Results 1 to 19 of 19

Thread: Civil strife

Hybrid View

Previous Post Previous Post   Next Post Next Post
  1. #1
    Tuba Son Member Subotan's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2007
    Location
    The Land of Heat and Clockwork
    Posts
    4,990
    Blog Entries
    3

    Default Re: Civil strife

    Quote Originally Posted by Fluvius Camillus View Post
    High Authority to could define a strong dynastic king (like Antiochos III Megas). Low could be put on weak kings.
    As I said before, having the entire stability of a nation resting on the attributes of one man is unrealistic. Sure, a King may be weak, but if his provinces are getting richer, his troops winning wars, and his nobles loyal, then civil strife isn't going to happen. In fact, the nobles would probably prefer a weak King, as he would be easier to control and manipulate.

    Quote Originally Posted by Fluvius Camillus View Post
    Also the option of rising factions is there now (So Seleucid pretenders like Alexander I Balas can be represented). Has less to do with this, but rising factions can also better represent the Yuezhi hordes.

    ~Fluvius
    There will be no emerging factions.

    Quote Originally Posted by anubis88 View Post
    I really hope that the dinastic struggles can be represented. Just like you said, I had mostly in my mind the Diadochi, since they appear to struggle from this the most. But that's also to be expected, since these empires were the largest.
    Dynastic struggles didn't exist in Antiquity in the same way they did in Medieval/Early Modern Europe. There was no legal system which defined inheritance, and "might made right". Sure, families fought one another, but this was more a way for separate factions to unite behind one banner rather than what you are suggesting.


    Quote Originally Posted by anubis88 View Post
    Another idea IMHO, is to give generals new traits, when the empire grows too large, of them wanting a piece of the pie. Especially in the Arche, once the empire got big, there were numerous factions which became independent: Cappadocia, Baktria, Parthia....
    And yet the same didn't happen to the Romans even though they had a large empire. This is because they had ample amounts of the qualities required for stability I mentioned in my above post.

    Also, i would suggest that such changes wouldn't apply to the Romans till the Marian reforms. Rome didn't suffer from this since the Reforms, when the army became more loyal to it's general then to the Senate.
    That reduces the incentive to work to that point and get the reforms. And there are plenty of examples of civil strife prior to that (Gracchus etc.)

    So generals could, let's say once an empire gets around 30 provinces get a slight lowerance of loyalty. The loyal ones would remain loyal, while for those who were flirting with the idea to betray you, would get the push they needed.
    Did you read my post? I explained why that's a bad idea, as size != civil strife.

  2. #2
    Member Member Cyclops's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2007
    Location
    Melbourne Australia
    Posts
    968

    Default Re: Civil strife

    Interesting discussion.

    Some governments did seem able to retain control of provinces: Rome seemed to hang onto a province once conquered. , so they gradually accumulatedna empire. I think Babrabian tribes m,ight be less able to do this, and even some monarchies (eg Epirus) had trouble holding more than a handfyul of provinces together. Of course this is related to manpower, wealth but also administrative capacity. Makedonia spread and contracted several times from Phillip II to Perseus. A strong King with able FMs and generals built an empire, then huie died and itr fell apart. This doesn't happen so well in the TW engine atm.

    Could the Romans (and other able administrators) be given an adapted agent (say change the princess unit) as a pacifying "governor" agent, so they can more easly control more provinces? Maybe they could also assist with cultural conversion.

    I'm not saying we should deny this to the "barbarians" but they wouldn't start with it: if the Casse want an efficient provincial system they will have to build some monster administrative building/building sequence in the capital, maybe after they get certain reforms.

    Romahs might strart one level into the administrative tree producing "governors", others with no levels. That way an active Casse or Arverni could be as conquiest happy as they liked 9and maybe score a bit of loot) but they'd quicklly lose the new provinces to revolts, unless they built the adminitrative expertise to hold their conquests.

    I know FMs are governors in cities, but this would be a supplementary agent to represent colonial efficiency.

    Just a thought.
    From Hax, Nachtmeister & Subotan

    Jatte lambasts Calico Rat

Bookmarks

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •  
Single Sign On provided by vBSSO