Cheats - what's the point??

[Megas Methuselah]

Well you might if you read the cheating requests for help notice nearly all of them are about the Marian Reforms, and they are there because at the moment the Marian Reforms are not actually part of the game. Frankly people who are in a Romani campaign want to play as Rome. If the intention was to just use local MIC then Carthage the mercenary capital of the ancient world is an option. The point of asking for help cheating to make a character who has all the traits to trigger the reforms but one a Populares is in order to get an impossible section of the game, and yes Marian Reforms are at a rediculous requirement, 90 settlements or the game is set entirely in the Polybian era. I have yet to EVER get a Popularis general.

Are you too lazy to use Italy as your sole recruiting ground for factional troops? For retraining, you'll just have to recruit new units in Italy, ship them to the front, and merge them with the depleted ones. The Marians are scheduled to happen as they historically have. So, slow down your expansion and take note that 4 turns is 1 year. Reforms don't happen overnight. As for the popularis trait, have you tried searching the forums? I remember seeing plenty of popularis threads through my years here, where players discuss the likeliest ways of getting the trait without cheating. I myself don't know as I've never played the Romans in EB before in my life.

Now may I ask you if you have ever feel better about yourself now that you are in a rant about how wonderful you are and how horrible we people who want to experience the Romani are? Romani are actually EB on easy mode and I don't have the patience to do one of their campaigns, staying Polybian for all eternity just well it doesn't feel like Rome, it isn't Rome if your army is exactly the type of thing Hannibal would get together

This was the Rome before Marius, and as you very well know, includes a rich and long history. Try to have the patience to use Italy as your primary recruiting ground, and to not blitz the damn map. Also, try not to fall for all those hollywood movies on Rome. It's BS, all of it.

[Ca Putt]

many people here don't play to 'win' but just to play EB or to be utterly historical. You're compleately right that cheating is futile stupid ... if you play to win(exept if you let the AI cheat- give them money, move thier FMs to more usefull places than deserted islands .... that's OK^^). Whereas I think that most of the people who do play to win and later brag about it with monochrome World maps don't use cheats or only VERY few.
In EB many people play with a lot of RP and thus sometimes need to cheat in order to get certain things into their story some of them even write a AAR about it and can't afford the AI behaving stupid ;) or they fancy that an utterly powerfull and rich ... Macedonia would at some point adapted TABs or cataphracts due to challenges that they did not face in history and thus are not implemented into EB. or the vanilla marian reforms, when you play as KH and conquer rome whereas you have problems against Seleucid Phalanxes, It is probable that they would also adapt phalanxes no matter how many people live in capua....(whereas I've never did this although the situation occured to me twice I didn't even take the unrealisic yet fair solution - conquering Capua upgradeing it and gifting it to rome(and conquering it back))

to be honest I sometimes use force diplomacy and move character(as the AI generals seemto be independant of their Diplomats and naval invasions are very rare) and often even auto win when I'm not in the mood to fight an easy battle or one of those endless 5-10 HAs and Cantanks against Grey/Yellow levy stack fights that take a lot of time but always end the same way when fought on the battle map and the opposite when autocalced(not to mention AI generals). I admit that and I'm not prod of it but I play the game to play the game and not to conquer the world or to fullfill my VCs. and I only brag about things I accieved without cheating - fighting superior forces etc.

in a nutshell cheating is ok as long as it's not against a other player(in MP) and you don't brag(or be proud) about what you accieved with Cheat support.

[Alexokrat]

I dont play the game for long but I allready love the auto_win cheat. I use it after CTD while or after battles I won, without it I probably would have stop playing EB because I hate to do the same thing in games again and again, just because of a bug. and besides to fight a battle again which was half an hour long would be really annoying

[Mulceber]

I dont play the game for long but I allready love the auto_win cheat. I use it after CTD while or after battles I won, without it I probably would have stop playing EB because I hate to do the same thing in games again and again, just because of a bug. and besides to fight a battle again which was half an hour long would be really annoying

Agreed - my policy on Auto_win is I will only do it if I've already fought the battle, won, and then got a CTD on the load screen. And I don't consider that cheating - I won the battle myself, it was just the RTW engine's fault that I wasn't able to save it.

Other cheats I'll use:
toggle_fow - just if I'm curious to see how other factiions are doing
add_money - I'll put a negative number in as the amount. I do this so that I can keep my bank smaller than 50,000 and thus get FM's with good traits. It's no fun role-playing if all your family members are stupid lazy and disloyal.
force diplomacy - again, generally for role-playing purposes - I'll do this if the AI is being particularly intransigent, or if I want to help keep a particular faction alive - for example, Gaul is pretty boring if it's just the Aedui or just the Arverni.

Generally, I think most cheating on this board is done for one of two reasons (if not both concurrently):
1. circumvent the stupidity of the AI
2. enhance the role-playing experience

I know that I can beat (and have beaten) the Romani campaign purely on my own, but right now, I'm enjoying going through it again and using cheats to help make another Campaign as the Senatus Populusque Romanus more characterful and historical. -M

[athanaric]

Cheats - what's the point??

To rectify illogical situations. Where the RTW AI fails reality, I help out. This game's AI is so bad that cheating actually makes things more realistic. That's a fact you can easily find out about if you play the game for some time.

So as not to sound condescending, I'll try to explain one major "cheat" I use:
I'm playing with RTW.exe because it's the original configuration of EB. With this exe, the only faction that does naval invasions or send troops as reinforcements via sea is Carthage (though sometimes the Ptolies and Romans do similar things).
Factions that are stranded on islands never get around to sending their troops to the actual enemy. So I teleport AI characters around, in order to simulate more realistic movement. If somebody considers this as "cheating" and "making things easier", I couldn't care less.

Actually I've used this once to force another faction (Baktria) onto Krete, because their territory was in my Victory Conditions, but their extermination was not, nor did I want to destroy them.

[Ludens]

Don't diss people for using or forbidding cheats, please. You are free to play the game in any way you want, and so are they.

[Duguntz]

Don't diss people for using or forbidding cheats, please. You are free to play the game in any way you want, and so are they.

Ha common Ludens, there was no dissing at all, merely the expression of different opinion and that's what it take to keep a conversation running. Forbiding to say something to say something just because it is not of the same opinion than an other is called fashism and THAT should be checked. Here, it's merely divergence of opinions.

[TancredTheNorman]

This was the Rome before Marius, and as you very well know, includes a rich and long history. Try to have the patience to use Italy as your primary recruiting ground, and to not blitz the damn map. Also, try not to fall for all those hollywood movies on Rome. It's BS, all of it.

Hate to break it to you, but the historical Marian Reforms came when the Empire was much smaller and weaker then EB would have anyone believe, and WHY should the ONLY faction that must not reach it's historical turning point be Rome? I never have any problems with the Barbarian reforms, or the Greek reforms, or Carthaginian reforms, why is the Romani reforms different? EB is about changing history, so what exactly is wrong with allowing reforms 60-70 years early especially when they came for some of Rome's hardest enemies after Carthage (Not it's easiest).

Are you too lazy to use Italy as your sole recruiting ground for factional troops? For retraining, you'll just have to recruit new units in Italy, ship them to the front, and merge them with the depleted ones. The Marians are scheduled to happen as they historically have. So, slow down your expansion and take note that 4 turns is 1 year. Reforms don't happen overnight. As for the popularis trait, have you tried searching the forums? I remember seeing plenty of popularis threads through my years here, where players discuss the likeliest ways of getting the trait without cheating. I myself don't know as I've never played the Romans in EB before in my life.

Historically I have demonstrated before Marian reforms were not done historically once there was nothing left to fight. Please tell me you haven't completely forgotten the Jugarthine Wars, the Gallic Wars, Mithraditic Wars, and Actium? As it stands now the reforms happen once there is NOTHING left and that is plainly ahistorical. In historical terms what the Romans infact had at the time of Marius would not actually amount to the 45 province minimum for the complicated requirements, let alone 90 provinces. I do use Italy, but the problem is for role playing purposes Polybian garrissons are plainly ahistorical. The Republican Legion was raised for a particular reason and disbanded once the need ended, and I tend to do that, and keep four Consular Legions in Italy ready to respond, the problem is once you get the required 45 provinces for reforms you are just too large to actually use Italy very often and HAVE TO use regional soldiers. Romans did not recruit mercenaries, Carthage and other medditeranian cultures did, Romans didn't, even Marius only accepted Citizen Soldiers, and allied Latins willing to become citizens.

Furthermore when did I say I blitz? My Empire is constantly fighting simply because I refuse to finish off my enemies, which I easily could do with the regional troops, bringing in troops from Italy for role play is ok butit just doesn't feel right, if I lose 4 citizen militia legions and just replace it with another four, unacceptable losses are what caused widespread acceptance of Marian reforms, so far my Legions being lost have no political effect, and nobody cares. You also I think forget that Marius completed a process more then brought something new, the trend before him was moving away from the old system.

I dissagre. The point of the reforms is for them to happen once the SPQR is to big to be supported by troops from Italy, as it was IRL

All Rome had at the time of Marius was a section of Gaul, a relatively small and relatively underused section of Africa (which the Optimatas refused to develop) large portions of Spain that were not fully subdued untill the Empire, portions of Greece, Italy, Sicily, Corsica, Sardinia, and the Baelerac Isles, and Marius recruted exclusively from Italy what he did not recruit from was exclusively middle class and up. The reforms just gave the poor admission into the army on an official basis and standardized equiptment training and discipline they weren't that massive an overhaul, and were certainly NOT done once Rome had nothing left to fight.

[Ibn-Khaldun]

I use cheats because I really don't have the time to play any campaign too long.
My real life and other activities prevent this.
I play because I want to have fun not actually win the campaign.

So, if you play the game without cheats because you want to win the campaign then do it.
Just don't come here and start a thread with a tone "you cheat? then you must be some ***"

100 players = 100 ways to play the game.

[Titus Marcellus Scato]

All Rome had at the time of Marius was a section of Gaul, a relatively small and relatively underused section of Africa (which the Optimatas refused to develop) large portions of Spain that were not fully subdued untill the Empire, portions of Greece, Italy, Sicily, Corsica, Sardinia, and the Baelerac Isles, and Marius recruted exclusively from Italy what he did not recruit from was exclusively middle class and up. The reforms just gave the poor admission into the army on an official basis and standardized equiptment training and discipline they weren't that massive an overhaul, and were certainly NOT done once Rome had nothing left to fight.

Maybe we're not comparing like with like here.

In EB, you can have a 'Roman' city with a Type IV government. And the game considers it part of YOUR empire.

But, in the true history of the Roman Republic, a territory with the 'Real Life' TM equivalent of the Type IV government wouldn't actually be considered part of the Roman Republic. It would be an allied territory. Allied to Rome, but not under Rome's direct control except with regard to war and foreign policy.

So, theoretically, territories in your EB Roman Empire with Type IV governments shouldn't count toward the number of provinces needed for the Marian reforms. Since those territories would be producing non-Roman troops, not Legionaries.

But, in EB 1.2 right now, all provinces count, including those with Type IV governments.

[VIPERLORD]

LOL oops

Looks like I hit a nerve, so I apologise if it came across to some people that I was saying that if you cheat then you must be no good at the game. That was not my intent. Sometimes I forget that not everyone that plays is playing to try and win but are just having some fun roleplaying etc. Personally for me the fun is in the challenge of overcoming whatever the AI throws at me without 'adjusting' anything.

Anyway, I better stop typing before i end up with another serious case of foot in mouth disease.

[WinsingtonIII]

LOL oops

Looks like I hit a nerve, so I apologise if it came across to some people that I was saying that if you cheat then you must be no good at the game. That was not my intent. Sometimes I forget that not everyone that plays is playing to try and win but are just having some fun roleplaying etc. Personally for me the fun is in the challenge of overcoming whatever the AI throws at me without 'adjusting' anything.

Anyway, I better stop typing before i end up with another serious case of foot in mouth disease.

It's cool, I'm not offended, I was just pointing out that there may be a more diplomatic way of saying what you said. The only cheat I ever use is toggle_fow occasionally to track the progress of the AI anyways, so it's not like this was even really directed at me.

Sorry I thought you were trying to provoke people, on the internet you never know who's asking a serious question and who's just trying to get a rise out of people.

[vartan]

Sorry I thought you were trying to provoke people, on the internet you never know who's asking a serious question and who's just trying to get a rise out of people.

Stupid text: fails to express emotions and body language! BTW I think VIPERLORD is one sick son of a gun for making posts like that. I send you, VIPERLORD, a virtual HI-FIVE.

P.S. Anyone wants to get dissed I'll be in the basement freestylin' your life to pieces.

[Duguntz]

Yay, dissing party... it's been too long since it happened on the forum... ha, the good days of the tavern... I'm coming in your basement, ripping you psychologicaly appart, maybe more paople wants to join?

[Megas Methuselah]

P.S. Anyone wants to get dissed I'll be in the basement freestylin' your life to pieces.

Haha, awesome!

[Ludens]

Looks like I hit a nerve, so I apologise if it came across to some people that I was saying that if you cheat then you must be no good at the game. That was not my intent.

No problem. Nothing wrong with this topic; I only posted it as a general reminder.