How to win as Oda?

[ReluctantSamurai]

I can't recall any recent Oda 1580 campaign that I've played where they weren't allied. I've always had to face them both in Mino within the first year.......and every year thereafter until I kill one of them off

AFAIK, the appearance of the Dutch has no relationship to the Portuguese showing up. I could be wrong, tho'.....

I never wait for the Dutch anyways. I take the first Portuguese offer and run with it until I have a gun factory and muskets.

[Togakure]

IIRC, the Dutch appear like clockwork in 1561 in the SJ campaign, somewhere on the map in the west. Not sure about the added campaigns in WE. if you're playing an Eastern faction however, you won't likely see them until much later.

I did a quick search to see if anyone else noted the date the Dutch arrive and found these:

http://www.gamefaqs.com/pc/451526-sh...ion/faqs/21099

Search on 1561 within the document to find the statement.

This, I noted, is hosted on the Mizu server somewhere:

http://files.mizus.com/files/STW_WE/.../Preview2.html

So I think it's a safe bet to assume that the Dutch arrive in the game somewhere in 1561, though you might not see them until later depending on what clan you are playing and where your empire is on the map.

[DEB8]

IIRC, the Dutch appear like clockwork in 1561 in the SJ campaign, somewhere on the map in the west. Not sure about the added campaigns in WE. if you're playing an Eastern faction however, you won't likely see them until much later.

Currently playing ODA in the standard campaign. The year is now two or three years past 1574.

[DEB8]

I can't recall any recent Oda 1580 campaign that I've played where they weren't allied. I've always had to face them both in Mino within the first year.......and every year thereafter until I kill one of them off

Ah, I see the misunderstanding. I am not playing the Oda 1580 campaign. Just a standard campaign.

[DEB8]

AFAIK, the appearance of the Dutch has no relationship to the Portuguese showing up. I could be wrong, tho'.....

To clarify my question, as it may have been misunderstood :-

The Portuguese turned up a long long time ago in my current game and I accepted an offer to trade with them. However, I have not built a Trading post until recently ( approx. 1575 ). It is now ( approx.) 1577. Up to the date I built the Portuguese Trading post, the Dutch have never visted me ( or if the lack of messages is to be believed ), anyone else. Indeed, although I have captured or viewed ALL of the ports around the whole of Japan, I have not seen any Trading posts of any kind ( Portuguese or Dutch ). Also I have not witnessed any "teppo" units of any kind.

Therefore, it "appears" the Dutch will not arrive until :-

a) the Portuguese have arrived
b) only after a Portuguese Trading Post has been built.

Does anyone agree or disagree with my surmise? Historically, it seems
( to me ), to be correct.

N.B. If a Portuguese Trading post is built by someone before 1561 ( this is normally to be expected ), then the Dutch may well arrive at that date. In my game however, that was not the case.

[Togakure]

I disagree with your surmise. In a Sengoku Jidai campaign, I believe the Dutch arrive somewhere on the map in 1561, as I stated previously. You may not see them--ever--but that's when they arrive.

In your game I would guess it to be a fluke; you just never saw them. I've seen the Dutch arrive in 1561 exactly, again and again and again when playing Shimazu, Mori, Takeda, Imagawa, etc.. That, combined with documented observations of others on the 'net, convinces me beyond reasonable doubt.

But it doesn't matter ;). Enjoy the game.

[caravel]

The Dutch/Potuguese arrivals are indeed independent, hardcoded events. There is no relation between the two. They arrive at their fixed hardcoded dates and then start to travel the map dropping in at ports en route. This is why you will first meet their emissaries at different dates depending on which faction you are playing.

[DEB8]

The Dutch/Potuguese arrivals are indeed independent, hardcoded events. There is no relation between the two. They arrive at their fixed hardcoded dates and then start to travel the map dropping in at ports en route. This is why you will first meet their emissaries at different dates depending on which faction you are playing.

You state that the arrival dates are "Hard Coded". Fair enough. Is it possable for them not to visit you at all? I say that as it is now some 15 plus years since 1561 in my latest game, and I have not yet had a visit.
To date, I have never completed a game without a vist from the Dutch - but this one is fast going that way as I only have 3 provinces left to conquer. The only unusual factor in this game is that the very first Portuguese Trading Post ( anywhere by anyone ) was only built approx. 2 years ago.

A thought - the little ships that visit the Campaign map ports have red & yellow flags. Does anyone know if the Portuguese and the Dutch are represented by the same or different "ships". If the latter, does anyone know the different flag colours used.

[A Nerd]

If the latter, does anyone know the different flag colours used.

I don't know. I've never really noticed. I would guess the flags are purely decorative and not historic or representaive of the dutch or portuguese. I don't know what either flag looked like at the time so don't quote me on that.

[DEB8]

I have a second STW ( 1.12 version ) game, running concurrently with my previously refered to STW(WE) game. In both I am playing ODA ( full S.J. Campaign ). I have just had what I believe is the first ( I may be wrong ), video and message re Dutch Traders. The year is 1593 and the visit was at Hizen province. Note this was not an Emissary visit, just "first" contact.