No more alts?

[Aemilius Paulus]

Soooo, I see the mods are deliberating on the possibility of forbidding alternate accounts? Is this true? Two of my trash accounts were struck down. I do not mind it, but those accounts were my only way to PM mods when banned... I guess we will have a system closer to TWC now?

[pevergreen]

Well, I was under the impression the guild rules have always prohibited it.

[Sasaki Kojiro]

The have for a while at least.

[Hosakawa Tito]

Which alt accounts are you refering to ? Those that clone other members nicks or the ones used to pad polls & such ?

[Aemilius Paulus]

Which alt accounts are you refering to ? Those that clone other members nicks or the ones used to pad polls & such ?

Lol, yeah, I padded a few polls for the fun... Not that the polls were serious, I believe the were in the EB Forums. To put it in perspective, I see nearly every multiple-choice poll in .Org abused by a few recurring individuals... - something which I did not do.


The clone one was a tribute to Meth, never used. It began as my original account in .Org, named Publius Cornelius Scipio (Yeah, I know, boring and cliché as hell..) but I accidentally deleted the activation email, leaving my first account a helpless rag - "New Member" forever. So I created AP few days later.

Then, months later, I got Tosa to send another activation email. Yet more months passed, and seeing that account useless, as I already established myself as AP, I decided to do something with it - turn it into a tribute of Meth. I showed it to him, and then, well, nothing happened after that. Keep in mind this was long before a host of members spammed the forums with pever-clones. I, on the contrary, did not use the clone in such a way. I doubt he was ever used, save for two polls...


Quintus Fabius and AP-Clone were the accounts I created when I was banned by Tosa (AP-C) and Lemur (QF). I used the accounts to send them PMs, which straightened out the Tosa ban - a misunderstanding, and informed me of the anture of my ban (the Lemur ban was my first one here). Out of all these, Quintus Fabius was the one I used the most, which I used to chat in the EB Tavern when AP was banned.




Sheesh, Hosa, you make me sound like a e-criminal or something in that post ...




Anyway, I do not care about the alts, as all were nearly useless, and expendable, each with no more than 3 posts, but I was wondering if there was a policy against alt-accounts? Unless I am mistaken, alts have always been permitted in .Org, is it not so? Or do we now have TWC-style policy towards alt accounts, which is quite clear on this matter? You have not quite answered this question, Hosa...

[InsaneApache]

[Aemilius Paulus]

What, you have your own alts?

Meh, for precious alt accounts, I use a computer in some other place (library, friend's house) to register. And browse through proxies. That way, I am supposedly undetectable. Not that I actually go through this on .Org - no, for other sites.

For instance, I invited 12 alts to Dropbox to get the +3 gigs of uploading space. I registered all the accounts to twelve of my Uni library's computers and to 12 disposable e-mail addresses. But do not worry, the computers there save no data after I log off, not unless you stick it in a special personal folder .

I am so bad :P (I hope I do not seem like a monster to the mods )

[pevergreen]

Out of all these, Quintus Fabius was the one I used the most, which I used to chat in the EB Tavern when AP was banned.

I did read the rest of your post, but just simply pointing out that you circumvented your ban?



I can't find a rule against it anywhere. (searched FAQ in entrance hall and board FAQ, can't find a specific board rules area)

I just thought it was against the rules.

[Aemilius Paulus]

I did read the rest of your post, but just simply pointing out that you circumvented your ban?

Huh? Everyone I know does it... EB Tavern is full of fake accounts... My alts were not banned for that - mods knew about me and the alts for quite a long time already. There is another reason, and I do not know what it is. AFAIK, I thought all alts were banned...

Yeah, I am lost...

[pevergreen]

Yeah, i guess it all hinges on Tosa's ruling.

Of course, just because everyone does it...

[Csargo]

I have an alt account, though I don't use it anymore. Created it because I forgot my password at one point and was away from my home computer.

[Husar]

I don't have an alt account, the trick is not to get yourself banned. And when you get banned there's a reason for it and switching to another account means circumventing your ban which should not be allowed.

[Azathoth]

Kilroy was here.

[Aemilius Paulus]

means circumventing your ban which should not be allowed.

But it is, or at least tolerated... Is that why you italicised "should"?

In any case, it is hardly malicious circumvention, as I have used QF on two occasions for that, and only in the EB Tavern, and mostly to clear up why I was banned. I refrained from the forums. All other times, I have used alts to PM mods, as PM-ing is not allowed when banned.

Most of the time, though, I use bans to be more productive, which is why bans are as much a blessing as a curse. And lately I have been quite bored with the forums, not to mention leaving them for a week.



Once again, I am not complaining at all, but I am wondering on what the policy is, and the mods are oddly quiet about this, meaning they are most likely deciding on what to say (I believe it was Clegane who told me the mods were still deliberating on this matter).

[Mithrandir]

What about the tourists?

[Socrates on Wheels]

Noooo! What a disaster!

[caravel]

What about the tourists?

They're quite partial to the camel rides.

Noooo! What a disaster!

Tourists aren't that bad.

[Hooahguy]

I don't have an alt account, the trick is not to get yourself banned. And when you get banned there's a reason for it and switching to another account means circumventing your ban which should not be allowed.

agreed.
if you are banned, there was a reason to it. going around that ban with an alt is, IMO, quite disgusting.

[Azathoth]

agreed.
if you are banned, there was a reason to it. going around that ban with an alt is, IMO, quite disgusting.

So if someone created an elixir of resurrection, you would want it destroyed because if people die, there is a reason to it?

[Beefy187]

So if someone created an elixir of resurrection, you would want it destroyed because if people die, there is a reason to it?

I see where you coming from, but I would have to agree with pever, Husar and Hooah on this. Whats the point of punishment if your not going to get punished?

[Aemilius Paulus]

Lol, getting banned is a 'punishment'?? My, my, I feel sooo bad. An Internet forum blocks me from posting (but not reading) for two days. What a gruelling torture. What a tragedy.

Grow up people...

The only true punishment here is the symbolic meaning of a ban. The implication that a member has poor manners and judgement. Then there is the shame of being publicly castigated. I can find 101 ways to get around a ban if I wished, but that is not the point. Punishments have little to do with their physical nature, as long as the intent is carried out.

Anyways, that's some mighty interesting ideas people here have about punishment...



Take perma-bans for example: many banned individuals come back. Mods seem to only mind when the returned person causes more bedlam. Even if the mods did actively seek out those alts, registering on a different computer, under different e-mail should do it. Especially when the browsing is carried out from a different IP address (change yours/ cover it under a proxy). So, what is the point to perma-bans? Well, mainly the fact that the old account is gone, with all the friends, posts, seniority, background, etc. One can create a new account, but it will not be the same.

[Aemilius Paulus]

On the other hand, I should stop wasting my time on the forums... I suppose I will stick to the EB Tavern.

[Husar]

Lol, getting banned is a 'punishment'?? My, my, I feel sooo bad. An Internet forum blocks me from posting (but not reading) for two days. What a gruelling torture. What a tragedy.

Grow up people...

Well, I haven't been banned yet, who's the one who needs to grow up now?
A real man accepts his punishment and waits it out, only kids try to get around it somehow to do what they want.
Besides, if you don't care about it, why did you create alt accounts to circumvent it?

I can find 101 ways to get around a ban if I wished, but that is not the point.

I'd like to get the list.

[Sevis]

For instance, I invited 12 alts to Dropbox to get the +3 gigs of uploading space. I registered all the accounts to twelve of my Uni library's computers and to 12 disposable e-mail addresses. But do not worry, the computers there save no data after I log off, not unless you stick it in a special personal folder.

Even if the mods did actively seek out those alts, registering on a different computer, under different e-mail should do it. Especially when the browsing is carried out from a different IP address (change yours/ cover it under a proxy).

You seem to rather misunderstand the technical side of it. What computer you register on is of no importance - you could have registered them all from the same uni computer. Similarly, the computers could keep verbose logs of all hat was happening, and Dropbox staff would know no more than they do now.
Where you register your account is another thing that is rarely kept - however, all browsing would have to be done from a new IP, if you wanted to pretend you are a new user. This could cause several problems (especially for 56kers, whom this forum seems very friendly to - not surprising once you see the name), as not everyone can switch or keep IP at will.

On the matter itself, a ban is a ban and I don't see why evading them should be allowed. An old user who has since that time matured, and wants to start from a clean slate is fine, seeing as he may truly act quite different, but a short-term ban has, imho, far more effect on behaviour when it is enforced.

[Beefy187]

The point of banning is to prevent you from breaking rules any further, and in the case of temp banned it can also give you chance to think about the wrong action you took and telling your self that you'll never make the same mistake again.

Now going around that means, you don't think your infraction or punishment was the right call thus spitting on the face of the moderators, and spitting on the Org rules.

Only decent reason of creating a alt account I can think of is to anonymously seek advice on private matters... and if the matter is that private and important, it should be better to ask a professional.

So basically, I don't see any decent reason to have a alt account. Its also bad because someone may want to use your alts user name.

[Mithrandir]

What it comes down to is this:

We want the Org to be a friendly, positive, constructive online forum.
If people disrupt this flow, we give them several, lots of actually, lots of chances to improve their behaviour to fit in with what this place is supposed to be. If the individual choses not to fit in, this is not a place for them. To encourage people to either fit in or just leave seeing how this is not their place, we've got limited resources at our disposal.

We hope people pick up our subtle and not so subtle hints...


All of this to improve this forum and keep it fun for the majority of members who signed up, just for that purpose, because this is a friendly, constructive forum.

So, please stop being so childish, fighting everything, the big bad moderators, the rules, the police, the world. Grow up for christs sake and leave if you feel you need a place which does like your little tricks.

bye bye.

[Aemilius Paulus]

You seem to rather misunderstand the technical side of it. What computer you register on is of no importance - you could have registered them all from the same uni computer. Similarly, the computers could keep verbose logs of all hat was happening, and Dropbox staff would know no more than they do now.

Eh? Is it me, or does it seem like you are the one who misunderstood somethign here? Hehe, try it yourself if you do not believe me. Dropbox checks from which computer you register. Oh yes. By register, I mean make a Dropbox account, download the Dropbox software and link your computer to it. Dropbox keeps track of computers added to it.

But just for s and giggles, I tried registering from the same computer. Guess what happened. It said my registration was invalid and not eligible for the referral bonus, as it was done from the same computer. Whether you use a proxy or not makes no difference.The Dropbox team is not stupid - they knew people would take advantage of their system in a negative manner. So they created the safeguard.

Where you register your account is another thing that is rarely kept - however, all browsing would have to be done from a new IP, if you wanted to pretend you are a new user. This could cause several problems (especially for 56kers, whom this forum seems very friendly to - not surprising once you see the name), as not everyone can switch or keep IP at will.

Well yeah, that is for .Org. But I never tried creating foolproof alts in here, as I saw no reason for it.

So, please stop being so childish, fighting everything, the big bad moderators, the rules, the police, the world. Grow up for christs sake and leave if you feel you need a place which does like your little tricks.

Wait, you are not addressing me, are you? Fighting everything ? LOL

[Andres]

Soooo, I see the mods are deliberating on the possibility of forbidding alternate accounts? Is this true? Two of my trash accounts were struck down. I do not mind it, but those accounts were my only way to PM mods when banned... I guess we will have a system closer to TWC now?

Having an alt account in itself is not a big deal.

It's when alt accounts are being used to stir up trouble, mess with polls, circumvent bans, impersonate other members, etc. that it becomes a problem.

There are the rules, but there is also the spirit of the rules and things like common sense, respect, etiquette, good manners, decency, etc.

You can do the rule lawyering thingy as much as you want, but when the boundaries of what is reasonable have been crossed, then the boundaries of what is reasonable have been crossed.

I strongly suggest your behaviour starts to improve in the very near future; very near as in right now.

I would also suggest you stop talking about the art of making undetectable alt accounts to avoid sanctions issued for rule violations, as it basically comes down to the art of being immature and not being able to take responsability for one's actions.

Thanks in advance for your understanding and consideration.

[Sevis]

Eh? Is it me, or does it seem like you are the one who misunderstood somethign here? Hehe, try it yourself if you do not believe me. Dropbox checks from which computer you register. Oh yes. By register, I mean make a Dropbox account, download the Dropbox software and link your computer to it. Dropbox keeps track of computers added to it.

But just for s and giggles, I tried registering from the same computer. Guess what happened. It said my registration was invalid and not eligible for the referral bonus, as it was done from the same computer. Whether you use a proxy or not makes no difference.The Dropbox team is not stupid - they knew people would take advantage of their system in a negative manner. So they created the safeguard.

First time I've heard of Dropbox, let me see... Ah, it's a service, which does indeed explain it. My apologies - what I said about not storing local files being irrelevant is false. Just out of curiosity - is the registration through a webform or a client?

EDIT: Reread your post. The Dropbox team cannot directly control the computers it is being installed on, except through hardware monitoring at install-time. More likely is that the service or installer monitor if it has already been installed (not hard to do). Thus your point about the computers not saving any information stands, but is irrelevant in the case of a forum (unless it uses highly intrusive cookies).

[Beskar]

Lol, getting banned is a 'punishment'?? My, my, I feel sooo bad. An Internet forum blocks me from posting (but not reading) for two days. What a gruelling torture. What a tragedy.

Grow up people...

The only true punishment here is the symbolic meaning of a ban. The implication that a member has poor manners and judgement. Then there is the shame of being publicly castigated. I can find 101 ways to get around a ban if I wished, but that is not the point. Punishments have little to do with their physical nature, as long as the intent is carried out.

Anyways, that's some mighty interesting ideas people here have about punishment...

The irony of this post wasn't lost on me.