RTW:BI roleplaying game: Vandal Invasion

[Ibn-Khaldun]

VI Rules

Available characters(FM's) will be posted in the Library&History thread.

This thread is Vandal Invasion OOC thread.

[Ibn-Khaldun]

Didn't know in which of the two threads to say this, but I'd rather we pick another faction. The Franks are bit too reminiscent of KotF, if only in name and geographical area. I'd like to explore perhaps something a bit more eastern European or central European. I'd have to check the BI map again for suggestions though.

Well, I picked the Franks only because I and Braden liked it. Of course we can choose another faction but the main point is that in my opinion we should keep the game as simple as possible.
The only eastern faction in BI is Sassaids and perhaps Berbers as well.
The first could be quite interesting to play if you like generals who never die.
However, Berbers are not "completely finished" faction since they were never meant to be playable.

Factions in BI:
Barbarians:
Celts, Saxons, Franks, Burgundy, Lombardy, Alemanni
Nomad/Steppe:
Vandals, Huns, Sarmatians, Goths
Roman:
Western Roman Empire, Eastern Roman Empire
Eastern:
Sassanids, Berbers

There are also Ostrogoths, Slavs and Roman rebels but they are not playable from start.
We shouldn't also pick one of the "half finished" factions.
Out of these faction Romans, Huns, Franks, Saxons, Sassanids are the only ones who can give something to the RP and make the game interesting.

[TheFlax]

I wasn't thinking THAT eastern

I'd like Vandals, but they are not in you "final" list. Out of those I'd be interested in the Huns, but I don't know how powerful they are. Anyways, it was just a comment and if everyone is ok with Franks, I'll join the fold. Its not a major concern.

[Ferret]

I think playing a horde nation could be interesting, and would simplify all the rules on land ownership.

[Ibn-Khaldun]

I think playing a horde nation could be interesting, and would simplify all the rules on land ownership.

You mean that "he who conquers owns it" rule?
There is one small downside with hordes.. when they settle then they lose 1/3 of their forces and it's impossible to determine from whose stack what units will disappear.
Also, they don't have any income. It's not big problem if we don't buy mercs and sack every city we take.
Playing as Vandals could be interesting. Trying to follow their historical route(from their starting position through Italy, Gaul and Spain to North-Africa) will certainly give a lot of big battles against romans.

[TinCow]

You mean that "he who conquers owns it" rule?
There is one small downside with hordes.. when they settle then they lose 1/3 of their forces and it's impossible to determine from whose stack what units will disappear.
Also, they don't have any income. It's not big problem if we don't buy mercs and sack every city we take.
Playing as Vandals could be interesting. Trying to follow their historical route(from their starting position through Italy, Gaul and Spain to North-Africa) will certainly give a lot of big battles against romans.

Might I suggest a throw-back to the old succession games? If you play the Vandals, make a house rule that the faction CANNOT settle until it reaches North Africa by way of Spain, and when you reach there you MUST settle. That will give you a big challenge in getting there, plus it will get rid of concerns about the loss of units on settling because when you finally settle it will be together in a cluster. Perhaps some custom rules about determining ownership of units while still in the horde part of the game would be useful, and then only switch over to the full rules listed above once you finally settle. Might be fun to have ways of taking control of other peoples' units while in horde mode: a power struggle of sorts. Perhaps ownership of the settled lands can be determined by who 'wins' the power struggle during the journey.

[TheFlax]

Might I suggest a throw-back to the old succession games? If you play the Vandals, make a house rule that the faction CANNOT settle until it reaches North Africa by way of Spain, and when you reach there you MUST settle. That will give you a big challenge in getting there, plus it will get rid of concerns about the loss of units on settling because when you finally settle it will be together in a cluster. Perhaps some custom rules about determining ownership of units while still in the horde part of the game would be useful, and then only switch over to the full rules listed above once you finally settle. Might be fun to have ways of taking control of other peoples' units while in horde mode: a power struggle of sorts. Perhaps ownership of the settled lands can be determined by who 'wins' the power struggle during the journey.

This is an awesome idea!

[Ibn-Khaldun]

Btw, Franks can also become horde.

Anyway, what faction shall we use then?

Franks vs Vandals

[Madoushi]

I always get wiped out by the Vandals when I try to play the Goths. :

I wouldn't mind playing as the Franks or Saxons...

[TheFlax]

I'm definitely pro-Vandal, especially with the idea of traveling to North Africa vis Spain in Horde mode.

[Ibn-Khaldun]

Lol, after I checked those two factions I like Vandals a lot more than before.

[Braden]

Never played Vandels in BI, didn't appeal to me so I might find it an interesting struggle to acclimatise. Willing to give it a go if its interesting though!

[Ibn-Khaldun]

It will be interesting when WRE manages to survive the first few turns. As far as I remember, WRE in full power is

So, it's Vandals then?

I'll write that "Do not settle before Africa" into the Rules as well then.

[Braden]

lol...quick test battle and I'm all at sea with Vandals! Horse archers!?! What blasphemy is this! No infantry thats any good either?? Oh dear, think I'm gonna kill lots of our own people (snigger)

[Madoushi]

I suppose since I'm not going to be responsible for settlement management, I don't mind playing Vandals.
However, I can see myself 'losing' a lot of battles by running away when my arrows run out. XD

[Ibn-Khaldun]

I think that the "Road to Africa" could be implemented as the first event?
This way the Rules can be overlooked(in most cases).

Edit: Though it's not that important but I had an idea that we change campaign map forts for the nomads to villages. They look a lot better.

[Ignoramus]

I'm definitely interested in a game with the Vandals.

[Ibn-Khaldun]

Civil War rules:

Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 

5. Civil War

1)Declaration of War
A Player must make a Declaration of War towards a specific Player in a public thread before they can attack any of that Player’s armies or settlements. Other Player's have 24 hours to join one side or the other. After that all Players who did not choose a side will be considered neutral. Players without avatars or with agents can not declare war upon another Player.

2)Ending a Civil War
A Civil War will end when all Players on one side are dead or all living Players on both sides publicly agree to a Peace Treaty. So long as it is limited to changes to the provinces, settlements, armies and retinue of the Players signing the Peace Treaty, it will be considered binding law. All terms of a Peace Treaty that go beyond these limits, particularly those that increase a Players influence or powers beyond those allowed by the rules, will only be binding if adopted by a two-thirds majority of the Council at the next normal session.

3)Civil Wars on the Campaign Map
While a Civil War is in progress, all players involved in the Civil War will lose their ability to make any moves on the campaign map. During the civil war the game will be frozen and the turn will not be advanced. The Civil War have 2 rounds on the campaign map: gather and move/attack. One round lasts 24 hours.

Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 

a)Gather - The player may gather units he owns that are located in the same province as his avatar, but which are not currently located in his avatar's army. All units specified in this manner will be teleported into the avatar's army. It's possible to gather units only during the first round. If Player enters a province he owns after the first round all units there will be considered reinforcements in battle but can not be added into the Players army.
b)Move/Attack - The player may move his avatar's army into any adjacent province. Player can not move his army into AI controlled province unless the faction is horde.

After the round ends, GM will implement all moves for players involved in the Civil War, utilizing the console. The orders will be executed simultaneously for all players. Movement will continue in this manner until two hostile player-controlled armies enter the same province. When this occurs, a PvP Battle will begin. All PvP Battles will be considered Meeting Engagements, in which neither side has a terrain advantage, unless one of the armies was Defending the province where the battle occurred. If this happens, the defending army will get a terrain advantage in the following manner: (1) If the province is owned by the Defender, the battle will be a siege assault of the settlement. (2) If the province is not owned by the Defender, the battle map will be chosen such that a terrain advantage, such as a high mountain, fort, or bridge is given to the Defender. The Umpire of the battle will determine the precise nature of the terrain advantage. There will be no unit recruitment during the Civil War.

4)PvP Battles
Whenever a PvP Battle occurs, if both players agree, the battle will be fought via multiplayer, with GM or anyone he chooses acting as umpire. The umpire will determine the map and the precise composition of the armies. If the battle is not fought via multiplayer then it will be fought either in a typical Throne Room tabletop battle style or as a abbreviated tabletop battle and will be umpired by GM or anyone he chooses. The umpire will determine all settings to be used in the battle, including the map and the precise composition of the armies. Regardless of the type of battle chosen, the umpire must attempt to have the battle replicate the in-game state of affairs to the best of his ability. Regardless of the type of battle chosen, the umpire will determine the results, including, but not limited to, units to be disbanded as casualties, avatars to be killed off as casualties, and changes in the control of provinces. Console commands may be used to implement the results.

TinCow, could you please name the thread: RTW:BI roleplaying game: Vandal Invasion

[Ibn-Khaldun]

So, is there any other questions/suggestions/ideas/etc?

If not then we have decide who get's what character. Beside the two starting FM's there are also spy, assassin and diplomat available.
Does anyone have objections me becoming the GM? I have done this job before(I was GM in WotB) and thus have some idea what I have to do.

[Madoushi]

I'm cool with Ibn-Khaldun GMing.
Also I'm pretty new to this, so I don't mind if I have to wait to get a character.

[Ibn-Khaldun]

So, the current Sign up list:
Ibn-Khaldun - Duva, diplomat
Braden - Oza, spy
TheFlax - Visimar, leader
Madoushi
Ignoramus
Elite Ferret?
Lord of Lent

Available characters(copy-paste from descr_strat.txt file):

character Visimar, named character, leader, age 37, , x 157, y 126
traits FactionLeader 1, Warlord 1 , Despoiler 3 , GoodTrader 3 , GoodTaxman 3 , Intelligent 2 , LogisticalSkill 2 , Pagan 1
ancillaries overseer, scout, torturer, merchant, jeweller, swordbearer

character Gondegusulus, named character, heir, age 18, , x 159, y 125
traits FactionHeir 1, GoodCommander 1 , Pagan 1
ancillaries musician, herbalist, master_hunter

character Duva, diplomat, age 37, , x 154, y 129
traits Pagan 1

character Oza, spy, age 27, , x 155, y 126
traits GoodSpy 2 , Pagan 1

character Marcuui, assassin, age 17, , x 158, y 124
traits GoodAssassin 1

. . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .
FM's who become of age soon:

character_record Maroboduus, male, command 0, influence 0, management 0, subterfuge 0, age 14, alive, never_a_leader
Will be available on turn 4

character_record Gildo, male, command 0, influence 0, management 0, subterfuge 0, age 12, alive, never_a_leader
Will be available on turn 6

Both are sons of the leader, Visimar.

. . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .
You can take one of the agents if you want or wait until those to FM's become available.
I'll take that diplomat.

Since we don't change anything in the game then there will be no mod for us. The first save will be posted soon.

If you want to add something into the rules or change something there then please post it now.

First event, "Road to Africa", will be posted in the Council thread once we have started the game.



Edit: The starting save: VI-363s-0

[TheFlax]

I'd take Maroboduus unless someone objects.

Rules look good Ibn, not to complicated and in line with what we are used to. I'm also good with you GMing and if you want help with something, I'm available.

[Braden]

Oza - I'll take the spy. Was going for a more active character but I think I'll have more fun with the spy! Muhahahhahah....

BTW - any mini-mods being used on this or is it Vanilla?

[Ibn-Khaldun]

No, it's just Vanilla. I thought mini mods will make things too complicated.

Also, if any of you don't want any of the current character then you can wait those 2 FM's. You can still take part of the Council Sessions and vote but can't become the Treasurer.

@TheFlax - If you want then you could help me with the history thread.

[TheFlax]

@TheFlax - If you want then you could help me with the history thread.

Sure, just tell me what to do.

[Ibn-Khaldun]

Nothing too difficult.

Each turn update the history by adding a link to battle reports and stories. Or when something interesting happens in Council give a link there. I think it's much easier to update the history when something have just happened rather than updating it during each council session.

I'm also going to keep the Library as simple as possible. Should be easier to read it and updating it this way.

Edit: Perhaps merging library and history into one thread? You updating the post with history and I'm doing the same with the library posts?

[TheFlax]

Sounds good, just wanted to make sure we were on the same page. I'll take care of it.

It might be a good idea to merge the two to avoid too many threads, then again it might make it a bit too "busy".

[Braden]

No, it's just Vanilla. I thought mini mods will make things too complicated.

Also, if any of you don't want any of the current character then you can wait those 2 FM's. You can still take part of the Council Sessions and vote but can't become the Treasurer.

@TheFlax - If you want then you could help me with the history thread.

Whilst fighting battles etc is more exciting I want to enter this PBeM with a more RP effort and I think Oza would be the best way to do this "Decius style". *wink*

[TheFlax]

I hadn't anticipated such a desire for agents.

I'll switch to Visimar then, unless someone really wants him. This way, we can start as soon as someone picks the FH.

[Ibn-Khaldun]

@TheFlax - At the moment one thread for both library and history is a better option. Later, when it does look like too busy we can just ask TC to brake them into two threads.

@Braden - Oza's trait description("This man has a taste for reading other people's correspondence.") made me laugh and I pictured him as a postman reading peoples mails.


One more thing to discuss: Should we play the game in a new forum or should we stay in this one?

I have no problem playing in this forum but if someone else wants to start a big game like LotR or KotF then things might get confusing(threads with the new game idea mixed with this ones threads). Perhaps TinCow could share his opinion on this matter.