English words that conflict with your language.

[Philippus Flavius Homovallumus]

Gift is probably Dutch, since in Dutch the meaning of “gift” depends on context. ‘Gift’ as poison in Dutch is more typically referred to as “vergif” or in older texts “vergift”, with gift as “gift” meaning a gift being the preferred use.

Old English, actually; very close to Old Dutch. When the two ceased to be mutually intelligable is debated.

Though, it is theoretically possible to strip out exteneous Romance words and Grammar, put on a Newcastle Dialect and then be understood by a Norwegian.

[Fragony]

Let me show you a fun one, also in the wisdom teeth thread.

wisdom teeth has to come from dutch, we say 'verstandskies' which would translate to wisdom teeth, but the proper name for these baby's is 'verre stand kies' which refers to it's position in the mouth, they are positioned far in the mouth thus 'verre stand'.

TA If you are looking for some truly hilarious dutch screw-ups buy 'I thank you from the bottom of my heart, and also my wives bottom'. Recommended to all flemish for obvious reasons. Most dutch aren't all that good in English, my favorite has to be a college professor telling a foreign student he was trying to lead them around the garden, got him a sausage 'worst teacher award' (worst is dutch for sausage)

[ajaxfetish]

Those who are considered 'expert' speakers of English tend to achieve that perception based on the words they use, not how they arrange them.

I think this is a good point. Pretty much every native speaker (except those with language disabilities) is going to arrange their words correctly. With the exception of a few prescriptive rules (unnecessary, as you pointed out), the most noticeable difference is likely to be word choice. With English's extensive borrowing from other languages, and its highly productive derivational system, we've got an awfully large set of words to choose from. Mastering the nuances of each term and reliably recalling the best word for each situation takes both talent and work.

Ajax

edit:

Even with improper grammar usage, it is very easy to understand what someone is saying.

This, on the other hand, I can't really agree with. If we take all the words in your post and arrange them without proper grammar usage, the result is incomprehensible, at least to me. I even kept each word in the same sentence to make it easier, but while I might get a vague idea of the topic from some of the words used, I wouldn't have a clue what was being said about it.

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Vocabulary differences aware depth English main far I is of the one as of am the the as. Times 6 as I indicating French German English approximately and 3 have approximately words seen many statistics has times many that as words as as. A to be to most or in more other languages combined words tend explain concept specific together nuanced. Have concepts this can in English specific their most easily also done be of seem word these while very as own to well. Separates experience English experienced speaker inexperienced in my grammar depth but what the vocabulary speaker from so much the an and is not of the. Considered to based words on 'expert' English achieve perception how those speakers of tend who use not arrange they the are that they them.

[Tellos Athenaios]

Why do I think of Scandinavia when I read that garbled post??

(Or more precisely: why does the cadence of the garbled post make me think of Scandinavian languages?)

[Viking]

Why do I think of Scandinavia when I read that garbled post??

(Or more precisely: why does the cadence of the garbled post make me think of Scandinavian languages?)

I can't think of any reason..

[Fragony]

Why do I think of Scandinavia when I read that garbled post??

Same reason I do, think of Scandinavian women all the time.

[TinCow]

This, on the other hand, I can't really agree with. If we take all the words in your post and arrange them without proper grammar usage, the result is incomprehensible, at least to me. I even kept each word in the same sentence to make it easier, but while I might get a vague idea of the topic from some of the words used, I wouldn't have a clue what was being said about it.

LOL, you've got me there. Clearly there are some levels of grammatical butchery which make English essentially incomprehensible. What I was imagining were the numerous grammatical errors which are common in people who are still in the early phases of learning or who have otherwise not learned the language properly. It seems like it would be almost impossible to know enough English words to actually use the proper ones, yet know so little of the structure that you speak gibberish. The paragraph you altered seems like something that would only be encountered in someone who had suffered damage to the language section of the brain, not something that would ever be encountered in an otherwise normal person.

That said, I don't have a lot of experience to base any of this on. One of my friends teaches adult literacy, and he's told me about some amazing difficulties that his students encounter which are almost inconceivable for those of us who learned to read when we were young.

[ajaxfetish]

The paragraph you altered seems like something that would only be encountered in someone who had suffered damage to the language section of the brain, not something that would ever be encountered in an otherwise normal person.

Very true. You're really only ever going to run into that kind of serious grammatical deficiency in people who never learned a first language (deaf people not exposed to signing until teenagers or later, abused children isolated until the same age), people who've suffered strokes or otherwise damaged the language-related parts of the brain, and people with (probably heritable) language impairments.

What I was imagining were the numerous grammatical errors which are common in people who are still in the early phases of learning or who have otherwise not learned the language properly.

I know what you mean here, but I'd argue that those aren't errors, but features of non-standard dialects/ideolects. When it comes to language, the early phases of learning are 1.5 to 2.5 years. By 3 years old, the grammar is pretty much known. Rules that have to be drilled later are not a part of the language itself, but artificial add-ons. Of course, that doesn't mean it's not important to observe them in certain social settings, because a lot of how we judge people depends on whether they've learned those little add-ons.

Ajax

[Louis VI the Fat]

TA If you are looking for some truly hilarious dutch screw-ups buy 'I thank you from the bottom of my heart, and also my wives bottom'.

This calls for the classic:

Then again, from what we've learned of ski-instructors, for all we know it isn't a mistaken translation.



Marie qui se masse, all the world!

[Subotan]

It all dose make it more difficult for English speakers to master other languages, at least I think so.

It's a cultural thing rather than an actual language thing. We seem to take genuine pride in what is actually a national embarrassment; namely, our amazingly poor language skills.

My struggles with German are legion

Der den dem des
Die die der der
Das das dem des
Die die denr der

I won’t even mention Bavarian...

"Habèderè, i bî da Pèda und kimm vo Minga"

Try to learn Irish or as some would say Gaelic...

It's impossible and pointless. The word order is way more screwed up than in German. Although it is funny having to explain to Germans that Welsh is no mere dialect of English, and then having to show them some Welsh to prove it.

[Philippus Flavius Homovallumus]

It's a cultural thing rather than an actual language thing. We seem to take genuine pride in what is actually a national embarrassment; namely, our amazingly poor language skills.

This is true, but with 6-10 times the vocabulary as other languages, and the need to master complex syntax in order to have the flexability of an inflected language. So, a native speaker probably uses more brain-space for his first language if that language is English.

It's impossible and pointless. The word order is way more screwed up than in German. Although it is funny having to explain to Germans that Welsh is no mere dialect of English, and then having to show them some Welsh to prove it.

I understand Welsh sounds like a Scandanavian Language to Germans, apparently.

[Centurio Nixalsverdrus]

It's a cultural thing rather than an actual language thing. We seem to take genuine pride in what is actually a national embarrassment; namely, our amazingly poor language skills.



Der den dem des
Die die der der
Das das dem des
Die die denr der



"Habèderè, i bî da Pèda und kimm vo Minga"



It's impossible and pointless. The word order is way more screwed up than in German. Although it is funny having to explain to Germans that Welsh is no mere dialect of English, and then having to show them some Welsh to prove it.

Where are you from? Because I always thought you were Bavarian...

[Fragony]

This calls for the classic:

Then again, from what we've learned of ski-instructors, for all we know it isn't a mistaken translation.



Marie qui se masse, all the world!

The best is found in a bathroom in Thailand 'to avoid drip turn cock', can't find pic sadly

A recent classic, Oogheelkunde naturally means Eyehealing

[Subotan]

This is true, but with 6-10 times the vocabulary as other languages, and the need to master complex syntax in order to have the flexability of an inflected language. So, a native speaker probably uses more brain-space for his first language if that language is English.

What is "brain-space"? And besides, those could easily be turned on their head, as by already having this huge vocabulary, we don't need to memorize whole sets of foreign synonyms.

I understand Welsh sounds like a Scandanavian Language to Germans, apparently.

Haha, that's actually funny. When I showed my exchange partner Welsh, she was visibly shaken.

Where are you from? Because I always thought you were Bavarian...

I wish. I'm from Lancashire.

[Kadagar_AV]

Louis,

Then again, from what we've learned of ski-instructors, for all we know it isn't a mistaken translation.

I'd say the chance is 50/50


Centurio Nixalsverdrus,

Habèderè, i bî da Pèda und kimm vo Minga

I have spent way to much time among hillbilly germans... I actually have no problem understanding that...




One word that always irritated me is smell. For me it feels very unnatural to use the same word for something that can go both ways, smells good, smells bad. I know you can specify it, however, most English people don't.

[Philippus Flavius Homovallumus]

One word that always irritated me is smell. For me it feels very unnatural to use the same word for something that can go both ways, smells good, smells bad. I know you can specify it, however, most English people don't.

It's exactly the same for a sight or sound though, isn't it?

[Kadagar_AV]

It's exactly the same for a sight or sound though, isn't it?

sound yes, but not sight... Guess it is because sounds and smells can be pleasing or not, while sights rarely actually affect you much physicly.

*except for women*

[InsaneApache]

One word in English that sounds ridiculous, to me at least, is spoon. Just keep saying it over and over again out loud.

....and no, I'm not drunk.

[Philippus Flavius Homovallumus]

sound yes, but not sight... Guess it is because sounds and smells can be pleasing or not, while sights rarely actually affect you much physicly.

*except for women*

You're wrong, "that's a sight" can be negative or positive, just like a smell or sound; it needs to be qualified in exactly the same way, "That's a horrible sight" or "that's a fine sight".

See.

[Kadagar_AV]

You're wrong, "that's a sight" can be negative or positive, just like a smell or sound; it needs to be qualified in exactly the same way, "That's a horrible sight" or "that's a fine sight".

See.

I think I didn't explain well enough. Yes, a sight can of course also be "good" or "bad".

However, sights dont have the same physical impact as smells and noises.

A sight you usually need to explain more vividly than a smell. If something smells bad, it's enough to say that it smells bad and people will get your point.

Bad smell - physicly affects your nose...
Bad noise - physicly affects your ears...

But a sight? It isnt hurting the eyes. Thus you need to be more elaborate when you describe it...

I guess that is the reason why we lack a word for "bad" sight, while we have it for smells and noise.

[Philippus Flavius Homovallumus]

I think I didn't explain well enough. Yes, a sight can of course also be "good" or "bad".

However, sights dont have the same physical impact as smells and noises.

A sight you usually need to explain more vividly than a smell. If something smells bad, it's enough to say that it smells bad and people will get your point.

Bad smell - physicly affects your nose...
Bad noise - physicly affects your ears...

But a sight? It isnt hurting the eyes. Thus you need to be more elaborate when you describe it...

I guess that is the reason why we lack a word for "bad" sight, while we have it for smells and noise.

Ah, I see. Well we have "stink" and "stench" there, a "smell" is just a verbal noun.

[Ironside]

Why do I think of Scandinavia when I read that garbled post??

(Or more precisely: why does the cadence of the garbled post make me think of Scandinavian languages?)

Most likely is that it reminds you of the parodied versions they have in English speaking media.

The only thing I can think of is that scandinavian grammar is often the same as the English one, but using constant direct translations would occationally give sentences with odd grammar.

[Kralizec]

One mistake in English I often seem to make is forgetting the extra O in, for example, "too large". Or misspelling a word in English because the same word exists in Dutch but with a slightly different spelling, like succes(s). Kind of embarrassing. When I found out that mafia is spelled with only one "f" in English, it killed me

As for grammar, I probably wouldn't be able to explain basic grammar rules in either English or Dutch even if my life depended on it. Generally speaking, I instinctively apply them the right way...or not.

Let me show you a fun one, also in the wisdom teeth thread.

wisdom teeth has to come from dutch, we say 'verstandskies' which would translate to wisdom teeth, but the proper name for these baby's is 'verre stand kies' which refers to it's position in the mouth, they are positioned far in the mouth thus 'verre stand'.

TA If you are looking for some truly hilarious dutch screw-ups buy 'I thank you from the bottom of my heart, and also my wives bottom'. Recommended to all flemish for obvious reasons. Most dutch aren't all that good in English, my favorite has to be a college professor telling a foreign student he was trying to lead them around the garden, got him a sausage 'worst teacher award' (worst is dutch for sausage)

Teh wiki disagrees with you...

[miotas]

One word that always irritated me is smell. For me it feels very unnatural to use the same word for something that can go both ways, smells good, smells bad. I know you can specify it, however, most English people don't.

If it's unspecified then it always means it's a bad smell. If some just says "that smells" then they always mean "that smells bad".