No mod tools?

[Fisherking]

It would appear that CA does not plan on releasing any mod tools, at least per the interview in the link below.

http://au.gamespot.com/pc/strategy/n...leon-total-war

While parts of the game have been moded there are parts that no one has successfully managed to modify. The map & AI behavior come to mind.

The conjecture is that with DLC the less moding the better, but the DLC has been mostly units, which the Moders have managed quite well. Only Warpath has contained map mods.

We know that there are more units coming.

I don't know if this will spur on moders to explore the mapping data base and develop their own tools or if it will frustrate them but I don't think that the lack of tools means that CA does not want the moders fooling with the game.

I am more inclined to think that it is just a matter of resource management and mod tools don't generate any direct income.

I am sure however that some of you can convince me that it is a conspiracy of vast proportions and that we should all give up gaming all together.

What do you think?

[Durallan]

Its very hard to say. Dragon Age has come with DLC, yet they have also released the largest set of modding tools I've ever seen, so obviously bioware has managed to convince EA that they won't lose any money over mods with a toolset alongside their DLC's, and this is true in Fallout 3's case. I bought the DLC's because they were great addons, yet I also used alot of mods, Considering DLC's generate extra income ONTOP of the original game release, I would find it very hard to believe releasing a modding toolset would decrease profits, especially ontop of DLC's because people will buy them. I would say that CA are actually shooting themselves in the foot by not releasing a toolset because MODS not DLC's extend a games shelf life. DLC's can do a bit, but mods are the only way to do it in a big way.

Having now watched the interview, I still say CA are shooting themselves in the foot, but, it will be up to history to be the judge I suppose!

[antisocialmunky]

Well, this isn't the first time they've gone back on their word.

[Crazed Rabbit]

I am more inclined to think that it is just a matter of resource management and mod tools don't generate any direct income.

I am sure however that some of you can convince me that it is a conspiracy of vast proportions and that we should all give up gaming all together.

What do you think?

Bah, they aren't thinking. Mods made RTW playable, and the ability to make mods broadens the appeal of a game.

I don't mind companies being focused on profit - it's when they do so stupidly and the executives can't see how mod tools could indirectly increase sales that peeves me.

CR

[Furunculus]

i will never buy DLC.

i will buy an expansion disk.

if i think that CA scuppered mod tools to sell more DLC i would stop buying CA games full stop.

MTW is the best game i have ever played, and was ten times better because of the mods.
i have three copies.

if they want to kill that kind of devotion then they know exactly how to do it.

[Zenicetus]

This is just a guess, but I think it may be a combination of things that killed the idea of a full set of modding tools for ETW. First, there was the shaky, too-early product release that tied up the programmers fixing bugs, instead of focusing on optional goodies like modding tools. With Napoleon so close on the horizon, they may have just run out of time for anything else (other than some reskinned DLC units, which don't involve programming). Both Dragon Age and Fallout 3 were fairly solid games on release day, and presumably the programmers had more time to spend on modding tools.

Another factor is the timing of sequels, which goes to the heart of why game companies release modding tools at all, I think. The developers of Dragon Age and Fallout 3 didn't have another full game like Napoleon:TW in the pipeline. Whatever will follow those as full games is years away (although Dragon Age is still about to start the DLC cycle). Both Bioware and Bethesda had a strong incentive to keep the user base interested in the current franchise for as long as possible, until their replacement full games arrive some time in the future.

With Napoleon coming out so soon, CA doesn't have the same incentive to keep interest alive in ETW. They want you to be buying NTW and talking about that. Every game company always focuses on its latest release, not its earlier ones that have already gone through most of the retail cycle.

So, I think if we're going to place blame for the lack of ETW modding tools, a lot of it has to fall on CA's decision to rush out a reworked version of ETW as a full game with Napoleon, instead of going the conventional route of DLC's or expansions, and stretching out the core franchise.

[Alexander the Pretty Good]

For those interested in minimizing the amount of time they waste on Gamespot, the CA interview starts around 9:00 minutes.

Frankly if we have to choose between polish and mods, and given how well polish has worked so far, why don't they just give us some tools.

[Furunculus]

i will accept the above IF they show that they give a damn and actually pledge that they will release tools for napoleon.........................


i'm waiting.

[Monk]

It would appear that CA does not plan on releasing any mod tools, at least per the interview in the link below.

...

What do you think?

Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 

With Napoleon coming out so soon, CA doesn't have the same incentive to keep interest alive in ETW. They want you to be buying NTW and talking about that. Every game company always focuses on its latest release, not its earlier ones that have already gone through most of the retail cycle.

So, I think if we're going to place blame for the lack of ETW modding tools, a lot of it has to fall on CA's decision to rush out a reworked version of ETW as a full game with Napoleon, instead of going the conventional route of DLC's or expansions, and stretching out the core franchise.

You may have a point. If this was the case, however, they shouldn't have gotten the community's hopes up.

[Owen Glyndwr]

pu-leeze. I'd take modding tools over their "polish" (If that's really what you want to call 1.0 ETW) any day.

[Fisherking]

To me it sounded as though NTW was planed as the expansion from what was said.

I think it is correct that they ran into so much with all the fixing that they never got to the tools...

Of course there didn't seem to be that much enthusiasm from CA over mod tools to start with. They just thought that it was going to happen.

It is just my impression but I think they actually expected more from the community, tools or no tools, even though it may seem the game engine was made to discourage moding...

At the moment I don't think they have the time and manpower to do the tools.

The PR guys are just going to put the best light on a harsh reality.

It was only a month or so ago that the official site had the poll on the most desired mod tool but obviously no one has the time...

[Mr Frost]

... however, they shouldn't have gotten the community's hopes up.

There are even laws against it {when selling products} in more than one country , but corporations generally get a "free pass" these days .






They're misleading about not haveing the time/resources for any tools though :


They could easily have managed to give us a file map and descriptions of what each columb in each file we can alter did for example . They couldn't have made the game if they didn't know and could have put it in a bloody text file even .

They could easily have given us tools similar to what the community has already created given they already know exactly how their own frikking code works .

I do not for an instant believe it would have taken them unreasonable nor excessive effort to manage a tool or file access {with instructions} to alter the basics of the starting possitions {unit placements , troop numbers per units , agents etc} .

We have yet to see even that much . "Most moddable of all T.W. games" my arse !

[cromwell]

I may be mistaken since I haven't launched ETW since I bought it, however I believe Activision is involved with ETW. Do a search on the CEO for Activision and tell me if he sounds like he is friendly to gaming? I mean it's great to be profitable, but this guy is a total !!

Activision will not release anything for free that could possibly interfere with any profitability. You will have to pay for everything, maps, content....... whatever they can monetize he will. I believe he said if it were up to him games would cost over $100, plus whatever else he could tak on later. I'm going to "try" and not buy anything activision sells. He really pisses you off when you listen to him.

The days when gamers ran gaming companies are long gone, now you have business men who could give a rats ass about modding tools and the like. "Pay them to do what and give it away for free...hahahah" quote from board room meeting when looking over billable hours.


Read why MW2 doesn't have dedicated servers and you will see the greed I'm talking about. Activision wasn't going to let another company make money by offering a service, with their game, so they removed the ability..simple as that.


I bet anything that CA thought it would be business as usual, when mentioning the modding tools and such, then got the memo from corporate, and got their knuckles rapped!


Later, hope all is well in TW land

FearofCromwell

[antisocialmunky]

Its SEGA.

[cromwell]

My argument still stands. So what if it's Sega, you think now that DLC is acceptable they are not on the bandwagon?

I never heard of the term DLC two years ago, now we accept it, and pay for it. I know I know, we called it expansions, but a once a year expansion with a ton of changes is a little more acceptable. Paying for maps/ and a couple of units isn't! Remove modding and it's a new revenue stream.

Later,

[Fisherking]

From the cycle that CA found them selves in, due to the problems with ETW, they didn’t issue the mod tools.

That was further complicated by the decision to make NTW into a standalone game rather than an expansion.

They have actually done some work with Darth, aiding him and showing him how to mod some of the files that no one has been able to figure out to this point.

I think I even read something on them now having someone dedicated to mod tools at this time.

I am sure we will get something. Sega is not EA and CA usually lives up to their promises, however long it takes.

[antisocialmunky]

You know its weird that as of right now Activision has surpassed EA is lameness while EA has actually started to not be total money grubbing monkeys. Times they are a changin.

[TheJian]

From the cycle that CA found them selves in, due to the problems with ETW, they didn’t issue the mod tools.

That was further complicated by the decision to make NTW into a standalone game rather than an expansion.

They have actually done some work with Darth, aiding him and showing him how to mod some of the files that no one has been able to figure out to this point.

I think I even read something on them now having someone dedicated to mod tools at this time.

I am sure we will get something. Sega is not EA and CA usually lives up to their promises, however long it takes.

This is why CA had to say what really went down, people read to much into things.

[Beskar]

You know its weird that as of right now Activision has surpassed EA is lameness while EA has actually started to not be total money grubbing monkeys. Times they are a changin.

Unless it was the Red Alert 3 Steam deal. Everyone who bought a legal copy of the game has had their serial invalid.

[caravel]

Still no modding tools then? Hardly surprising.

[Marten]

I guess, CA will never ever release any tools for E:TW nor N:TW. They will ride the horse of franchise to death and will change in 2 or 3 years to strategic browser games.

In about 10 or 15 years (when the world is still there, 2012... you know?), someone will remember on some outstanding games with turn-based strategic part and great real-time battles. Like i do sometimes ... (Shogun in E:TW graphics would be great! And i would like to have small hexes on the strategic map, just for the "old times")

Believe me or not, sometimes i play "Conquest of the new World" in Dos-Box. Great game!

[Slaists]

I concur with the patrons of this forum who feel CA is shooting itself in the foot by not supporting the modding community. 6 months ago I re-purchased Rome Total War just because I found out about Europa Barbarorum. Soon after I repurchased Alexander expansion because I found out the Europa Babarorum plays even better with the Alexander.exe. And, I believe, I am not the only one who has done similar re-purchases years after the original release of the game just because a certain mod seemed exciting.

CA is losing out with the current approach.

[Mr Frost]

Indeed . Greed is a most foolish creature that often costs itself greater profit down the track . Enlightened self interest cringes when it witnesses the choices and actions of its' demented cousin .

[antisocialmunky]

I do question the option of not doing more to support MP or Mods. You should have one or the other for any shelf life.