Daggers in the Night [Concluded]

[atheotes]

Unless Beefy or ATPG say they didn't receive the PM as was claimed, I don't see how this makes either split or TheFlax scummy.

I think it makes Flax look scummy because he could have gotten Split lynched inspite of knowing he was away

[Askthepizzaguy]

This is getting hilarious Pizza.

Okay then. I am glad I amuse you.

To put it short. I am not guilty and no i dont think your idea that i should lay down and die, just because you want me to do so is a good one.

Never asked you to... just asked you to stop acting like I am... insulting your mother, or something, when all I've done is play the game and do my job which is accuse suspects. How have I wronged you, man? This is a mafia game, you should really be able to deal with this. It's part of the game. I'm not personally attacking you, so please, get over it. Defend yourself without inventing straw man arguments and pretending like you're personally insulted. You can do that, I know you can.

Your entire case against me is just a huge wifom and trying to defend your case with argument that i should agree with your logic, just because it happends to be your logic, is not logic to me at all.

See, Kagemusha, you know this is total garbage. I never said either that you had to agree with me, or that my case was based in logic or evidence. You know what my case on you is based on?

Three things:

1. You're one of the remaining suspects. By that fact alone I have the right to accuse you all day long. So already, you've no right to be offended.
2. Your reactions are totally off-the-wall and make zero sense. You act like you've got something to hide or something big to lose if you die. And that's because you are freaking out over standard mafia procedure, which is when someone accuses you based on nothing... then you flip out?
3. You're playing the humor/emotion/pity/WIFOM game. You made funny posts, which historically have the positive effect of making people want to leave you alive because they like your humor. It's the whole reason I let up on you for a while. Secondly, you're reacting emotionally, which tugs at the heartstrings. I loves ya, Kagemusha, but I still gots to accuse you. You're acting like I'm some grand inquisitor and I'm ruining the entire game by being way off base about you, and trying to act sympathetic. Notice how you're focusing only on me when you're defending yourself, even though you show up on the list of a half-dozen other player's suspects? Are they all my mind-puppets, Kagemusha, or is it an independent phenomenon that you might be scummy to them? Then voting yourself, which is not exactly classic Kagemusha. What in heck was that all about, only to retract it later?

And all that amounts to jack squat whether you're guilty or not. It doesn't mean you are. No one is psychic enough to know when you're guilty. But when you're twisting my words around and playing the wounded puppy game, and reacting completely out of character for yourself, it raises eyebrows.

From experience you should know that keeping me alive to the end of the part of the game has payed off handsomly for the town quite the few times and if it is up to me. I will do my best to do so. It isnt the first time dead players have been howling for my death and i have been able to stay alive, with sometimes saving the entire town in the process.

No, Kage... I haven't seen your best mafia-catching efforts this game, imo. You were a predator in Mafia IX, but here... you're like a mouse unless someone accuses you personally.

So lets just drop the fight with words and take a look at my behaviour through out the game and point to me something honestly that says scummy.

Hah. Define scummy, then get back to me. I've already pointed out where your behavior matches classic forms of lynch avoidance, and how it doesn't match a reasonable reaction to normal mafia accusations. Next, you do realize that a player of your caliber could get through a whole game without doing anything classically "scummy", and that still doesn't prove your innocence, right? Acting scummy and being scum aren't even necessarily the same thing.

If you can provide something, maybe i will take on your offer and vote myself to death just to please you.

More WIFOM bogusness. This isn't necessary. There's no way I should be able to convince YOU you're scummy, so just drop the "it's a fair cop, I fall on my sword for thee" act, because that's all it is; another pointless act.

Hopefully by looking at the game objectively, you can come to an conclusion that indeed i wouldnt play my game like this if i were mafia.

No, and no one could ever come to that conclusion. It's ridiculous that you'd suggest there is a pattern of behavior you'd never do as mafia, given your experience and iron will.

Currently all you are doing is repeating yourself

Currently all YOU're doing is inventing a fiction about me and what precisely I'm arguing. You've straw-manned, red-herring'ed, and WIFOM'ed more times than I care to count. You're acting ridiculous.

with your idea that i could be capable doing a wifom which you are accusing of me. While you should focus on the fact, would there be any sense doing so.

Would there be any sense using WIFOM in a mafia game.... the answer is always yes. If one is mafia, then that is a fact of life for them. Everything they do is WIFOM; would I do this as mafia? Would I do that as mafia?

Why the focus on the WIFOM aspect? It's absurd. The case on you is: Someone may have picked you to be scum! And out of the maybe 9 suspects I have remaining, you're one of the ones I favor most. Big whopping deal.

Your reaction is what's really sealing the deal for me. I hate how you're twisting my words.

[Renata]

Ah, Mafia IX. Forgot that one. Ok, I was riding Kage's butt for most of that game.

[Kagemusha]

Okay then. I am glad I amuse you.



Never asked you to... just asked you to stop acting like I am... insulting your mother, or something, when all I've done is play the game and do my job which is accuse suspects. How have I wronged you, man? This is a mafia game, you should really be able to deal with this. It's part of the game. I'm not personally attacking you, so please, get over it. Defend yourself without inventing straw man arguments and pretending like you're personally insulted. You can do that, I know you can.



See, Kagemusha, you know this is total garbage. I never said either that you had to agree with me, or that my case was based in logic or evidence. You know what my case on you is based on?

Three things:

1. You're one of the remaining suspects. By that fact alone I have the right to accuse you all day long. So already, you've no right to be offended.
2. Your reactions are totally off-the-wall and make zero sense. You act like you've got something to hide or something big to lose if you die. And that's because you are freaking out over standard mafia procedure, which is when someone accuses you based on nothing... then you flip out?
3. You're playing the humor/emotion/pity/WIFOM game. You made funny posts, which historically have the positive effect of making people want to leave you alive because they like your humor. It's the whole reason I let up on you for a while. Secondly, you're reacting emotionally, which tugs at the heartstrings. I loves ya, Kagemusha, but I still gots to accuse you. You're acting like I'm some grand inquisitor and I'm ruining the entire game by being way off base about you, and trying to act sympathetic. Notice how you're focusing only on me when you're defending yourself, even though you show up on the list of a half-dozen other player's suspects? Are they all my mind-puppets, Kagemusha, or is it an independent phenomenon that you might be scummy to them? Then voting yourself, which is not exactly classic Kagemusha. What in heck was that all about, only to retract it later?

And all that amounts to jack squat whether you're guilty or not. It doesn't mean you are. No one is psychic enough to know when you're guilty. But when you're twisting my words around and playing the wounded puppy game, and reacting completely out of character for yourself, it raises eyebrows.



No, Kage... I haven't seen your best mafia-catching efforts this game, imo. You were a predator in Mafia IX, but here... you're like a mouse unless someone accuses you personally.



Hah. Define scummy, then get back to me. I've already pointed out where your behavior matches classic forms of lynch avoidance, and how it doesn't match a reasonable reaction to normal mafia accusations. Next, you do realize that a player of your caliber could get through a whole game without doing anything classically "scummy", and that still doesn't prove your innocence, right? Acting scummy and being scum aren't even necessarily the same thing.



More WIFOM bogusness. This isn't necessary. There's no way I should be able to convince YOU you're scummy, so just drop the "it's a fair cop, I fall on my sword for thee" act, because that's all it is; another pointless act.



No, and no one could ever come to that conclusion. It's ridiculous that you'd suggest there is a pattern of behavior you'd never do as mafia, given your experience and iron will.



Currently all YOU're doing is inventing a fiction about me and what precisely I'm arguing. You've straw-manned, red-herring'ed, and WIFOM'ed more times than I care to count. You're acting ridiculous.



Would there be any sense using WIFOM in a mafia game.... the answer is always yes. If one is mafia, then that is a fact of life for them. Everything they do is WIFOM; would I do this as mafia? Would I do that as mafia?

Why the focus on the WIFOM aspect? It's absurd. The case on you is: Someone may have picked you to be scum! And out of the maybe 9 suspects I have remaining, you're one of the ones I favor most. Big whopping deal.

Your reaction is what's really sealing the deal for me. I hate how you're twisting my words.

I guess you are right to have your opinion and you can drive for enyones lynch.I guess my grumpyness is getting the best of me.Like you said yourself my behaviour is not my normal me guilty or not.Im now off to hit another 10 hour shift untill 6 am tomorrow morning. Have a nice evening everybody.

[TinCow]

I think it makes Flax look scummy because he could have gotten Split lynched inspite of knowing he was away

Right, but doesn't the same reasoning apply to ATPG and Beefy?

[Beskar]

I remember a game in the early days where I killed my two accusers and went "zomg teh mafia framed me."

It is basic WIFOM and no one is convinced Kagemusha, especially as you re-emerged.

[Secura]

Seriously, Why? That's just uncalled for. Not happy.

I get the feeling that he just doesn't like women... I wouldn't pay too much attention to anything he has to say, to be honest.

You and Secura have tried to get me lynched in any game i have played reacently.So i wont put much thought on your reasoning as it seems you have biased opinion about me to begin with.

What does this mean? :<

I remember a game in the early days where I killed my two accusers and went "zomg teh mafia framed me."

It is basic WIFOM and no one is convinced Kagemusha, especially as you re-emerged.

Which is precisely what I said after myself and YLC were killed... we both voted for Kagemusha during the day, died during the night; you could dress this up as a set-up, but from my observations I've noticed that Kagemusha plays very ballsy, risk-taking moves such as this (look at Shadow Fort and all the attention he garnered in the first two rounds), where we're looking at a piece of WIFOM that is so blantant and transparant... and yet it worked, because for the most part the town had entirely ignored Kage until now, when he's been a suspect of both myself and YLC since the third day phase.

[The Stranger]

Right, but doesn't the same reasoning apply to ATPG and Beefy?

atpg is dead...

why are you raising suspicion on a dead guy...

[TinCow]

atpg is dead...

why are you raising suspicion on a dead guy...

Why are you taking comments out of context?

[Askthepizzaguy]

TheFlax wants me to confirm that I got the message regarding Split, as the other hosts did. Yes, I did. And TheFlax was in the CC.

[Diana Abnoba]

Okay my fellow Daggers, it looks like Kagemusha has the most votes for today's lynch. Andres lynch write up sent (with some Pizza seasoning on it- to make it better). Thanks

[Methos]

My three suspects are: Renata, Beskar, and Kagemusha.

Renata just because she seems off. Plus, every now and then she'll IM me about the game, but just enough to bring it up, yet not enough to pull me back in. It's similar to what I did to Niklas in a game where I was mafia, where I tried to get him to become active.

Beskar because he's typically always out front trying to lead the pack. Granted, that's typically in games that have more roles, but I still find his behavior odd in this game.

Kagemusha simply due to all the back and forth with ATPG, in which he brings up some interesting observations.

I'm also curious about split's PM. If that many people received it, then how come we've wasted so much time on him? Why didn't one of them speak up about the PM?

Vote: Kagemusha

[Sasaki Kojiro]

TheFlax is probably scum.

[Secura]

Beskar because he's typically always out front trying to lead the pack.

To be fair, this behaviour always leads to Beskar being lynched early-on, and I know from speaking to him that it really, really annoys him; mafia is no fun when you're lynched/killled repeatedly in the early stages of games (I can attest to that too), so it's little wonder why he's changed his playstyle.

Just sayin'.

[Scienter]

To be fair, this behaviour always leads to Beskar being lynched early-on, and I know from speaking to him that it really, really annoys him; mafia is no fun when you're lynched/killled repeatedly in the early stages of games (I can attest to that too), so it's little wonder why he's changed his playstyle.

Just sayin'.

I can see why he'd feel that way. I was pretty at TinCow for killing me asap in pevergreen's game.

[Andres]

Night 8 - Conclusion

The debate reached a fevered pitch as two of the daggers were singled out as being especially suspicious. However, one of them was haunted by the ghost of a pizza man, and was tormented relentlessly by this apparition before the final decision was made.

"But, I'm not a vampire!" Kagemusha exclaimed. "I've never been a vampire... except for that one time! But that was just a role in a game!"

The Naib, dressed in a flowing black cloak, looked up at Kagemusha with sympathetic eyes, but underneath those sympathies was a desire for justice and a firm resolve.

"Please step forward, my friend." she said.

"I'm really busy, I have things I have to go do...." said the dagger.

"I'm afraid I must insist. It is time." she said.

“I have a job! I work long hours! I need to make a living! I don’t have time for this nonsense!”

“Please,” the Naib said softly.

"You're all out to get me! And that pizza guy... he's controlling your minds from beyond the grave! He’s dead and he’s still talking! And then you say I’m a supernatural being? It's a conspiracy! It's nothing more than a plot to destroy the innocent! I say there's foul business afoot. Our Naib pals around with dead people, and I'm the one who is accused of being a vampire... it's insanity, I tells ye. Don't you see? Don't you see the violence inherent in the system? Come and see the violence inherent in the system! Help, help, I'm being repressed!"

Kagemusha went towards the crowd of people to plead his case, but they wouldn't listen. Then, he saw in his mind the image of his foul accuser, and he became enraged.

"You! You think just because you're dead, that means you can't be a vampire? You of all people should know better... so I can only conclude you're hiding something. I'll kill you until you're... even deader!"

Kagemusha unsheathed a long, curved blade, and charged toward the invisible man, slicing through the air, hacking his imaginary foe to pieces. But still, the voices wouldn't leave his mind.

"Why must you torment me so, after all we've been through together? I curse thee! I curse thee and everyone who looks like thee!" said Kage, who spat upon the ground.

The daggers looked confused at the madman who was yelling against the air and the walls of the Generalife.

"Are you ready for your judgment now?" asked the Naib, warily.

Suddenly Kagemusha brightened up and turned toward the Naib with a pleasant grin on his face. "Why, yes, my good lady. I wouldn't have elected you as Naib if I wasn't ready to die by your hand. It would be an honor to die for you."

Diana Abnoba gripped her blade, and waited.

"Come here, glorious leader, and strike me down for the so-called crimes I have committed." he said, advancing toward the Naib.

Diana's face betrayed no emotion, and Kagemusha continued walking in her direction.

"Or should I come running to you when you call? Come willingly to my own death? It would be my pleasure, my lady."

Diana waited.

"But one thing I will not do, is die without a fight, my lady. First, you must defeat me in glorious comba-"

Beskars’ head fell to the ground, with his body crumpling a split second later. Diana calmly walked past the body of the fallen, and retrieved her blade from the hot sand several paces behind him. Then she took out a silver dagger and placed it swiftly into Beskars’ heart.

The other daggers murmured anxiously at the suddenness of the event.

Diana retrieved her knife and then she froze. She stared at Beskars’ body. She turned pale and looked up.

“How? What?”

The daggers looked at their Naib. Some stepped forward.

“That’s impossible!” one exclaimed.

“I swear that I saw Kagemusha attacking the Naib!” another one said.

The brothers and sisters looked around and found Kagemusha, who was standing at the opposite side of the courtyard, alive and kicking. He looked surprised, then relieved.

“I guess it just wasn’t my time yet,” he said, and he shrugged, a slightly amused expression on his face in an attempt to hide that he was facing death no more than a few minutes ago.

It took a while before the Naib calmed down and was able to speak again.

"There's nothing more to see here. Go back to your rooms and remember to lock them this time. Anyone who fails to do so will have to deal with me. Have a safe and pleasant sleep." said Diana, who motioned for them all to leave.

They dispersed quickly, throwing uncomfortable looks at the man who had just cheated death.

The Naib stared at Kagemusha’s back.

What the just happened?

***

Tally:

Kagemusha Beskar: 6 (Scienter, Methos, TinCow, TheFlax, Beskar, Renata)

Methos: 3 (Kukrikhan, Diamondeye, pevergreen)
Beskar: 3 (Choxorn, Kagemusha, Beefy187)
TheFlax: 1 (splitpersonality)
splitpersonality: 1 (The Stranger)

Not voting: 3 (Diana (Naib), Jolt, Double A)

***

Alive (16)

1. TheFlax
2. Renata
3. Diana Abnoba
4. Double A
5. TinCow
6. The Stranger
7. Methos
8. spL1tp3r50naL1ty
9. Jolt
10. Choxorn
11. Kukrikhan
12. Beefy187
13. Kagemusha
14. pevergreen
15. DiamondEye
16. Scienter

Killed (15)

autolycus
Yaropolk
Chaotix
Centurion1
Ibn-Khaldun
Psychonaut
Sasaki Kojiro
Yaseikhaan
Peasant Phill
Death is yonder
YLC
Secura
Captain Blackadder
GreyBlades
Niklas

Lynched (8)

Csargo
Askthepizzaguy
Seon
GeneralHankerchief
White_Eyes:D
Romanic
atheotes
Beskar

WoG (1)
AVSM

***

It's now night. PM's please. Night will last for +/- 23 hours.

[Beskar]

Kagemusha is the ancient evil.

Told you so.

edit: Secura got first dibs, then YLC, and those others who suspected him as well. Those who voted me are Mafia.

[Secura]

Hahaha, YLC and I were right. xD

[ULC]

Told you all, and I gave very specific reasoning as to why. Instead the town ignores me and Secura...

[Sasaki Kojiro]

That is an odd mechanic...to give the ancient vampire a lynch switching ability doesn't make much sense, because he would just be lynched the next day, unless the only way he can be killed is with the vig shot.

But, kage should be vigged tonight.

[Beskar]

That is an odd mechanic...to give the ancient vampire a lynch switching ability doesn't make much sense, because he would just be lynched the next day, unless the only way he can be killed is with the vig shot.

But, kage should be vigged tonight.

No, he can't be killed unless his minions are dead. I was second on the list, hence why I died.

Though, I was really convinced of Kage's guilt when he resurfaced and cried about getting picked on, and tried to accuse me of framing him.

[Secura]

Hahaha, what he said.

[Askthepizzaguy]

We think Kagemusha is the ancient evil or the "special role".

In any case, we wish to use a vig kill tonight. EVERYONE: send Diana your suggestion for who to kill, and most especially your REASONS why they need to be killed.

I have already offered my opinion. I believe an attack on Kagemusha will fail at night as well. But I want to save that other vig kill for him just in case.

In the meantime, I'm looking for henchmen, and I think we have it narrowed down. But it would be nice if this was a team effort, so Diana doesn't just pick who Beskar and I think it is. Show us the path you would choose.

I'm disappointed only a few of you responded to my "top 3 suspects" call. That does not make me a happy pizza.

[atheotes]

what does this mean? we need to get rid of the grunts before the ancient one?

i think we took a huge step in the game.

there are many people here who have voiced that Kage is suspect and some have voted for him as well...so it is good.

[Sasaki Kojiro]

The Ancient one is supposed to be the equivalent of the godfather, where do you guys see that he can't be killed until his minions are?

[Askthepizzaguy]

The Ancient one is supposed to be the equivalent of the godfather, where do you guys see that he can't be killed until his minions are?

If Kagemusha were some "special role" which was aligned with the town, he wouldn't have argued so hard against being lynched, but he would have stated that he would have been able to survive it. Everything we saw this round from Kagemusha seems to be guilt stink. Townie-roles wouldn't really have a reason to lie if the lynch was about to happen anyway.

It seems to me he had something to hide, which was the fact that he can only be either mafia or a special role. I'd suspect if he were a basic slave henchman he'd be dead quite easily. So that leaves the special "ancient one" godfather role, or the special "unknown" role.

Perhaps the unknown role is aligned with the mafia, like a mastermind or a town traitor, and can't be lynched until the mafia is dead. Who knows.

What I do believe is that whatever just happened regarding Kagemusha indicates that he's not town-aligned. I'd like to make sure he's dead before the end of the game, so I'd ask to keep handy 1 vigilante power. Until then, he seems lynch immune and it may be because we need to remove the henchmen first.

And of course, if he's not the godfather, then we need to be looking elsewhere for that one anyway. So in all cases, our hunt begins on suspects other than Kagemusha, and IMO Kage cannot survive the game.

[Diana Abnoba]

Wow! Okay we found the Ancient One. He can't be lynched until all the henchmen are dead, it seems. But can he be Vig killed? Or do we need to Vig kill the other henchmen. I need a consensus please. Should I sent orders to use 1 of our Vig kills tonight, and on who?

1. Kagemusha- do you think that Ancient One can be Vig killed?
2. A Henchmen- give me your list of who you guys think this is. looking at the voting pattern today I think it could be; Beefy (the only person that sticks out that voted Beskar today) OR did they know that Kagemusha could switch the person that gets lynched. (in that case we need to look at the votes on Kagemusha) the ones that stand out to me are; Methos and Tin Cow.

Or don't send in Vig kills orders, just protection again.

I need everyone's input (except the mafia please ) before I sent in orders for tonight. Thanks.

[TinCow]

If Kagemusha were a town-aligned special role, he would have claimed. We do, after all, have an un-killable doctor ability in the Naib. Kagemusha is clearly bad news, and almost certainly the mafia Godfather.

So, the question now... who would Kage have picked as henchmen?

[atheotes]

So, the question now... who would Kage have picked as henchmen?

I have already sent 1 choice to Diana...you could be the second

[Askthepizzaguy]

I like Beefy187 as a vig kill. Sorry Beefy, I don't know what you've been smoking this game. You're acting like you don't know what the game setup is.
But Methos also tickles my funny bone.
And I'm very sorry, but Kukrikhan would make another excellent choice. He can easily survive a long time by simply doing nothing scummy... and then occasionally act like he has no idea what's going on.

I had Tincow on my list but now I am not sure. He's certainly capable of being this smooth.