How to win as Oda?

**caravel** · 05-19-2010, 10:05

The Dutch/Potuguese arrivals are indeed independent, hardcoded events. There is no relation between the two. They arrive at their fixed hardcoded dates and then start to travel the map dropping in at ports en route. This is why you will first meet their emissaries at different dates depending on which faction you are playing.

**DEB8** · 05-26-2010, 00:12

Originally Posted by Asai Nagamasa

The Dutch/Potuguese arrivals are indeed independent, hardcoded events. There is no relation between the two. They arrive at their fixed hardcoded dates and then start to travel the map dropping in at ports en route. This is why you will first meet their emissaries at different dates depending on which faction you are playing.

You state that the arrival dates are "Hard Coded". Fair enough. Is it possable for them not to visit you at all? I say that as it is now some 15 plus years since 1561 in my latest game, and I have not yet had a visit.
To date, I have never completed a game without a vist from the Dutch - but this one is fast going that way as I only have 3 provinces left to conquer. The only unusual factor in this game is that the very first Portuguese Trading Post ( anywhere by anyone ) was only built approx. 2 years ago.

A thought - the little ships that visit the Campaign map ports have red & yellow flags. Does anyone know if the Portuguese and the Dutch are represented by the same or different "ships". If the latter, does anyone know the different flag colours used.

**A Nerd** · 05-26-2010, 00:57

If the latter, does anyone know the different flag colours used.

I don't know. I've never really noticed. I would guess the flags are purely decorative and not historic or representaive of the dutch or portuguese. I don't know what either flag looked like at the time so don't quote me on that.

**DEB8** · 05-28-2010, 22:27

I have a second STW ( 1.12 version ) game, running concurrently with my previously refered to STW(WE) game. In both I am playing ODA ( full S.J. Campaign ). I have just had what I believe is the first ( I may be wrong ), video and message re Dutch Traders. The year is 1593 and the visit was at Hizen province. Note this was not an Emissary visit, just "first" contact.

**ReluctantSamurai** · 05-30-2010, 15:12

As Asai has stated, the dates are hardcoded. You, as the player may not necessarily get an offer at that prescribed date, but they are showing up elsewhere, to be sure. This is why I never wait for them, anymore. You can have muskets (not just the arquebus) long before any other clan by accepting the first Portuguese offer and running with it. If your concern is for rebelliousness, then plan ahead and have shinobi ready to placate the populace. If you prefer having monks (although you can have both monks and guns) then I suppose you can wait for the Dutch.

I've stop using monks a long while back, except if I capture Kii or Kaga with fully developed dojo's, or if I'm playing Mori. The added benefit of having both cathedral and trading post income far outweighs the impact of monks, IMHO. I've had several campaigns where I wouldn't have survived without those two sources of income.

Just my 2koku on the matter;)

**DEB8** · 06-27-2010, 20:09

Originally Posted by ReluctantSamurai

As Asai has stated, the dates are hardcoded. You, as the player may not necessarily get an offer at that prescribed date, but they are showing up elsewhere, to be sure. This is why I never wait for them, anymore.

I recently finished my Oda (SJ) game (STW (WE) 1.02), with ALL provinces captured by Autumn 1579.

I have not had any Dutch Emmisary's visit me or seen a single Dutch ship visit ANYWHERE. Also, not one province that was captured had either a Dutch OR a Portuguese Trading Post in it and neither did any Watchtower or Border Fort spot one in an adjacent province before capture. Further, not one enemy army had a Teppo unit in it.

It would appear (IMHO) that the "Hard Code" has a percentage attached. The odds of failing a "die roll" for so long after 1561 (approx. 68 turns) may be low, but are apparently not impossable.

You can have muskets (not just the arquebus) long before any other clan by accepting the first Portuguese offer and running with it. If your concern is for rebelliousness, then plan ahead and have shinobi ready to placate the populace. If you prefer having monks (although you can have both monks and guns) then I suppose you can wait for the Dutch.

I have not built a Portuguese TP in any of my previous games, and only finally built one in the latter (approx.) 2/3 years of this last game. I prefer to await the Dutch. I hate those Catholics and I like using Ninja's on any Priests! I have never had a rebellion as I keep the Loyalty levels high - I never Tax over the normal rate and cut the Tax level if any province goes below 120% in the middle/ end game. Sometimes a bad or worse harvest will leave me without funds, but that's life. In truth, I should really save some funds when I get a good harvest or better, but there's always something I need to buy!

**ReluctantSamurai** · 06-28-2010, 01:42

I prefer to await the Dutch. I hate those Catholics and I like using Ninja's on any Priests!

I couldn't care any less about the religious preference of the gaijin. They bring me guns and an offer to trade. Both give me an edge over my opponents. If that edge gets me to the Shogunate before anyone else, then I will take it. By taking the Portuguese offer, I have muskets at least 10 years before anyone else.

Oda would have your head on a pike to hear such talk!

Just kidding, of course

Sometimes a bad or worse harvest will leave me without funds, but that's life.

Maybe so, but string 5 or 6, or even 7 (I had 7 on one occasion) consecutive poor harvests and you will not even have enough koku for replacements, let alone for new units or construction. I prefer the certainty of getting 200 koku from each trading post, and 200 from each church when I have a cathedral.