Quote Originally Posted by Macilrille View Post
Ah but Sir Robin. It was my ancestors who did in the Romans at Arausio, and if you do a search on the forums you will see who has written mosts posts concerning it. I bet you a balloon that it is I. And there is another one coming soon concerning Roman Manpower that includes it as it cost the Romans 20- 25% of their male citizens in two days.

But, though the Cimbrii Wars were serious defeats and threats for the Romans, the Cimbrians were not a competing superpower were they? They were more like a force of nature, a one-off. Even had they settled/been allowed to settle in the Po Valley they were not a serious threat to the might of Rome. Carthage in the two first Punic Wars were; they could economically, culturally and militarily threaten Rome. When they were removed nothing really stood in the way of the rise of Rome. One could argue that the Macs under Phillip and AS for a while could pose threats, and I believe that the experience from the Punic Wars made the Romans act as they did and squash any competing power ASAP and with ruthlesness. So I maintain that the Punic expansion led to the supremacy of Rome (supremacy being a better word than superiority, my native language is Danish and I am tired).
I agree with everything you said. After the second Punic war, Rome was the dominant superpower in the Mediteranean; The Cimbri and Tevtones did what they did because of lack of a compitent Roman commander to face them.

Rome DID defeat the 2 of the 3 other superpowers in the Mediteranean with ease in the 15 years after the Second punic war. Of course, that Roman army was definetly the most experienced of the non-profesional Roman armies.

Carthage was definetly THE enemy of Rome, the last obstacle on the way.

I dunno what this has to do with the original post, but hack, i always love such debates