Nusantara Total War : Portugese Invasion

**Rahwana** · 05-01-2010, 05:21

of course we know that sultan of Rum, means turks, because if we go letter for letter, Jirisys might be confused

and it was more logic involved, I see CW not yet giving the gunpowder units, but here's the gunpowder units for Melayu:
- Gun Skirmishers (cheap gun infantry - remember that guns are actually easier to use than bows, they will be short ranged like skirmishers, and not too accurate, but cheap and widely available)
- Gun troopers the Regular Gunners
- Turkish gun troopers (regular gunners - on par with european gunners)
- Elite musketters (elite unit)

and if you ask about the turkish elite archer-swordsmen, you must remember that the Ottoman themself are gun producers, but they still use more traditional cavalry and infantry arm, especially Yeniceri units, to do most of their battle jobs. It was just a logic that most of the turkish soldiers "imported" will be gunners and gun crews, but Turkish (Rum) cavalry did mentioned, and they are most likely HA Spahis.

The turkish themself didn't use guns exstensively before the reform that introduce the Nizam army, much later...

**Nyz** · 05-01-2010, 16:08

Originally Posted by Sonic

and it was more logic involved, I see CW not yet giving the gunpowder units, but here's the gunpowder units for Melayu:
- Gun Skirmishers (cheap gun infantry - remember that guns are actually easier to use than bows, they will be short ranged like skirmishers, and not too accurate, but cheap and widely available)
- Gun troopers the Regular Gunners
- Turkish gun troopers (regular gunners - on par with european gunners)
- Elite musketters (elite unit)

Well, up to today, 3 phrases are found: Saldadu Istinggar, Pegawai Istinggar (both in Sejarah Melayu) and Awinan Astenggar (Hikayat Banjar dan Kota Waringin)

**Rahwana** · 05-02-2010, 04:37

Originally Posted by plutoboyz

no, their real name is Devlet-i ʿĀliye-yi ʿOsmāniyye. Osmāniyye for short (yes, it is how Ottoman turk call it.). Ustmani is for Arab, Persian. later introduced by the Persian to Aceh.
I have friend in Turkey. he knows a lot about Ottoman. do you have question about Ottoman army in Aceh?

puragabaya actually able to use anykinds of weapon. kujang is favored among noble and their Javelin actually is a spear, Legionary fighting style was common. so my suggestion is:

Native name : Kasatrya Kuda Puragabaya.
English name: Sundanese Warrior preist cavalry.
Weapon: Kujang Pangarak(a spear-like kujang. like other kujang, its poisonous) and Javelin.

So we should made them into javelin-spear cavalry? hmm... just like Numidian Nobles?

**Cute Wolf** · 05-02-2010, 05:08

so be it... thanks....

wait... did we finally agreed Javanese bodyguards as Catass Archers? any opinion?

**Cute Wolf** · 05-03-2010, 09:20

After much re-reading arguments, articles, reviewing discussions, and taking into consideration of BOTH similar equipped and called units (so no more "hey, both of this units is called prajurit tumbak, they are equipped much the same, but why are two of them? the sundanese and javanese headgear is only a skin-deep portayal, no need to create another model nor another unit), reducing the overcrowding lists of elephants and chariots (dang! we could made most of them regionals)... so this is the unit lists...

Melayu (aceh-melaka)

factional (non gunpowder) infantry:
Melayu Watchmen (tombak) = Orang Berkawal
Melayu-Sriwj City Guards (archer-golok) = Pengawal Kota
Acehnese Swordsmen Militia (pedang) = Laskar Aceh
Malaka-Sriwj Spearmen (javelin-tombak) = Penjurit
Melayu Shock Trooper (double scimitar) = Tentera Penggempur
Melayu-Sriwj Mariners (archer-2handed tombak) = Tentera Laot
Melayu-Sriwj Pikemen (pike-golok) = Pertikaman
Melayu-Sriwj Halberdiers (2handed spear-axes) = Pangawitan
Acehnese Heavy Infantry (pedang) = Laskar Pedeung
Acehnese Cadet Shock Troopers (2handed peusangan) = Peusangan Askar
Melayu Heavy Archers (archer-scimitars) = Laskar Pemanah
Malakan Elite Mariners (javelin-kapak) = Hulubalang Laot
Melayu-Palemb-Bintr Arab Swordsmen (scimitars) = Laskar Arab
Melayu Ottoman Elite Infantry (archer-scimitars) = Sayyidi Arab
Malakan Royal Swordsmen (keris panjang) = Bentara Istana
Acehnese Honorary Guards (javelin-kapak) = Sahabat Istana

factional cavalry:
Melayu-Sriwj Militia Cav (cavjav-lancers) = Penunggang Kuda
Melayu-Sriwj Light Cav (lancers-cavmaces) = Kuda Perang
Melayu Noble Cav (lances-cavlswords) = Pegawai Dan Pertuanan
Melayu Turkish Cav (cavarchers-cavscimitars)
Acehnese Royal Horsemen (cavmaces) = Ulee Balang
Native Forest Worker Elephants (elephant-javelin) = Prajurit Gajah
Melayu Royal War Elephants (elephant archers) = Gajah Perang Melayu

gunpowder units:
Generic Gun Skirmishers (gun-gunclub)
Melayu Regular Gunners (gun-golok)
Melayu Turkish Gunners (gun-scimitars)
Melayu-Palembang Sultan's Royal Gunners (gun-scimitars)

Bodyguard:
Melayu Bodyguards (elephant archers) = Gajah Kenaikan

Jawi (Bintara-Majapahit):

factional (non-gunpowder) infantry:
Javanese-Sundanese Peasants (sickles) = Tani
Javanese Militia (tombak) = Kroco
Javanese Watchmen (archer-golok) = Jogo Karyo
Java-Sunda Feudal Spearmen (javelin-overhead tombak) = Prajurit Tumbak
Javanese Feudal Swordsmen (parang) = Prajurit Pamedhang
Java-Sunda Feudal Archers (archer-golok) = Prajurit Panah
Bintara Pikemen (pike-keris) = Tentoro Tumbak Dowo
Majapahit Axemen (2handed kapak) = Prajurit Kampak Blambangan
Melayu-Palemb-Bintr Arab Swordsmen (scimitars) = Laskar Arab
Javanese "Saka" Heavy Spearmen (overhead tombakkeris) = Pagerwesi
Majapahit Armoured Macemen (gada) = Prajurit Godhowesi
Javanese Knights / Pendekar (2handed keris swords) = Pandhekar
Bintara Sultan's Chinese Guards (crossbow-scimitar) = Punggawa Cino
Javanese Noble Knights / Satria (keris panjang) = Satrio
Majapahit Royal Shadowguards (overhead tombakkeris) = Bhayangkara

Factional Cavalry:
Javanese Raider-Scouts (cavarchers-cavshortswords) = Telik Sandi
Javanese Feudal Cavalry (cavarchers-cavlswords) = Prajurit Tumpak Jaran
Javanese Noble Cataphract (cavarchers-cavlswords) = Turanggawesi
Javanese Cataphract Lancers (lancers-cavlswords) = Satriyo Turanggawesi
Javanese Elite Cataphracts (cavarchers-lancers) = Satriyo Priyayi
Javanese Chariots (chariot-archers) = Kreto Tempur
Native Forest Worker Elephants (elephant-javelin) = Prajurit Gajah
Javanese Armoured War Elephantss (elephant-javelin) = Gajah Wesi

Gunpowder Units:
Generic Gun Skirmishers (gun-gunclub)
Javanese Gunners (gun-keris)
Bintara-Palembang Royal Chinese Gunners (gun-dao)
Majapahit-Sriwijaya-Sunda Noble Handgunners (gun-parang)

Bodyguards:
Javanese Cataphract Bodyguards (cavarchers-kerislancers) = Punggawa Turanggawesi

Pajajaran:

factional (non gunpowder) infantry:
Javanese-Sundanese Peasants (sickles) = Tani
Sundanese Watchmen (golok) = Wado
Java-Sunda Feudal Spearmen (javelin-overhead tombak) = Prajurit Tumbak
Java-Sunda Feudal Archers (archer-golok) = Prajurit Panah
Sundanese Feudal Swordsmen (parang) = Pamarang
Sundanese Elite Watchmen (javelin-tombak) = Bayangkara
Sundanese Euro-Armoured Swordsmen (longswords) = Prajurit Bajubesi
Sundanese Royal Spearmen (tombakkujang) = Balamati
Sundanese Royal Bladesmen (javelin-kujang) = Balamati Kujang
Sundanese Jawara (double golok) = Jawara
Sundanese Warrior-Priest Swordsmen (parang) = Kasatrya Pamarang Purgabaya
Sundanese Warrior-Priest Bladesmen (javelin-kujang) = Kasatrya Kujang Purgabaya
Sundanese Elite Warrior-Priest (2handed tombakkujang) = Kasatrya Purgabaya

factional cavalry:
Sundanese Light Cavalry (cavjav-lancers) = Prajurit Tumpak Kuda
Sundanese Royal Horsemen (cavparang) = Balamati Tumpak Kuda
Sundanese Warrior-Priest Cav (cavjav-kujanglancers) = Kasatrya Kuda Purgabaya
Sundanese Chariot (chariot-archers) = Kereta Kuda
Native Forest Worker Elephants (elephant-javelin) = Prajurit Gajah
Sundanese War Elephants (elephant-javelin) = Pasukan Gajah Siliwangi

gunpowder units:
Generic Gun Skirmishers (gun-gunclub)
Sundanese Euro-Armoured Gunners (gun-longswords)
Majapahit-Sriwijaya-Sunda Noble Handgunners (gun-parang)

Bodyguards:
Sundanese WarPri Cav Bodyguards (cavjav-kujanglancers) = Pengawal Purgabaya

South Sumatera (Palembang-Sriwijaya)

factional (non-gunpowder) infantry:
Sriwj Town Watch (pedang) = Penjaga Kota
Melayu-Sriwj City Guards (archer-golok) = Pengawal Kota
Sriwj Skirmishers (javelin-overhead tombak) = Pelempar Lembing
Malaka-Sriwj Spearmen (javelin-tombak) = Penjurit
Sriwj Axe Soldiers (javelin-kapak) = Tentara Kapak
Sriwj Light Infantry (javelin-kukhri) = Tentara Sriwijaya
Sriwj Crossbowmen (crossbow-golok) = Pembidik
Melayu-Sriwj Mariners (archer-2handed tombak) = Tentera Laot
Melayu-Sriwj Pikemen (pike-golok) = Pertikaman
Melayu-Sriwj Halberdiers (2handed spear-axes) = Pangawitan
Melayu-Palemb-Bintr Arab Swordsmen (scimitars) = Laskar Arab
Sriwj Elite Mariners (pedang panjang) = Pelaut Sriwijaya
Sriwijaya Elite Light Infantry (javelin-kukhri) = Kesatria Kukri
Palembang Palace Guards (keris panjang) = Pengawal Istana
Sriwijaya Black Lotus (2handed tombak) = Teratai Hitam

Factional Cavalry:
Melayu-Sriwj Militia Cav (cavjav-lancers) = Penunggang Kuda
Melayu-Sriwj Light Cav (lancers-cavmaces) = Kuda Perang
Sriwj Noble Cavalry (cavjav-kerislancers) = Prajurit Bangsawan
Sriwj Royal Cavalry (kerislancers-cavkapak) = Prajurit Kuda Istana
Sriwijayan Chariots (chariot-javelins) = Kereta Perang
Native Forest Worker Elephants (elephant-javelin) = Prajurit Gajah
Sriwijayan War Elephants (elephant-archers) = Gajah Perang Sumatera

Gunpowder Units:
Generic Gun Skirmishers (gun-gunclub)
Sriwj Indian Gunners (gun-scimitar)
Bintara-Palembang Royal Chinese Gunners (gun-dao)
Melayu-Palembang Sultan's Royal Gunners (gun-scimitars)
Majapahit-Sriwijaya-Sunda Noble Handgunners (gun-parang)

Bodyguards:
Sriwj Bodyguards (lancers-cavaxes) = Pengawal Berkuda

EDIT : Stats will be updated later

well.... similar names, means they are one unit indeed... (kembali ngerjain TA... huhuhu)

**plutoboyz** · 05-03-2010, 11:42

I have correct something.

Spoiler Alert, click show to read:

btw, are Bintara and Majapahit army really same? I thought it was different.

**Cute Wolf** · 05-03-2010, 11:51

what? you must never heard what your teacher says in history subjects... Kesultanan Demak are founded by Majapahit Muslim prince, "Raden Patah", who coordination with "wali songo" caused a significant portion of Majapahit army to embrace Islam, and support Demak instead... So that's why they are essentially same army type, with minor variants in elite units (Raden Patah and Wali Songo are Muslim Chinese, so it was not surprising, when the recent scroll translations shown that Demak employs sizeable numbers of Chinese (muslim) soldiers. While majapahit still stucked with older style soldiers, like macemen, and axemen, which was still very intimidating due to their prowess, and the later axemen employs war tattos made of human (enemy) blood)

well, and the "forest worker elephants" are esentially local elephant forces, pressed to serve in war..... better not to remove them... as they are generic unit for every native factions

**Nyz** · 05-04-2010, 16:22

Originally Posted by Cute Wolf

Melayu (aceh-melaka)
factional cavalry:
Melayu-Sriwj Militia Cav (cavjav-lancers) = Penunggang Kuda

Well, I suggest the phrase "Gembala Kuda" (Horse Herdsman), because:

a) The term Gembala Kuda and Gembala Gajah appear in Hikayat Hang Tuah as the trainer of war horses and war elephants.

b) Although herdsman associated with civilian, horse herdsman and elephant herdsman / mahout were special in Malay society because they were not like cow herdsman, goat herdsman and shepherd (they trained horse and elephant for war and vehicle, while cow herdsman, goat herdsman and shepherd rear cow and goat for livestock, and buffaloes to plough the paddy-field. Horses are too expensive to become livestock.)

c) Well, they are militia cavalry, originally as civilian, then become soldier at time of emergency.

Native Forest Worker Elephants (elephant-javelin) = Prajurit Gajah

I suggest the phrase "Gembala Gajah" (mahout) because of above reasons.

A part of Gembala Kuda and Gembala Gajah, the term Penghulu Kuda and Penghulu Gajah also appeared in Hikayat Acheh, they were royal trainer of war horses and elephants in Acheh court.

Melayu Turkish Cav (cavarchers-cavscimitars)

Well, I only found the term Kuda Tizi Peperangan (swift horse of war) from the letter of Acheh's Sultan and Sultanah, it said that the horse breed was imported from various places, especially middle-east:

...ialah raja yang karunia Allah Ta‘ala mengempukan kuda berpakaian mas bepermata belazuardi dan beratus2 kuda tizi peperangan yang seru jenis daripada jenis Arabi dan Rumi dan Turki dan Kuci dan Lahur dan Abaya dan Tongkin dan Gudh

(he is the king granted by God the possession of horses caparisoned in gold studded with jewels and lapis-lazuli and hundreds of swift horses for use in war, of all kinds of stock, Arab and Rumi (Byzantine) and Turkish and Cochin and Lahore and Abaya and Tongkin and Gudh)

**Cute Wolf** · 05-05-2010, 05:33

I think the word "gembala" are rather melayu only words... because the Javanese also share that kind of unit (who'll not using elephants in war when available, even when barely trained for war?)