As a Carthaginian, Romans to weak in manpower and too passive

**A Very Super Market** · 09-11-2009, 06:12

Read your statement again. Consider the reason why the EB team does not have multiple Roman factions. If you mean to suggest having multiple copies of the same city, I implore you to read your statement with exceeding scrutiny.

**king of thracia** · 09-11-2009, 08:00

According to the in game graphs Rome is already provided plenty of money which they use to train the largest army in the world.

There is a win conditions mod which alters descr win conditions .txt and is useful for directing AI expansion priorities. BI and Alex.exe have naval invasions, although KH seemed to capture Helicarnassus more often under vanilla RTW in my experience; not sure if it is rebelling to them.

**Ca Putt** · 09-11-2009, 09:09

one could make the alps uncrossable, that would forse the romans to expand southwards

Helicarnassus rebels to KH, at least that's what happend everytime I played KH.

**ARCHIPPOS** · 09-11-2009, 10:57

hey Dunadd what difficulty are you playing??? If you fix campaign difficulty at Hard or Very Hard the AI is going to shell you with stacks ... the majority of these will be mercenaries but you'll get to fight some core Roman infantry too i guess

**fleaza** · 09-11-2009, 12:57

Originally Posted by A Very Super Market

Read your statement again. Consider the reason why the EB team does not have multiple Roman factions. If you mean to suggest having multiple copies of the same city, I implore you to read your statement with exceeding scrutiny.

to represent all factions fairly. yeah i dont know what i was thinking when i suggested that, but i still think that rome is just a bit too...errr pussy, to say the least, for my tastes. historical rome was a beast. they waged war constantly for centuries. they fought and won against massive odds. EB rome is a shadow of its real self.

**A Very Super Market** · 09-11-2009, 15:49

The EB Rome with the tendency to swallow up Gaul and Iberia within 50 years? (Whilst leaving Taras and Rhegion completely alone.)

**mlp071** · 09-11-2009, 16:18

Originally Posted by fleaza

to represent all factions fairly. yeah i dont know what i was thinking when i suggested that, but i still think that rome is just a bit too...errr pussy, to say the least, for my tastes. historical rome was a beast. they waged war constantly for centuries. they fought and won against massive odds. EB rome is a shadow of its real self.

Rome does always take Taras right away in my campaigns and most of the times Rhegion is next. And they expand into Gauls and Illirya, then into coastal Iberia rather fast. After that they are pain to deal with it, so i don't see that they are underpowered at all.Recruiting part is not that brilliant though, mostly mercenaries, triarii and PE.

There are some weird things that happen in rare occasions(i just posted another thread about that ), but if i play anyone in west , i end up dealing with them way before i would like to(early in campaign).

**Dunadd** · 09-11-2009, 18:58

Archippos wrote

hey Dunadd what difficulty are you playing??? If you fix campaign difficulty at Hard or Very Hard the AI is going to shell you with stacks ... the majority of these will be mercenaries but you'll get to fight some core Roman infantry too i guess

I've been playing on Very Hard. The Romans fight me when i'm in mainland Italy, but they never invade Sicily or Spain or North Africa by sea, which makes it pretty easy and predictable to fight them.

They did take Tarentum from the Epirotes, before i took it from them, but made no attempt on Corsica, Sardinia, Sicily or anywhere else overseas, even after they've had massive naval superiority for a decade (they have quadriremes and triremes, i only have pentekonters - and they have 4 or 5 times as many fleets as i do)

Could be due to playing on the Alexander engine, i'm not sure.

**mlp071** · 09-11-2009, 20:09

Originally Posted by Dunadd

Archippos wrote

I've been playing on Very Hard. The Romans fight me when i'm in mainland Italy, but they never invade Sicily or Spain or North Africa by sea, which makes it pretty easy and predictable to fight them.

They did take Tarentum from the Epirotes, before i took it from them, but made no attempt on Corsica, Sardinia, Sicily or anywhere else overseas, even after they've had massive naval superiority for a decade (they have quadriremes and triremes, i only have pentekonters - and they have 4 or 5 times as many fleets as i do)

Could be due to playing on the Alexander engine, i'm not sure.

You are going to see that very , very rarely with ALX.exe, not at all with RTW.exe. Only time you can be sure that they will do it (as well everyone else) is if you play with BI.exe. I did have QH and KH doing naval invasions of Italy with ALX, but never vice versa.

And even that is going to be ,most likely, small detachments , 1-5 units ,and not full fledged invasion. Best bet is , like someone mention to use move_character and move some stacks in Africa proper.

As for Sicily, take Messana and if that doesn't work, attack Rhegion(you don't have to take it). That usually gets their attention and they will turn south.

**Dunadd** · 09-11-2009, 23:15

The solution that worked in vanilla Rome Total War was to have more than one Roman faction, allied to each other, so the Southern faction went South, the Northern faction went North and the Eastern faction went East, as those were the only borders they had with the enemy and they all had different victory conditions.

I'd like to see something like that in EBII as currently in EB the Romans' behaviour is just not historical and they are not nearly militarily strong enough compared to the historical situation.

**antisocialmunky** · 09-12-2009, 01:02

Since the EB Team knows the names of the starting Roman FMs, they should auto-teleport them outside of Rhegion or Messana if they make aggressive moves North instead of South to more historically direct their aggression.

**mlp071** · 09-12-2009, 03:27

Originally Posted by Dunadd

The solution that worked in vanilla Rome Total War was to have more than one Roman faction, allied to each other, so the Southern faction went South, the Northern faction went North and the Eastern faction went East, as those were the only borders they had with the enemy and they all had different victory conditions.

I'd like to see something like that in EBII as currently in EB the Romans' behaviour is just not historical and they are not nearly militarily strong enough compared to the historical situation.

I believe that it will be much easier to recreate Romani behavior in M2TW. For one you don't have senate and 3 roman factions , that most likely have some hardcoded behavior in RTW(Romani in EB are original Seleucid faction , btw).

AFAIK, original RTW city of Rome is located on that tiny island of the Scandinavia, and that can explain factions desire to move Northwards first.Again, in my campaigns , Romani always got south, even in present QH campaign. Only problem that they have was not being able to conquer it in several dozen of tries.

Either way, EB is about all 16 factions and Romans are only one of them. Some mods are dedicated strictly to Rome (SPQR mod , RS) , but this one is not.From what i have read on these forums , they are proud of treating all the factions as equal.

So making EBII revolving around Rome is not something that they are interested , i believe.