"Soviet" solution in Afghanistan?

[Lemur]

Edit: If you can frame my motivations, can I take a stab at yours?

The key difference, which you would see if you were not blinded by raw hatred of our president, is that I am not trying to argue that everything good is Obama's blessing, which would be the mirror of your intractable arguments that everything bad is Obama's fault. So, comparison epic fail. Cheers.

[PanzerJaeger]

The key difference, which you would see if you were not blinded by raw hatred of our president, is that I am not trying to argue that everything good is Obama's blessing, which would be the mirror of your intractable arguments that everything bad is Obama's fault. So, comparison epic fail. Cheers.

And.... that would hold water if I had argued that everything was Obama's fault. Actually, I've only made five or six posts about the Obama since he's been president - one of which stating my opinion that he wasn't even close to being the worst president we've had so far. Now then, its no secret I'm not a big Obama fan, but "raw hatred"? Hardly. If it is going to be your SOP every time I post something critical of the president to attack your presumptions of my feelings towards him instead of my arguments, just let me know and I won't bother responding.

And fyi, I support the president's decision to end "Don't Ask, Don't Tell". It's something Bush should have done as a war necessity, considering how desperately we need Arabic translators.

I like how you compared the American Civil War and War World 2 with Afghanistan.

I didn't know they identical, nevermind vaguely similar.

Wouldn't a closer comparison be Vietnam? oh wait, that destroys what you were saying, nevermind.

Actually, you’re right. Vietnam is possibly the best example I could use in support of my point. When the President doesn’t have the will to win, and decides on a strategy designed only to tread water, defeat soon follows.

If Obama had any backbone, he should have just come out and said he didn’t believe the war was winnable, didn’t believe the threat was real, or wanted to save the money for the next asinine social program he decides to propose instead of ordering those Americans into that hellhole only to start withdrawing them immediately after they reach full strength. It reeks of the way LBJ fought Vietnam.

[Lemur]

And.... that would hold water if I had argued that everything was Obama's fault. Actually, I've only made five or six posts about the Obama since he's been president - one of which stating my opinion that he wasn't even close to being the worst president we've had so far.

Only after my prompting, which was due to the fact that you've been back less than a week, and yet you've managed to post consistently about how much you loathe and disrespect our "failure in chief," to use your words. This may pass as reasoned debate in Beckistan, but it's rather jarring amongst the unconverted. Here's what I think is going on: You've decided that you, personally, are going to be the corrective for insufficient Obama hate in the Backroom. You've decided that you're going to single-handedly restore balance to the force, by consistently bashing the president in every thread and every topic in which you post, whether it makes the smallest amount of sense or not. As for what you actually believe, who knows? I find it impossible to say whether I have heard a single honest opinion out of you ever, given your propensity to game, posture and play to a preconceived narrative.

Now then, its no secret I'm not a big Obama fan, but "raw hatred"? Hardly. If it is going to be your SOP every time I post something critical of the president to attack your presumptions of my feelings towards him instead of my arguments, just let me know and I won't bother responding.

As I said, I have no idea what you actually feel or believe, and I doubt I could ever know given the way you treat debate. However, your current persona consists of virulent, non-stop, frequently non-sensical attacks on President 44. Not to mention publicly praising President Bush as "steadfast," marking your persona as one of the 15% of Americans who believe George W. Bush was a good president.

The sad thing is that I think there's an interesting and well-educated person behind the Panzer persona, but I don't know if I'll ever be allowed to meet him.

As for responding to your "arguments," well, they're more like a string of negative assertions than anything I would call an argument. Here's your samples from the last week:

Obama unquestionably represents the worst elements of contemporary American politics

I'm sure he won't be the last Democrat to tell the Failure in Chief to stay the hell away...

[I]t always surprises me that so many people believe POTUS came out of that cesspool [Illinois] squeaky clean... or even with a shred of integrity left.

The war in Afghanistan was lost in November of 2008. [...] our current C&C doesn't take the threat from Islamic extremism seriously and doesn't have the will to win.

If Obama had any backbone [...]

And so on and so forth. And the amusing thing is, I don't see anyone praising Obama with anything like the metronomic regularity of your disses. So you're applying a corrective to ... what? Or just venting your spleen for the good of all, perhaps?

[Beskar]

And so on and so forth. And the amusing thing is, I don't see anyone praising Obama with anything like the metronomic regularity of your disses. So you're applying a corrective to ... what? Or just venting your spleen for the good of all, perhaps?

It is because the rest of us already know that Obama is a blessing compared to likes of Bush jr. So he feels the need to keep insulting Obama, so people dislike him, because "that other guy dislikes him".

[PanzerJaeger]

That is indeed an interesting analysis, Lemur. You are just as perceptive as I remember you to be. Needless to say, I disagree.

In any event, I don't believe I'm out on a limb in describing the presidency as a failure so far, or even out of the mainstream. I thought said failure was common knowledge around the Beltway in both right and left-leaning circles, so I don't know why you're so hung up on that. Further, I don't remember ever reading a positive comment you made about GWB. Should I take from that observation that anything you did write about the man came from a hateful and reactionary place?

Out of respect for Brenus and in an effort to stop the thread from drifting even further off topic, I will refrain from the usual point by point. Perhaps another time and place?

To return to the topic at hand, let me ask you if you feel the president's announcement of a withdrawal date in the same speech as he announced his "surge" was a wise decision? And if so, why?

It is because the rest of us already know that Obama is a blessing compared to likes of Bush jr. So he feels the need to keep insulting Obama, so people dislike him, because "that other guy dislikes him".

At least Lemur has some history with me to draw on, but who exactly are you to draw inferences about my motivations?

My opinions are not uncommon. In fact, I share them with about half the country if polls are to be believed. Are you guys living in a bubble that the general dissatisfaction with Obama has not yet penetrated?

[Aemilius Paulus]

My opinions are not uncommon. In fact, I share them with about half the country if polls are to be believed. Are you guys living in a bubble that the general dissatisfaction with Obama has not yet penetrated?

Mmm, how so? Not approving is quite common. Loathing or thrashing so relentlessly and zealously is another deal. And this is coming from a Republican-turned-Democrat who thinks Dubya was an OK President if not for his decision to invade Iraq (that would be me).

Not to mention, Obama would be far more popular if the GOP did not adopt the ludicrous "NO" strategy which is nearly unprecedented arrogance not to mention, the epitome of unconstructive attitudes. At least the GOP mostly stopped spreading the nasty rumours which floated around during the elections and the first month of Obama's Presidency *death panels, communism - shudder*

[PanzerJaeger]

Mmm, how so? Not approving is quite common. Loathing or thrashing so relentlessly and zealously is another deal. And this is coming from a Republican-turned-Democrat who thinks Dubya was an OK President if not for his decision to invade Iraq (that would be me).

Not to mention, Obama would be far more popular if the GOP did not adopt the ludicrous "NO" strategy which is nearly unprecedented arrogance not to mention, the epitome of unconstructive attitudes. At least the GOP mostly stopped spreading the nasty rumours which floated around during the elections and the first month of Obama's Presidency *death panels, communism - shudder*

Rasmussen has today's "Strongly Disapprove" number at 40%. Consider me there.

And yes, it is generally the opposition party that drives... well... opposition to the ruling party and its leader. Somewhat unique to Obama is the amount of grassroots opposition his policies have elicited, separate from GOP efforts. They're trying their hardest now to catch up to it.

[Beskar]

My opinions are not uncommon. In fact, I share them with about half the country if polls are to be believed. Are you guys living in a bubble that the general dissatisfaction with Obama has not yet penetrated?

It is called "The World" and we in "The World" like Obama.

In particular, Europe.

[Furunculus]

It is called "The World" and we in "The World" like Obama.

In particular, Europe.

the world doesn't matter, americans matter.