Whats happened to this forum?

[Kagemusha]

One thing to consider is that about 1/5th of the active membership use the invisible mode. That makes the forum look more empty. But in the end my opinion is that its up to us members to try and make the forum more interesting and easy to enter by contributing positively to those areas where we frequent. Along the lines: "What can you do to Org, instead of what Org can do to you" .

[Pannonian]

Along the lines: "What can you do to Org" .

If you want to Org, just be patient and you will. Thinking the right thoughts will also help.

[Kagemusha]

If you want to Org, just be patient and you will. Thinking the right thoughts will also help.

Well maybe" for " would have been better word in English.

[gollum]

Well, i base my comments to the "users online" index that seems to showcase everyone online - be it a logged on member or a guest. According to that index and observations made on the same index of the twc, on average, as it has been already stated i think in this thread, twc has 10 times more traffic. Also thread numbers in sub forums are another reliable index, as are the "viewings" index of every sub-forum. I personally think they all tell the same tale.

I doubt that the org is lacking in interest. By all accounts it is interesting if nothing else, but this is not relevant to the point being discussed. In addition, i believe that most regulars, either staff or not do contribute very much, and it couldn't have been otherwise - else they wouldn't be regulars and staff - again its kind of beside the point.

The point is the existing environment of the org and the relationship and interaction between the same and new tw games and new members, as well as the course the org has run and the direction it wishes to follow in the future.

[Kagemusha]

Well, i base my comments to the "users online" index that seems to showcase everyone online - be it a logged on member or a guest. According to that index and observations made on the same index of the twc, on average, as it has been already stated i think in this thread, twc has 10 times more traffic. Also thread numbers in sub forums are another reliable index, as are the "viewings" index of every sub-forum. I personally think they all tell the same tale.

I doubt that the org is lacking in interest. By all accounts it is interesting if nothing else, but this is not relevant to the point being discussed. In addition, i believe that most regulars, either staff or not do contribute very much, and it couldn't have been otherwise - else they wouldn't be regulars and staff - again its kind of beside the point.

The point is the existing environment of the org and the relationship and interaction between the same and new tw games and new members, as well as the course the org has run and the direction it wishes to follow in the future.

Well i am long standing member of both Org and TWC and i can tell you that volume isnt everything but still needed. I dont think Org is hostile to new members to slightest extend. TWC´s growth came mostly with putting priority to modding and expanding amount of specialized subforums, where their "senior" member class,the "citizens" tried their best to contribute by creating interesting threads and posts. Large emphasis is also made on the appearance of forums, while the TWC members have created for example various forum skins.
With ETW and NTW the totalwar modding community will not be the magnet it used to be in times of MTW, RTW and M2TW. Simply because the games are less and less moddable. So if Org wants to survive.My opinion is that we should look into what else this forum can offer to people other then TW content and work on those aspects. In any case i think best way would be by creating a facelift for the old gall by creating bunch of new forum skins. I dont know if Tosa could create a test board where we could test new skins?

[gollum]

I appreciate that you are a long standing member of the community, but you are not the only one.

I doubt very much that the twc became popular only due to being interesting. Modding played certainly a very large part, but so did the fact that twc was far more open as a community, is using the reputation system and has internal politics based on it, it allows custom avatars, by all accounts was open to less mature and younger members and also embraced the newer tw games. To be perfectly honest a large part of the popularity of twc is unwnted from an orgahs point of view and i certainly agree with that. Amidst the accessible and loose environment there is a lot of pettiness, and this certainly also contributes (to its popularity). However, the org may be on the edge of having reached the other end - ie being isolationist due to its conservatism in regards to the tw community.

Volume is not everything - but a certain amount of inflow of new members is needed for the forum to remain dynamic both in terms of environment and participation. The problem is that past a critical point, a "downward spiral" effect may make the effects of lack of inflow sharply dramatic. Such an effect has already taken place; during the RTW years the org and the twc were almost equal. However by the time of M2TW the org lost ground because the trend of M2 was in line to RTW while the org core was expecting a return to pre_RTW gameplay, and because it was known to younger players by that time that twc was more oriented to CA's line. Also the org, being traditionally a bastion of the STW/MTW community that was its core, by the time of M2 was short of knowledgeable leadership in regards to new TW games. The only person that could do so (lead a new tw forum in the org), was econ21, and his absence as a moderator hurt the ETW section. Dont get me wrong; i understand that people come and go - but having only one person for that job (leadership in a new tw game sub forum) isn't exactly a sign of health in terms of participation.

[Kagemusha]

I appreciate that you are a long standing member of the community, but you are not the only one.

I doubt very much that the twc became popular only due to being interesting. Modding played certainly a very large part, but so did the fact that twc was far more open as a community, is using the reputation system and has internal politics based on it, it allows custom avatars, by all accounts was open to less mature and younger members and also embraced the newer tw games. To be perfectly honest a large part of the popularity of twc is unwnted from an orgahs point of view and i certainly agree with that. Amidst the accessible and loose environment there is a lot of pettiness, and this certainly also contributes. However, the org may be on the edge of having reached the other end - ie being isolationist due to its conservatism in regards to the tw community.

Volume is not everything - but a certain amount of inflow of new members is needed for the forum to remain dynamic both in terms of environment and participation. The problem is that past a critical point, a "downward spiral" effect may make the effects of lack of inflow sharply dramatic. Such an effect has already taken place; during the RTW years the org and the twc were almost equal. However by the time of M2TW the org lost ground because the trend of M2 was in line to RTW while the org core was expecting a return to pre_RTW gameplay, and because it was known to younger players by that time that twc was more oriented to CA's line. Also the org, being traditionally a bastion of the STW/MTW community that was its core, by the time of M2 was short of knowledgeable leadership in regards to new TW games. The only person that did so, was econ21, and his absence as a moderator hurt the ETW section. Dont get me wrong; i understand that people come and go - but having only one person for that job (leadership in a new tw game sub forum) isn't exactly a healthy sign.

I never said im the only one and i know one or two things about what happened at TWC during my active days there. But i wont go into commenting anything of it as i dont think it would be fair to either of these forums. I do agree that having likes of DukeJohn, Myrddraal and EpistolaRichrad as moderators in modding section was great thing for Org in the days of RTW when the community was expanding rapidly. Now if the Org doesnt posses such characters for ETW and NTW, that is a bad thing, but you cant force people to do the job if there is no interest.
So to me first thing would be to make Org look fancy enough for new people and work so the subforums would be vibrant. If that would be successful then no doubt we would gain many new interesting people also. Copy catting TWC is not an option as there is one TWC already. Org should adapt to new times, but not by loosing its essence.

[Pannonian]

Well i am long standing member of both Org and TWC and i can tell you that volume isnt everything but still needed. I dont think Org is hostile to new members to slightest extend. TWC´s growth came mostly with putting priority to modding and expanding amount of specialized subforums, where their "senior" member class,the "citizens" tried their best to contribute by creating interesting threads and posts. Large emphasis is also made on the appearance of forums, while the TWC members have created for example various forum skins.

The devolved model that TWC uses, where staff are very ready to allow local interests to have limited moderation powers in their own forums, may also contribute towards the dedication that members have towards TWC, which is effectively the gateway and host for their own little forum. And for the more rabid, there is also the abiding feature of TWC, the site politics. I don't think I've seen another internet forum that formally gives its members so many rights, to the eternal frustration of its staff. Thank goodness the scene is saner now than it used to be.