EU President has the charisma of a damp rag

**Tellos Athenaios** · 02-25-2010, 19:35

The overall point still stands though: if you send in MEPs that are apparently unwilling to co-operate with other EU nations then you do deserve the line "get out or get over it already". That applies in particular to Mr. Farage & co, but in general it also applies to the UK's less than co-operative stance within the EU.

**Louis VI the Fat** · 02-25-2010, 19:53

Bah. This was an outrageous outburst, an affront, a scandal, completely unbecoming of a member of parliament.

O temora, o mores! What an age to live in, when politicians with the manners and conduct of drunk hooligans are cheered and applauded.

Unfortunately, it is becoming the norm in politics. Perfectly reflecting society at large then.

Spoiler Alert, click show to read:

Mr Hannan, MEP for South-East England, has been involved in filibuster tactics, using procedural rules to demand speaking time to make points of order and give explanations of voting, and insisting on seldom-used roll-call votes. Yesterday he saw red over moves to thwart such tactics by invoking parliamentary powers enabling the President to over-ride demands from MEPs if Mr Poettering believes the motive is to disrupt proceedings.

Mr Hannan complained about the stifling of free expression and likened the issue to the Enabling Act in 1933 that gave Hitler unlimited power.
He told the Parliament chamber: "To disregard the rules under which we operate is indeed an act of arbitrary and despotic rule. "It is only my regard for you Mr Chairman and my personal affection for you that prevents me from likening it to the Emachtigungsgesetz of 1933 which was also voted through by a parliamentary majority."
The Emachtigungsgesetz was the Enabling Act with which Hitler won unlimited power.

Joseph Daul, leader of the centre-right EPP group to which Tory MEPs are affiliated, immediately disassociated his group from the remarks and threatened to expel Mr Hannan. A decision is expected when MEPs meet in Strasbourg next month.
Meanwhile Mr Hannan used his blog yesterday afternoon to reveal support from Tory Chief Whip in the European Parliament Den Dover, who told Mr Hannan after the rumpus that his position in the Tory group was assured.
Mr Hannan called for an "amicable divorce" between UK Tory MEPs and their continental centre-right colleagues in the European Parliament's EPP group and pointed out that the Tories have already pledged to leave the EPP next year.
German Socialist leader in the European Parliament Martin Schulz - once likened by then-Italian Premier Silvio Berlusconi to a Nazi camp commandant - condemned Mr Hannan: "People like Hannan are not only not speaking on behalf of conservatives in Europe - they have no home in the European Parliament. They are entirely isolated.

**Furunculus** · 02-25-2010, 20:50

Originally Posted by Louis VI the Fat

Bah. This was an outrageous outburst, an affront, a scandal, completely unbecoming of a member of parliament.

O temora, o mores! What an age to live in, when politicians with the manners and conduct of drunk hooligans are cheered and applauded.

Unfortunately, it is becoming the norm in politics. Perfectly reflecting society at large then.

god bless Dan!

Originally Posted by Subotan

That's very nice, but the rest of Europe doesn't see the non-crazy side of die Inselaffen when outbursts like this occur. I don't want to end up looking like the Deep South of the European Union.

i don't really care what they think of us.

Originally Posted by Boohugh

Perhaps if other EU nations were a bit more cooperative over a multitude of issues then the UK wouldn't have such a problem. The sad fact is, every time we give up something to the EU, we very rarely get back what we were promised in return. I'm still waiting for the reform of the EU budget that the UK was promised in return for giving up our rebate for instance...

that is a card cameron may get to play.

**Subotan** · 02-25-2010, 21:04

How can we defend the realm's sovereignty against enemies if we look like a bunch of rednecks?

**Furunculus** · 02-25-2010, 21:31

Originally Posted by Subotan

How can we defend the realm's sovereignty against enemies if we look like a bunch of rednecks?

the way we have always done:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/History_of_the_Royal_Navy

:p

**Louis VI the Fat** · 02-25-2010, 21:53

Originally Posted by Subotan

if we look like a bunch of rednecks

One will find all European countries have a large, populist rightwing. Of whom provocations and insults are not merely expected, but for whom this is an essential means to mobilise their electorate, to show them they are one of them.

I shall maintain this is not about Belgium versus the UK.

Even so, a slight expression of regret that Belgium (how have they ever wronged the UK?) should've been publically insulted by a Briton who, if he not represents Britain, was elected by British, would show why the UK was once a byword on the continent for good manners and inhibited political reticence.

**tibilicus** · 02-25-2010, 22:07

Originally Posted by Furunculus

the way we have always done:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/History_of_the_Royal_Navy

:p

Isn't the RN due for massive cuts?

**Aemilius Paulus** · 02-25-2010, 22:22

Originally Posted by tibilicus

Isn't the RN due for massive cuts?

Yeah, I was just making a presentation the last week in my Comparative Politics class on that. Massive indeed. Especially those aircraft carries - ouch, they are everything to a navy in these times. But I do not see why Britain should sink into even deeper hole because of such a relatively unnecessary spending. As long as UK navy is comfortably ahead of Argentina, it will be alright, especially with the NATO.

**Louis VI the Fat** · 02-25-2010, 22:28

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ceej...CC9FA&index=16
At around 2:00.

Hannan protests an anti-fillibustering law by comparing this to a Hitler putsch by the German Parliament President Pöttering. A man who sadly never knew his father because he tragically died in WWII, which was influential in this well-respected Christian-Democrat's strive towards a democratic Germany and Europe.

Dear oh dear.

I link to the video because it shows another face of British conservatism. Christopher Beazley. He tells Hannan he can't say this, and asks him to 'step outside with him'. Now there's a British Conservative* for you. A British Conservatism that is more gentle, more 'British' too, taking pride from good manners instead of the absense of it.

*Beazley has communists for breakfast: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Prague_..._and_Communism

**Aemilius Paulus** · 02-25-2010, 21:59

Originally Posted by Furunculus

god bless Dan!

I agree, even if there is no God. That fellow was right to make some of the outburst, although it was mostly tactless.

Originally Posted by Furunculus

i don't really care what they think of us.

That, however, is not good.

Overall, Van Rompuy election is bollox because everyone knows they wanted a weak EU president. I am still not sure about the compromise-builder role, though. This said, Nigel Faragewas ranting by the time he began rambling on about the supposed attacks on European democracy. And the ad-hominem nevertheless made me cringe, even if it was true.

**Seamus Fermanagh** · 02-26-2010, 00:11

Originally Posted by Louis VI the Fat

Bah. This was an outrageous outburst, an affront, a scandal, completely unbecoming of a member of parliament.

O temora, o mores! What an age to live in, when politicians with the manners and conduct of drunk hooligans are cheered and applauded.

Unfortunately, it is becoming the norm in politics. Perfectly reflecting society at large then.

Better than Preston Brook's approach.

**Boohugh** · 02-25-2010, 20:36

Originally Posted by Tellos Athenaios

The overall point still stands though: if you send in MEPs that are apparently unwilling to co-operate with other EU nations then you do deserve the line "get out or get over it already".

No no, you're absolutely right. We should definitely change our democratic rules and make the EU even less democratically accountable just so we don't cause embarrassment to other EU nations...

Originally Posted by Tellos Athenaios

but in general it also applies to the UK's less than co-operative stance within the EU.

Definitely! I can't believe the UK has been blocking reform of the Common Agricultural Policy for so long, not to mention the Common Fisheries Policy, which has only managed to achieve the decimation of fish stocks in the North Sea because the UK allowed common fishing of its waters. Oh, and make sure you don't forget that the UK gets given such a massive amount from the EU budget compared to the cash we hand over.

Oh hang on, think I may be confused here...

Perhaps if other EU nations were a bit more cooperative over a multitude of issues then the UK wouldn't have such a problem. The sad fact is, every time we give up something to the EU, we very rarely get back what we were promised in return. I'm still waiting for the reform of the EU budget that the UK was promised in return for giving up our rebate for instance...