StarWars: Return of the Sith [Concluded]

[Beskar]

That was one. You had, what, five nights? What happened to those?

I never had 5 nights, I had 4.

I had no results tonight because I was killed.

I investigated two people Pizza and ********

First night I protected myself, as I thought I would have been attacked and you voted against me, so i wasn't even sure to trust your claim or not. Hey, when the push came to the shove when you could have proved it, I died.

[Askthepizzaguy]

Watch what you reveal publicly after Death, Beskar.

edit: Please.

[Chaotix]

Beskar, in retrospect I totally would've removed your vigilante ability before I even considered the self-protect. However, I now have the self-protect and I will need it if I survive this round.

I had no idea you were going to be attacked; when you actually told me you were certain of it, I tried to change my order but it was too late.

Also, I am a Grand Master. There is a chance that I will get a revive ability, if there is one. Sigurd in his last pm mentioned more protection-type abilities. Who do you think will be revived if I get that ability?

[Secura]

I am Yoda, the Jedi Grand Master and Expedition Leader.

This is the claim that initially made me unvote; it was only due to Beskar bringing other points to light that I voted again.

I was wary of Beskar because of his susceptibility to the Dark Side. In my position, you would all be just as wary.

Most people, but not everyone; I have been maintaining for the entire course of the game that he's trustworthy and legitimate, and it took his death to prove I was correct, unfortunately. The town is down a power role.

Presumably, this would require him to rely on me for protection, so that he would be forced to investigate and not do anything else if he wanted protection.

Is this standard practice of yours, though? To neuter your fellow power roles? I still don't get it, I'm sorry.

Beskar also had his own Self-Protect ability from the Holocron again. He used it on himself, but it didn't work. So even though I did take the protection, that wouldn't and didn't help him.

Beskar actually had an array of abilities that related to fending off night attacks, for example, one worked against lightsabers, another worked against lightning, etcetera, etcetera. Unfortunately for Beskar, the one that you removed from him was the one he needed most, apparantly.

I made a huge mistake, but from my perspective I never thought he was going to be attacked. He was under too much pressure from the town for the mafia to conceivably attack him.

Yet Beskar was always going to be a threat to the Sith, and he kept avoiding the lynch wagons... the Sith would surely have had to take him out at some point, so I'm afraid I can't buy this myself. I've been saying from the beginning to him that he needed someone trustworthy to protect him in case his own protect was negated.

Drain Knowledge (Grand Master)- This allows me to investigate a player and take an ability if they have one. I am the only player who can ever learn this.

Have you found anyone guilty with this ability thus far?

Morichro (Grand Master)- This allows me to roleblock a player. I am the only player who can ever learn this.

Have you roleblocked anyone thus far?

So, like I said. You really don't want to lynch me. I made a mistake, and I admit that fully. But I will be much more useful alive then dead for the time being.

Unless, of course, you find another power role and start stealing their powers too, right?

I don't really know what to make of you, Chaotix; this reminds me of Noblesse Oblige, where you were caught out, revealed yourself to town and basically said "I can change my ways and work with you all!"... this feels like the exact same situation, except this time you're supposed to be a townie.

I'm going to unvote: Chaotix for now, and then go and bang my head against a wall so I can grasp this foolish logic of his. It might start going in with a gaping head wound.

[Askthepizzaguy]

Foolish logic is the mark of townie-ness.

Sith would have a much more sensible, heroic version of events.

[Secura]

Drain Knowledge (Grand Master)- This allows me to investigate a player and take an ability if they have one. I am the only player who can ever learn this.

Something I forgot to ask about this ability:

You used this on Beskar and removed his self-protect ability, correct? You stated that it has a built-in investigation with it... what did it say about Beskar?

[Methos]

Beskar was completely immune to the Dark Side as long as he didn't kill anyone;

I disagree. I was a Jedi Master and nothing in my PM stated I was immune to conversion.

Beskar had eight abilities until one was stolen from him by the Sith,

This is incorrect too. Some are powers and some are abilities. There is a difference. I would suggest you understand the difference before arguing them.

Beskar is dead now, who is going to answer for that? Because he says it's you, and all I see is someone passing the buck to someone that they can't name.

My guess is Beskar was chosen as the Sith realized they couldn't get him lynched. What's the point of keeping him around if lynch-bait isn't working?

[Methos]

Second, he was concerned about Niklas due to the death of Mace Windu:

My discussion with Beskar is what prompted me do a re-read of the thread, mainly targetted at Niklas. As far as I was aware, Beskar was intending to investigate Niklas last night. I believe Niklas got him first.

Vote: Niklas

I made the mistake early on of informing to Renata certain information about myself. Not because of Renata's role, but simply because I'm known to always talk to Renata. When Renata informed to Beskar that she knew who Mace Windu was Niklas just happened to be online and Renata grabbed up Niklas to help her out, without telling Niklas who Mace Windu was. The problem with this, as Secura has already stated, is that I'm known to talk with Renata and since Niklas has known us both for a long time, he more then likely suspected as well. Plus, I had made the mistake early on of saying I recognized the actor of my character and since I'm not a Star Wars fan, that really narrowed things down as well.

Simply put, more then likely Niklas suspected I was the real Mace Windu fairly early in the game, so Beskar's logic is invalid. As you all know, its the problem of playing and conversing with the same people all the time.

Personally, I don't think Niklas is Sith.

[Secura]

I disagree. I was a Jedi Master and nothing in my PM stated I was immune to conversion.

Beskar was adamant and repeatedly maintained that he was only susceptible if he began killing.

This is incorrect too. Some are powers and some are abilities. There is a difference. I would suggest you understand the difference before arguing them.

Powers, abilities. Swings, roundabouts. It's all just semantics, Methos, don't be a pedant, my friend.

He had eight Jedi powers/abilities/whateveryouwannacall'em, ranging from different sorts of protection to weird things that made no sense.

My guess is Beskar was chosen as the Sith realized they couldn't get him lynched. What's the point of keeping him around if lynch-bait isn't working?

Which I stated a few posts back, good sir.

[Methos]

Ibn-Khaldun is dead, he isn't allowed to reveal it to the town,

This isn't correct. I contacted Sigurd after my death regarding what I can and cannot reveal and basically if it isn't in the OP, then its up to the player.

[Secura]

This isn't correct. I contacted Sigurd after my death regarding what I can and cannot reveal and basically if it isn't in the OP, then its up to the player.

I stated that as it's standard game practice, usually, but fair enough.

Do you have anything to reveal that is pertinent to finding scum?

[Sasaki Kojiro]

I DID NOT VIG-KILL BESKAR.

THE SITH KILLED BESKAR.

I am an idiot, but you're all even bigger idiots if you're going to lynch me.

Please do not make me reveal everything. I will do it, and then things will get worse then they are.

That's not how mafia works. If you are the main suspect then you reveal. Good mafia ALWAYS fake claim a power role. See psychonaut in Shadow Fort. You have self protect for goodness sake.

unvote, vote:khaan

We should look for a good wagon however.

[Methos]

I can't recall who said it (Sasaki maybe?), but someone mentioned that they had been talking to Beskar for the 24 hours prior to his death, so let me explain something I've seen regarding Beskar in this game. First off, I didn't trust Beskar, so I had Renata be my middle man, yet in the thread, Beskar stated he knew me. Blatant lie. Second, Beskar claimed to know who the expedition leader was, yet in a conversation with Renata, Beskar informed her that he didn't know who the expedition leader was, but was also going through a middle man.

So, for those of you going off of what Beskar stated prior to his dead, note the above examples that show how much he exaggerates and lies about what and who he knows. Consider that with anything he's informed you. This is one of the reasons I tend not to trust him, even when he's confirmed townie by death.

[Renata]

I suggest Psychonaut be given a look; I think my post on him got lost in the scuffle.

[Askthepizzaguy]

@ Methos

I lie all the time as a townie. It's vital to keep information out of the mafia's hands.

I told a steady stream of lies throughout Capo III to protect my interests and the lives of others. There are always infiltrators.

[Methos]

Do you have anything to reveal that is pertinent to finding scum?

My apologies if I've upset you, but even though I'm dead, I still have the right to play. And if anything, my comments do help find scum, as I'm giving reasons why someone shouldn't be considered scum. I guess I should be apologizing because my statements go against your own.

[Sasaki Kojiro]

I suggest Psychonaut be given a look; I think my post on him got lost in the scuffle.

Yess, that's who I was forgetting.

unvote:khaan, vote:psychonaut

[Chaotix]

This actually reminds me more of Netherworld II, where I was a power role, made some dumb, scummy-looking moves, and got myself lynched. You'd think I would learn.

I think Beskar is too angry to consider me anything but mafia right now. But really, if I was mafia then this was an even poorer move than it is now as a pro-town. I told a pro-town role with contacts that I was going to protect him, and then I killed him? Really? And I didn't expect him to tell Secura all about it and get a bandwagon started on me?

Obviously I didn't intend for Beskar to die.

I will answer all of Secura's questions right now, and then I have to go. I will try to be back later.

First, the drain ability. The only merit I see in it right now is that I can use it to remove vigilante abilities. I am completely immune to the Dark Side.

Before, I realized that taking Beskar's protection would leave him vulnerable. I did not expect him to be attacked, but I was planning on continuing to protect him after I took the vig ability anyway. Also, I did not fully trust Beskar- I didn't want him to have it if he turned. The whole thing was a mistake. I admit that.

The investigation part said he was Count Dooku and that he was susceptible to the Dark Side.

I have used the Drain on no-one else, so I do not know if it will yield a "guilty" result, or only a "susceptible/unsusceptible" result. I actually believe that most townies are susceptible.

As for Morichro- I have not yet used it.

There is a rather easy way of finding out if I am telling the truth. You (or someone confirmed innocent) give me someone to either Drain or Roleblock, in private, then I do it and I give you the result. We know the Drain in particular should show up in the write-up.

[Askthepizzaguy]

Yess, that's who I was forgetting.

unvote:khaan, vote:psychonaut

Was there ever a reason for Khaan, or was it just because he's not talkative?

I vaguely remember a case for Psychonaut's lynch back there.... in the mound of posts even I won't re-read.
unvote, vote: Psychonaut

[Sasaki Kojiro]

Is "power drain" a jedi type power and not a sith?

Beskar could very well just be out for revenge, and we should lynch psychonaut. But we should be wary of a fakeclaim here. Although, since he's claimed expedition leader, and there is a town expedition leader right?

[Chaotix]

I'm supporting the Psychonaut wagon because I'm assuming it's going to go somewhere and replace me for the lead. First it was ATPG, then khaan, and now this, but the more bandwagons we try to start, the more stragglers get left behind and the more votes I have in comparison.

Unvote, Vote: Psychonaut.

[Chaotix]

I am unsure if Drain Knowledge or Morichro are really Jedi powers within the canon. All I know is that they say "Grand Master" next to them.

I don't know if we can count on the powers always matching up. Didn't Methos have Force Lightning?

[pevergreen]

Do you have a green lightsaber?

[Beskar]

Psychonaut might not be the sith you are looking for.

[Sasaki Kojiro]

Psychonaut might not be the sith you are looking for.

WHY?

innuendo is a time waster

[Secura]

My apologies if I've upset you, but even though I'm dead, I still have the right to play. And if anything, my comments do help find scum, as I'm giving reasons why someone shouldn't be considered scum. I guess I should be apologizing because my statements go against your own.

You misunderstand, you haven't upset me Methos, don't worry about that! :P

What I meant to say is that, considering you were a Master and you're not withheld from revealing things you know in-thread, is there anything you may have learned that potentially points to someone being Sith?

I told a pro-town role with contacts that I was going to protect him, and then I killed him? Really? And I didn't expect him to tell Secura all about it and get a bandwagon started on me?

You say he's pro-town here, but then why go to all these lengths? You're one heck of a silly moo, Chaotix!

And yes, Beskar kept me informed when he was told that he was under attack, to make sure that someone was able to carry his suspicions into the thread in the event he died. I'm just the messenger, treacle.

Obviously I didn't intend for Beskar to die.

That much is clear, there is sincerity in your posts... it doesn't really change matters, but at least you're sorry about it.

I am completely immune to the Dark Side.

I had predicted this, I'm glad to see I was right; but it does make you a target for night attacks, unfortunately. It's lucky you have Beskar's ability now, I guess.

The investigation part said he was Count Dooku and that he was susceptible to the Dark Side.

I have used the Drain on no-one else, so I do not know if it will yield a "guilty" result, or only a "susceptible/unsusceptible" result. I actually believe that most townies are susceptible.

Then this actually changes everything; I would wager that anyone from Padawan onwards would get a similar investigation result. I believe Initiates (which seem to be base-level, vanilla townies) are immune to recruitment, as it seems they can't even wield lightsabers or use the Force.

[naut]

Interesting, interesting, interesting, interesting. Be right back with multi-quote,

Chaotix you can role-block correct? Why not role-block me tonight.

Psychonaut might not be the sith you are looking for.

Cheers buddy. But, these people seem insistent on shooting themselves in the foot. =)

[Sasaki Kojiro]

Interesting, interesting, interesting, interesting. Be right back with multi-quote,

Chaotix you can role-block correct? Why not role-block me tonight.


Cheers buddy. But, these people seem insistent on shooting themselves in the foot. =)

It's called role claiming for the love of god.

Soft claim = scum

Not always, but it amounts to the same thing.

[naut]

In summary you've read way too into my posts. You've made mountains out of mole hills. Impressive, but misguided. You've essentially ascertained how my Role character acts, very diplomatic, very calm. I've been trying to roleplay, sorry for any confusion this may have provided unto you.

Continuing on, in 796 there's Psychonaut asserting that Beskar is not pro-town but neutral (repeated in 804). What the heck is that?

Let me explain, I had good reason to believe he was neutral, something about colours not aligning and whispers in the darkness. Etc.

but it doesn't hold up. There's no reason for Beskar to need to prove his investigative ability unless there is some reason to suspect he is no innocent, and if there's reason for that, then anyone might legitimately vote for him. Psychonaut is trying to have it both ways: to encourage suspicion in numerous different ways while simultaneously chucking mud at almost anyone who votes for him. Nice tactic, but not one that looks like town. You know that stereotypical "the mafia are just laughing at us" thing that gets trotted out whenever two people are having a big argument, and then half the time the person who says that is mafia? Well this is the first time I can remember finding something that actually looks like a laughing mafia.

Let me explain. In private I contacted Beskar, a few times. Not much, but a few. And on one hand I dislike town networks, but on the other I had good reason too. So my posts, are probably just as torn as I was then.

As an aside, 991 is actually the post that first drew my attention. It's only commenting on the write-up:

but it feels out of place, contrived. I've been "concerned for the rest of us" since Night Zero, you know? Anyway, that's what got me looking to find all of the above, though it's next to nothing in itself.

Hmmmm. No.

[naut]

Soft claim = scum

You want a hard claim.

Fine:

I am Obi-Wan Kenobi. I provided Beskar with the list he posted earlier and I will add three more if I may: (29/40)

Obi-Wan Kenobi
Count Dooku
Yoda
Kenth Hamner
Dhidal Nyz
Aayla Secura
Sifo Dyas
Atris
Barrison Draay
Kyp Durron
Corran Horn
Tahiri Veila
Qui-Gon Jinn
Palpatine
Luke Skywalker
X2
Jacen Solo
Galen Marek
Galleros Nul
Daye Azur-Jamin
Den Siva
Eeth Koth
Hoth
Barriss Offee
Anakin Skywalker
Mace Windu
Belth Allusis
Koffi Arana
Micah Giiett

Now. Come get me Sith I am ready to face my death.