To destroy or not to destroy (unique buildings)

[Andy1984]

I too never destroy unique buildings. In my latest Pahlava campaign, I even spend the last hard-pillaged earned 6K to repair the gates at Babylon once I arrived there. Because I felt ashamed because the Arche allowed rioters to damage it, I spent the money I badly needed to train reinforcements on a building. One has to know his priorities in a time of dire financial struggles.

[Darth Stalin]

Destroy. And don't forget to dump all the salt on the ruins.

Yep. As the Romans I usually destroy all the unique buildings in Carthage herself - I want to RP my faction; however I usually tend to preserve other uniquities, as I like to see them - they are also a great piece of work done by the EB team, and I haven't known about many of them before playing EB...
Maybe the treasure lakes in Tolosa will be drained and plundered too...
Yet usually in Carthage I try to destroy everything - though it depends on the game I play, yet if I want to RP the Romans correctly, all must be destroyed to the ground, only to be build from scratch as the Roman colony. However, once I left the public utility buildings and also the Great Harbor - it gave me something like a nice bonus for my fleet...

[Reality=Chaos]

It kinda depends... i tend not to destroy unique buildings unless there is a very good reason for it.... Humbling Rhodos.... I might have to do something about those pesky KH myself... I'm playing as Epeiros... Makedonia had conquered Thermon and I was just about to do something about that, when my allies the KH betrayed me and besieged Demetrias (where Phyrros was residing at the time... In the ensueing Battle I beat the KH, and Killed their General.... Only was Killed by the treacherous cretins early on in the battle.... I might "just" enslave Sparta (it was a Spartan General, but the greeks will know my wrath

[Centurio Nixalsverdrus]

Since I am a cultured Hellen, I never destroy the unique buildings, except I deem it necessary.

• The Lakes of Tolosa: Few turns after I had conquered Tolosse, I drained the lakes since inside are the precious treasures that the smelly Keltoi had looted at Delphi.
• The Kolossos Rhodou: I destroyed it immediately since it is a sign of humiliation to Makedonia, having been built from Demetrios Poliorketes' siege works' sale proceeds.
• Left the Wonders of Rome alone! Oh Generosity! Oh Humanity! I must be a god.
• Left the Wonders of Karchedon alone! Oh Generosity! Oh Hu...
• After riots in Pselkis, the Temples of Philai, Edfu and Abu Simbel were damaged... payed generously 20,000 M to restore them. I believe the benefacting governor was "Devoted to the Gods of Upper Aigyptos."
• After the Hellenic Uprising of 219 - 217 BC, the Akropolis of Athenai was severely damaged. I left it standing damaged as a warning sign to future generations. Since in the Civil War the Athenaioi were loyal to their rightful Basileus Limendas, although all around them were not, I made Assandros, brother to the Basileus spend 20,000 M from the Royal Treasury to restore it as a sign of gratitude and reconciliation. It was the Makedonian governor though who decided on which side the city should be, not the Athenians, but anyway...

[satalexton]

Oh the generosity, kind Fatherland. All Hail Makedonia!!!

[A Terribly Harmful Name]

The historically accurate course is not to destroy any temples, since it would be sacrilege for a Classical religion to profane the local Gods. Later these get upgraded to temples of my culture.

Except, of course, if I'm not Hellenistic or Rome. In this case they go down rather quickly.

[Antinous]

I say leave buildings up unless they belong to the romanii.(long hard war with them as the KH)

[Alsatia]

.....

[teh1337tim]

i usually leave all of the wonders alone (except colosus... makedonians must destroy it...)


UNLESS they are related to the romani... those smelly barbaroi throwing pointy stuff at my phalangites will be crushed by my theurophia and hoplite! their smelly temples and city shall be made into ruins and SALT be put onto the ground!

[Alsatia]

So many roman haters.......

I saw a unique building in the city below Roma and it cannot be destroyed (or so it says to me).

[Maion Maroneios]

i usually leave all of the wonders alone (except colosus... makedonians must destroy it...)


UNLESS they are related to the romani... those smelly barbaroi throwing pointy stuff at my phalangites will be crushed by my theurophia and hoplite! their smelly temples and city shall be made into ruins and SALT be put onto the ground!

Well, well. If it isn't another Romaioktonos. Why don't you click on my signature link?

OT now, my Strategos Demetrios Argeades happened not to destroy a single building upon capturing Barbaropolis (aka Roma). For those of you that think we are all bad guys

Maion

[TruePraetorian]

Quite honestly it depends on what faction I am playing as and how I am roleplaying. Typically I leave unique structures alone, but if I am playing as a Gallic faction or such I destroy unique buildings where I see fit (such as Temple of Jupiter if I sack Roma).

But as a rule of thumb I usually leave everything alone in Greece and Makedonia, seeing as they need all the "sparkle" they can get

[Alsatia]

Greeks only reserve their admiration for Greece and Greece alone...

[Fierro]

How can I find out which unique buildings work with which factions?
In my current Saka campaign when short on cash I've been destroying a few of those unique buildings that give 2000 or 5000 mnai a pop and only provide a negligible 5% happiness bonus.

[Maion Maroneios]

If the description says the bonuses only apply to certain cultures (like Greek, Nomad, Roman etc.) then they are more or less useless to you and destroying it would not affect you in any way. Other buildings simply give bonuses to all factions, and that you can verify if there is no reference to any culture at all.

But of course if you are a true EB fan, you wouldn't destroy a single unique or wonderous building. Unless you're a RPer like many of us here.

Maion

[fleaza]

if im really annoyed with that faction i demolish their ass into oblivion. usually i leave them alone. i have NEVER demolished a unique greek building. greek culture is just too cool to defile.

[Andy1984]

When I'm annoyed with a faction, I prefer to give them a ridiculous death on the battlefield. Last time a vast majority of Lusotanni poured into my city, I reconquered the gates knowing that I would loose that way. (The AI can't escape if they control no gateway and no gates are broken, so they'll fight to the death.) Hundreds of ill-equiped peasants died in flaming oil. Out of their ca. 3500 soldiers, over 75% died, and rightly so.

There is no way I would retaliate towards a faction by destroying my unique building.

[Hegix]

I play as I wish the real ancients would have "played". Never ever destroy unique buildings, repair them if neccesary and roleplay taking good care of them. They are all part of the world's cultural heritage.

[Maion Maroneios]

That depends on which kind of "ancients" you played, I'm afraid. A Hellen, Roman or Iranian would probably respect a culture's "unique buildings" more. On the other hand, I doubt an "uncivilized" German or Celt would show the same respect and instead choose to loot or even completely destroy them.

Don't take me wrong here. We Greeks demolished the colums of our own Parthenon to get the Lead in them, which we in turn used to make bullets and fight against the Turks. I say this so that no idiot calls me a Hollywood-fan or that I say Germanics are the worst and Greeks the best.

Maion

[Hax]

Just destroyed the Aigai in Makedonia playing as Pontos. I left the Akropolis of Athenai alone, though!

[Rahwana]

Just destroy them all except with those trade bonus... unhapiness means my army will be withdrawn when red fac shown, and if those city rebels, they deserve enslavment (extermination). Nothing could stop my Gladius from drawing blood!

[Ludens]

That depends on which kind of "ancients" you played, I'm afraid. A Hellen, Roman or Iranian would probably respect a culture's "unique buildings" more. On the other hand, I doubt an "uncivilized" German or Celt would show the same respect and instead choose to loot or even completely destroy them.

When the Goths and Vandals sacked Rome, they were actually a good deal more careful then when the Romans took Carthage and Corinth. Although the two "sacks" of Rome had a devastating ideological impact, the actual damage done was small. The Vandals apparently only destroyed one building, while the Romans joined the Goths in hymns when the latter appropriated a few Christian Relics (yes, the Goths were converts at this time, and IIRC so where the Vandals). This seems unlikely to have occurred if the Goths were destroying everything in sight. The Vandals also took from the city a former empress and her daughter, at the ladies' request. This went into history as a "kidnap".

Similarly, the sack of Carthage by the Vandals was supposed to have put an end to the city, yet archaeology does not bear this out. The city was already decaying before the Vandals moved in, and would continue to exist until the seventh century. One contemporary Christian chronicler actually welcomed the Vandal take-over because they put an end to the debauchery in the city. Certainly, archaeologists found that the consumption of fortified wine and gourmet oysters declined sharply, so he probably was right.

Terry Jones (of the BBC series "Barbarians") uses this to argue that the Barbarians were far more humane than the Romans. This may or may not be the case, but it does show how much contemporary prejudice against barbarians skewed our view of history.

[Starforge]

And like it is said "History is written by the victor." (does anyone know the latin or greek term for it?)

Plato - Those who tell the stories rule society.

I'll let the greeks and kin here translate appropriately.

[Reality=Chaos]

That depends on which kind of "ancients" you played, I'm afraid. A Hellen, Roman or Iranian would probably respect a culture's "unique buildings" more. On the other hand, I doubt an "uncivilized" German or Celt would show the same respect and instead choose to loot or even completely destroy them.

Don't take me wrong here. We Greeks demolished the colums of our own Parthenon to get the Lead in them, which we in turn used to make bullets and fight against the Turks. I say this so that no idiot calls me a Hollywood-fan or that I say Germanics are the worst and Greeks the best.

Maion

He said he plays like he WISHED the ancients would have done it, not how it actually happens

[Darpaek]

When the Goths and Vandals sacked Rome, they were actually a good deal more careful then when the Romans took Carthage and Corinth.

"CAREFUL?!"

What did the Vandals do? They showed up in Africa and they "lived there." Maybe they destroyed a church or two and replaced it with an Arian one... but that's hardly care!

The Romans spent a years worth of time, manpower, and money devoted to the care of Carthage! Every single brick and stone in Carthage received attention from "careful" Roman hands! ;)

[Maion Maroneios]

@ Ludens:

I never said the "civilized" people didn't sack or enslave/loot cities and "unique buildings", or that when they did it was justified. Nor that the peoples I aforementioned (Germans, Celts) always sacked cities unthinkingly or with zero respect to another culture. I just see that, according to History, the aforementioned people practised looting and sacking in a much higher frequency than more "civilized" nations like the Romans, Greeks and Iranians.

Maion

[Andy1984]

Plato - Those who tell the stories rule society.

I'll let the greeks and kin here translate appropriately.

That is more or less the opposite of 'history is written by the victor', and - imo - a far more intelligent quote.

[Starforge]

That is more or less the opposite of 'history is written by the victor', and - imo - a far more intelligent quote.

I see what you're saying but it's one you can read either way depending upon how cynical you look at it. Perhaps it's more clear translated. My 4 years of unused German 30 years ago doesn't really help here :).

Web searches admittedly, but I found that as being attributed to the basis for the "history" quote which, while Winston Churchill said it, most figured it for a trueism and not attributeable to him.

[Cute Wolf]

Well, we shall start giving traits like "Oppressor" or "Cruel Governor" if a civilized general destroy a wonder... and this trait gives some hapiness penalties as well, so anyone will think a second time to destroy a wonder

[Ludens]

I just see that, according to History, the aforementioned people practised looting and sacking in a much higher frequency than more "civilized" nations like the Romans, Greeks and Iranians.

And who wrote that history? ;)

Seriously, my impression is that when it came to expert sacking, it was the Carthaginians and Romans who could write the book, not the Celts or the Germans. This was probably because the barbarians were very poor at siege warfare, so they had trouble taking walled towns in the first place, but according to Polybius the Romans took systematic plundering to a new level.