Calling out the mods.

[Beskar]

The way I see it, some of the EB Taverners will stay and contribute to the Org, which is great. A few may decide that if they can't have their private place to post pictures of kittens being burned to death, they need to move on. That's fine too. The internet is big, and nobody needs to feel locked down.

I don't think I seen a lolcat picture like that before.

[pevergreen]

you knew I just re-read what i posted and am not really impressed with myself.

I have no reason to disbelieve Lemur, or Ser (below)

[Megas Methuselah]

A cat being burned to death? You've got a wild imagination, old man.

[Ser Clegane]

A cat being burned to death? You've got a wild imagination, old man.

Not really.

[Beefy187]

As far as I can see, Tosa granted EB tavern to start over again as long as they keep it clean this time.. What more do you want?

[A Very Super Market]

I feel as if we're biding our time until we can roast the three loonies.

Speaking of roasts, I'm pretty sure those kitten images were accompanied with captions of mourning, not glee. But that's all ancient history now.

Now, how do I articulate my thoughts on all this....

I must admit, we in the tavern almost perpetually toe the line between irreverency and irresponsibility. Thankfully, this goes on without harming the sanity of most outsiders, merely cultivating the existing mental illness running around in our own heads. I can't exactly apologize for anyone's conduct, as I lack the humility or awareness of the situation. What I can say is that the tavern isn't a wannabe /b/ (Wanna/b/?) out to create trouble. We're simply too lazy to do so. How people can tie those two together is beyond me. The reasons for deletion (Presumably, the sheer volume of profanity), and the reasons for the bans (Obstinance and random defiancy) are entirely separate.

As with any official-sounding statement, this is not directed t'wards anyone in particular, bla, blarh. Maybe I'm just thin-skinned enough to truly care about a misdirected opinion, but I've done my best to keep this post Sunday-School quality. Retreating back to the booze now.

[Socrates on Wheels]

I feel a need to post now, regardless of my ban. Not in order to cause trouble, but just to get my viewpoint across (And send in orders for 30YW)

If you want someone to be pissed at, it was Az and Subotan (And probably AP) that took it outside the bloody group.

If I am responsible for it being banned/destroyed, I’m sorry. I’m guessing the main reason is that I was toeing the line just generally, because I figured that the mods were OK with a little bit of harmless banter now and then (Turns out they aren’t, for some reason), and because of that post I made in the Watchtower which apparently managed to convince everyone of the opposite of what I was trying to get across. I apologise, and I’ll be more careful in the future.

If they wouldn't have posted their stupid links we might have gotten away with it. But drawing attention was stupid and something like that was bound to happen.

What stupid link did I post? Bittorrent? Considering someone was asking for advice about how to get free music over the internet, that was going to come up eventually, regardless of the forum you would have been on. If I hadn't posted it, someone else would have.

Well, you are still welcome to have a group, but I guess the craziness was a bit too crazy.

OK, fine. If people think that that was a problem, then we’ll take that on board. Me and I’m guessing the others arenot too stubborn, or too proud to take valid criticism. However, going along and saying “It was better to just burn the whole thing to ground, as it was too entrenched to edit everything” is going to annoy the people who frequent there regularly. The whole process of dealing with us has swung in a few days from not dealing with it at all to ham-fisted censorship.

Piracy/pr0n are verboten.

We totally understand that, especially the latter. A few months ago, someone did post pr0n in the EB Tavern, which was dealt with, by Appo.

So, think way back when all y'all were removed from TWC

Never happened to me. I never had an account at TWC.

A few may decide that if they can't have their private place to post pictures of kittens being burned to death

This particularly struck me. Yes, I have seen that particular sequence of pictures, but not at this forum, and the place where I did see it I go to very infrequently. And I thought it was horrific, and I would have complained, had I seen it in the EB Tavern. Like I tried to get across before, “We” don’t exist. That’s why I was using quotations marks in that post I made. Just because one member does something does not mean it is endorsed by the whole of the Tavern.

The reasons for deletion (Presumably, the sheer volume of profanity), and the reasons for the bans (Obstinance and random defiancy) are entirely separate.

100% true. You seem to have put two and three together, and come out with four.

What I do know is that most of you guys have provided me with much amusement over time. So I hope that all of you that have been banned get unbanned

This is more of a general criticism of Org policy. Have there been complaints from members of the Org about our behaviour within the Tavern? Or even outside? Has every time one of us made a post, have you been flooded with report buttons? I doubt it. We have a lot to add to the forum, and most of the time, I would say it is appreciated. Likewise, I like the Org’s set up. There are a lot of forums on the internet that suck, and I left one some time ago due to a lack of moderation. The Org’s strict policy towards many subjects is certainly a critical factor in stopping it devolving like that.
But if there is one thing worse than a forum where everybody abuses each other, it’s a forum where there is no criticism at all. There are few things more tedious than seeing a forum where a few posters with 10,000 < Posts dominate conversation, everyone slaps each other on the back when they make a reference to something mildly amusing that happened five years ago, and the ravings of the resident racists are met with an “Oh, you.”, and a roll of the eyes. New arrivals are isolated and ultimately bored, even if that is not intended.

That’s not what the Org is, and that’s not what I want it to be. But it could be. And I think acting in the way that the Mods have in the past few days is going to lead it down that road.
By banning people who are slightly more likely to be a bit more chaotic when talking amongst themselves, you are preventing those same people from participating in the main threads. You will be left with a forum that is full of boring, uninteresting people, who, although they never swear, put people off from joining the forum as much as somewhere that contains loads of swearing. By having the EB Tavern, which is a voluntary social group, you are vastly expanding your potential userbase, as people who would otherwise be a little more exciting at some times can contribute to the main forum at the same standards as everyone else. No-one is forced to join the EB Tavern, and it’s not a compulsory part of being an Orgah. If you dislike it, don’t join. It’s as simple as that. If you allow it some leniency regarding both language and moderation, you’ll have a livelier forum. Being reactionary about it isn’t going to do anyone any good.

And with regards to “Just use email/IRC/Quicktopic”; those are all amazingly impractical. With the EB Tavern, I’m surrounded by other, intelligent people, and I know that if I leave a comment, someone will reply. Sending out mass emails will kill off our friendship with one another.

[Sasaki Kojiro]

OK, fine. If people think that that was a problem, then we’ll take that on board. Me and I’m guessing the others arenot too stubborn, or too proud to take valid criticism. However, going along and saying “It was better to just burn the whole thing to ground, as it was too entrenched to edit everything” is going to annoy the people who frequent there regularly. The whole process of dealing with us has swung in a few days from not dealing with it at all to ham-fisted censorship.

In the end tosa is busy, and doesn't want to take time out of real life to go through a 1000 pages.

This is more of a general criticism of Org policy. Have there been complaints from members of the Org about our behaviour within the Tavern? Or even outside? Has every time one of us made a post, have you been flooded with report buttons?

Nah, we haven't been flooded with complaints, it was probably the kitten thing that did you in to be honest.

And with regards to “Just use email/IRC/Quicktopic”; those are all amazingly impractical. With the EB Tavern, I’m surrounded by other, intelligent people, and I know that if I leave a comment, someone will reply. Sending out mass emails will kill off our friendship with one another.

You can have a group here...perhaps an arrangement can be worked out.

[Husar]

What I can say is that the tavern isn't a wannabe /b/ (Wanna/b/?) out to create trouble.

Good riddance.

There's probably a point somewhere in 4chan, like cooking recipes, but a lot that comes from it is just childish, silly and/or offensive. I'm probably old and grumpy but I never understood the appeal of it and never went there on my own. So now I have found this really serious place that appeals to old men like me and those silly kids invade it, guess what? I'm happy that they are crushed down.

[insert some silly lolzkittenzpicture here]

On a somewhat more serious note, I think a lot of the EB tavern people, and probably most 4chan people, lack respect, it's a "me/us vs the rest of the world and whoever doesn't like my kind of humour is a [insert silly lolzkittentpicture]" - attitude and I'm not a fan of it. That doesn't mean that you people haven't made some nice and appreciated Backroom contributions, but whenever this 4chan mentality shows though I wish I had a ban-button, my culture is superior after all.

[Socrates on Wheels]

Good riddance.

There's probably a point somewhere in 4chan, like cooking recipes, but a lot that comes from it is just childish, silly and/or offensive. I'm probably old and grumpy but I never understood the appeal of it and never went there on my own. So now I have found this really serious place that appeals to old men like me and those silly kids invade it, guess what? I'm happy that they are crushed down.

[insert some silly lolzkittenzpicture here]

Very occassionally, I visit /b/. I think that, if you know where to look, you can find some amazingly funny things there. The majority of things there are stupid/offensive though, which is why I don't visit there often
Likewise, I think I can find some amazingly funny things here as well, and that the majority of things said here are intelligent. I'm not attempting to turn it into /b/, and I'm sure no-one else is either.