallakides" or even "Hetairai") apart from your wife. Having sex with your wife only, or loving her as I said above, was generally considered weird.

Maion

I think this is a gross oversimplification. Whilst officially true, I supsect the majoriety of couples at least developed affection for each other. Women who are unhappy and sexually unsatisfied are actually quite a bit harder to get pregnant; a fact which was recognised in the medieval period.

**Prussian to the Iron** · 06-15-2009, 03:23

keep in mind, OP (i'm tired and too lazy to read all but the first 2 posts), that back then, it was not so uncommon or tabooed for young girls to marry old guys who would need some sort of ancient viagra :P.

yeah, its creepy. just deny the requests........

**Maion Maroneios** · 06-15-2009, 08:44

Originally Posted by Philipvs Vallindervs Calicvla

I think this is a gross oversimplification. Whilst officially true, I supsect the majoriety of couples at least developed affection for each other. Women who are unhappy and sexually unsatisfied are actually quite a bit harder to get pregnant; a fact which was recognised in the medieval period.

Right... Have you every heard of the story of Alkibiades and his wife, Hipparete? Well, as the story goes, his wife was very upset of him having multiple mistresses and went to the court to apply for a divorce (yes, that at least could happen in Athenai). Alkibiades found out, and he went to the court and found her. Guess what he did to her? He grabbed her by the hair, and forced her home against her will, humiliating her and dragging her through the entire Agora in front of everyone who was there. Not only that, but the story was famous enough as to be considered in Ploutarchos' biography of Alkibiades 5 centuries later.

What does the above mean if you ask me? If there was any affection or was practised as widely as you say amongst most couples, this story wouldn't be so popular. Not popular at all. But I know this is an extreme example. Plus, there was probably some affection between couples. At least not enough to even be considered a couple by modern standards. As I said, the idea of having sex with your wife solely and being monogamous, was frowned upon in Ancient Greek society.

Maion